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Faster Than Normal - The ADHD Podcast

Having ADD or ADHD is a gift, not a curse. Hear from people all around the globe, from every walk of life, in every profession, from Rock Stars to CEOs, from Teachers to Politicians, who have learned how to unlock the gifts of their ADD and ADHD diagnosis, and use it to their personal and professional advantage, to build businesses, become millionaires, or simply better their lives.
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Apr 12, 2023

Having ADD or ADHD is a gift, not a curse. Hear from people all around the globe, from every walk of life, in every profession, from Rock Stars to CEOs, from Teachers to Politicians, who have learned how to unlock the gifts of their ADD and ADHD diagnosis, and use it to their personal and professional advantage, to build businesses, become millionaires, or simply better their lives.    

Hey guys, Peter Shankman the host of Faster Than Normal. I wanna talk for a second about the Skylight Calendar, the wonderful sponsors of this episode and one of the things that keeps myself and my daughter on track. Skylight sits on your wall and tells you what you have to do today; what chores your child has to do today. It's basically a family calendar all-in-one. You can color code. It is amazing for people with ADHD. I am truly in love with this thing. We look at it every single day. It tells us the weather. It tells us what's on our calendar. It tells us what chores are left to do. Oh, time to feed the dog! - Mark it off on the calendar. My daughter can check the box when she's done and the chore disappears. It is one of the best things we've ever had. You can get yours with a discount using code: PeterShankman for 10% off, up to 30 bucks off. You’re gonna love this Skylight calendar.  And you are gonna love.. I mean, truly it is amazing for people with ADHD or basically anyone who wants to keep track of their schedule. It sits on the wall, added bonus. You can throw your own photos onto it as a screen saver- on your wall! So now your wall has pictures. That's cool. Check it out. I'll put the link in the show notes. https://www.skylightframe.com Discount Code:  PeterShankman for 10% off, up to 30 bucks off.

In her own words: Hello, I'm Kelsey! I am in my early 30's, originally from Michigan, and got diagnosed with ADHD when I was 26.  I graduated with a degree in Psychology and Public Relations, and have worked in several different roles in sales, customer service, operations, and marketing in the computer software industry within the last decade.  Shortly after being diagnosed, I sold my house, furniture, and all my belongings to pursue a nomadic lifestyle.  From the years of 2017-2020 I participated in an organization called WWOF, where I worked on several different organic farms across the US in exchange for room and board.  During this time, I worked remotely, tried stand up comedy, adventured, and brainstormed on how I could make money on my own terms.  In 2020, I moved to Nashville and in 2023 relocated back to Michigan.  I have a passion for fitness, international traveling, learning, and meeting other neurodivergent people. Today we learn why Kelsey decided to try out the nomadic lifestyle and if it is perhaps a choice for you also, enjoy!

00:40 - Thank you so much for listening and for subscribing!

02:06 - Welcome and introducing Kelsey!

03:00 - What made you decide to go Nomad; the ADHD diagnosis?

04:20 - On WWOOF-ing ref: https://wwoof.net/destinations/

05:00 - On actually making the commitment and doing it. Yeah…how did you do that?

06:20 - On leveraging the prep-work and risk taking

07:00 - On settling-in and how she got into WWOOF-ing

08:27 - Did you ADHD play a big/small role in your being able to learn something new, and in a hurry?

09:45 - What was in a typical day that got you to that euphoric high?

10:00 - A day in the life on the farm

11:05 - On re-claiming perspective and finding a passionate work ethic once again

13:38 - Would you recommend this lifestyle for other people with ADHD; maybe to change things up even? If so then why?

16:30 - What are you doing now?

Another big shout out to Skylight calendar!

18:00 - We are thrilled that you are here!  ADHD and all forms of neurodiversity are gifts, not curses. And by the way, if you haven't picked up The Boy with the Faster Brain yet, it is on Amazon and it is a number one bestseller in all categories. So check it out. Click HERE or via https://amzn.to/3FcAKkI

My link tree is here if you’re looking for something specific. https://linktr.ee/petershankman

18:41 - Faster Than Normal Podcast info & credits.

Guys, as always thanks so much for subscribing! Faster Than Normal is for YOU! We want to know what you’d like to hear! Do you have a cool friend with a great story? We’d love to learn about, and from them. I'm www.petershankman.com and you can reach out anytime via email at peter@shankman.com or @petershankman on all of the socials. You can also find us at @FasterNormal on all of the socials. It really helps when you drop us a review on iTunes and of course, subscribe to the podcast if you haven’t already! As you know, the more reviews we get, the more people we can reach. Help us to show the world that ADHD is a gift, not a curse! 

TRANSCRIPT via Descript and then corrected.. mostly somewhat: 

[00:00:40] Peter: Hey everyone, what's up? My name is Peter Shankman. I'm the host of the Faster Than Normal podcast, and I wanna give a big shout out to Skylight for sponsoring this episode again, Skylight Calendar, guys, I told you about this thing before. I love it. It sits in my kitchen wall and tells my daughter exactly what she has to do. It tells her what she has to bring to school. It tells her what she can leave home. It tells her what chores have to be done. I don't have to yell at her anymore. She doesn't complain. We can throw photos on there of family, of friends, of my parents, of her, of of her mom's parents, everyone. She sees everything. She can touch screen it when she's done. She loves going over feeding the dog and then touch screening to say that she's fed the dog and the chore disappears. They're color coded, which is great for people like me who have ADHD and people like you. Check out Skylight. It is a phenomenal, phenomenal calendar. It'll make your life so much easier and simpler,. You'll have so much less to complain about. Skylightframe.com . Use code Peter Shankman and get up to 30 bucks off your first offer. And I wanna thank them again for sponsoring the podcast. The Skylight calendar is incredible. Skylight frame.com. Check it out. https://www.skylightframe.com Discount Code:  PeterShankman 

 

[00:00:40] Peter: Hey guys. Peter Shankman. Welcome to that episode of Faster Than Normal. I am your host as I have been going on, I don't know, six years or something ridiculous like that. It is lovely to have you here. We are having a good time. We're gonna have a good time today. We're gonna talk to a wonderful young woman named Kelsey, but before we do, I wanna give a big shout out to Skylight Calendar. Makes the skylight frame. They now have the skylight calendar, which let me tell you, has changed my life with my daughter. She doesn't argue with me over what chores to do anymore because they're literally on a digital calendar on our wall, in our kitchen table area place. Basically, she goes in, she pours her Honeynut Cheerios. She looks up at the calendar and says, oh, okay, today I have chorus and have to bring my coral music and I have to feed the dog and I have to do all this stuff. And as she does it, she clicks the checkbox on the touchscreen and she checks it off. She loves doing that. It's color coded for people like me who have ADHD. It is the easiest thing in the world. You can upload all your photos to it as well. So when you're not using the calendar, it shows cool photos. Remind you of places you've been in, things you've done. You can get up to 30 bucks off with the code: PeterShankman at skylightframe.com. Huge, huge fan of this calendar. It has made my life a lot easier, and we want to thank them for hosting or for, for sponsoring the hosting of this podcast. As always, it is wonderful to have such wonderful, wonderful, fascinating, and brilliant sponsors such as Skylight Frame. Check out the frame, check up the calendar. You're really, really gonna like it. Use code Peter Shankman. For 30 bucks up to 30 bucks off and lemme know what you think. So with that said, 

[00:02:06] Peter: I wanna welcome Kelsey. Kelsey, I'm gonna screw up your last name again. Sterkenburg. Is that right? Yes. Yep. All right. Got it. Kelsey is in her early thirties, she's originally from Michigan. She got diagnosed with ADHD when she was 26. She graduated from the, with a degree in psychology and public relations, and worked in several she worked in several different roles in sales, customer service, operations, and marketing, blah, blah, blah. But after she got diagnosed, she decided to sell her house and furniture and all her belongings and pursuing nomadic lifestyle from the years of 17, 2017, 2020. She participated in an organization called WWOF, or. Which I like, where she worked on several different organic farms across the United States in exchange room and board. During this time, she worked remotely. She tried standup comedy. She adventured, she brainstormed how she could make money on her own terms. In 2020, she moved to Nashville and 2023 back to Michigan. She loves fitness, international traveling, learning, and meeting other neurodivergent people. Kelsey, welcome to Faster Than Normal. 

[00:02:59] Kelsey: Thank you so much. Thanks for having. 

[00:03:01] Peter: My pleasure. So you have an interesting life when you decided, Hey, I'm ad, was it because you decided, because you had ADHD that you decided you were gonna go nomad or was there something else involved?

[00:03:11] Kelsey: You know, it was, um, it was mostly the ADHD. It was just this kind of light bulb came outta my head and it made sense at the time of my life. Um, I was a little bored with how I was living. I, I was trying to kind of fit in and mask do what everyone else was doing around me. Um, kind of just live the Midwest life and it felt very hard for me. Um, I felt very stable. I felt very safe, but I didn't feel like I was doing what I really wanted to do. Um, and it's hard, you know, when you first get diagnosed it makes so much sense. It's just you finally have, you can see color. Yeah. After living in black and white for so long. So for me, I just thought, I wanna travel, I wanna go see things, I wanna go do things. And of course I, you know, I knew I had to work and I knew I had to have everything, kind of my ducks in a row. But I did feel confident in myself for the first time in my life. I felt like I can do this! You know, I wanna go move somewhere different, somewhere new, and I've always been pretty adaptable. So I kind of just looked online and I, um, I had heard a lot of people talk about, um, woofing is what it's called. And it actually is, um, an organization that allows you to, um, like you mentioned, live on organic farms and, um, move around the country and, um, you're not necessarily making money, but you're not losing money. So I saw that as an opportunity to grow and discover my love for working again. I had gotten a little bit stagnant in that department. Um, I had kind of lost that passion because I was doing things I didn't truly have a passion for. Um, so I just decided to go for it. 

[00:04:52] Peter: Lemme interrupt you up for a second. Let's talk about that. Cuz the concept of sort of selling all your crap and just going out, working on an organic farm or doing anything like that. You know, a lot of people talk about it, oh, we should do this or do that, but it's scary as hell to actually make. Sleep and do it is scary as hell. So how did you swallow that fear and turn that into action? Because fear usually negates action when you're nervous, you usually, you, you're paralyzed by fear, yet you just, some somehow swallowed your fear and did it. What was it that made you do that? 

[00:05:19] Kelsey: I did. You know, I put together, I've always been, I've found that when I'm very motivated towards a goal, I know it's gonna happen and I know I'm going to get there and it, it, I may seem crazy to the outside world, but to me, It makes sense and it's just, I'm laser focused, right? My hyper-focus was on, so I knew I wanted to sell my house. Um, I just knew that wasn't for me. 

[00:05:42] Peter: So you owned the house in that point? 

[00:05:44] Kelsey: I did, yeah. Wow. I did and I tried everything. I tried to really just create a lot of stability where I was and. Like I said, follow the norm and do what everyone else was doing. And I had done every single, I felt like I was checking off, you know, things on a list, and it felt really, um, I just felt kind of uncomfortable with it, which is strange because usually at that point in life, you, uh, feel steady and you feel comfortable. But for me, I wanted to be outside my comfort zone a little bit. So I felt like I had a little bit of a nest egg once the, the house went through. Um, and I thought to myself, I'm smart, I'm capable. I can do this, you know, and as long as I'm frugal and, um, I'm careful, I think that it will all work out because I had been playing it safe for so long at that point that. I wanted to take a risk. I wanted to go. So it was, uh, a little bit of a leap of faith, but I also had that confidence. I just knew that I was gonna be okay and I was excited. So I kind of let that draw me into, um, making that decision. Um, but I went and, um, I was excited and, um, I ended up just kind of being thrown into. Um, I went to California actually first in San Diego and, um, found a place to live pretty quickly. Um, and, you know, started the job hunts. And while I was doing that, I started to look at, um, WWOOFing because I had actually. Um, met one, I met a friend that was doing, um, woofing in Arizona and he actually, um, kind of introduced me to it. I had never heard of it before. I always, uh, you know, I just assumed that was something that, you know, maybe rich kids would do, but it was really for anyone. Um, and I thought to myself, I don't really wanna stay only in San Diego. Um, I had stayed there for a little bit. I wanted to see more. I wanted to do more. So I thought, what can I do that will allow me to. See more of this country and move around a little bit, but not, um, you know, not have to start over each time with housing and that kind of thing. So I saw, um, woofing as an opportunity to be out in nature. Um, Learned to work hard. I worked on farms, I worked with animals. Um, I helped rebuild fences. Um, and just really worked with some really interesting people. Um, and you're, you know, you're meeting people from all walks of life at the same time because there's other volunteers, um, at each site that you choose.

[00:08:26] Peter: Tell me about your adhd. How do you think your ADHD played into you're being able to be on a farm and do something incre entirely new. Right. And, and, and, and learn something basically on the fly with your feet in the fire. 

[00:08:37] Kelsey: Yeah. Um, I think, um, like most ADHD people, I think, um, we're very spontaneous. We're very excited to learn. Um, when we're interested in a subject, it's, you know, there that hyper focus comes on. Um, so for me, I had always been. Um, aware of just my adventurous spirit, you know, being spontaneous and, um, interested in a lot of different things. So I, I feel the most sharp when I'm moving. When I'm, um, talking fast. I'm moving fast. I'm meeting other people. I'm, you know, there's novelty around me, so, Um, those things excite me. And, um, I think that because I had kind of been bogged down by, you know, sitting in a chair for eight hours a day and trying to, you know, living that monotonous life for a while that I was, I just, it was polar opposite of that. It was just so much dopamine. Um, and I wasn't medicated either, so it was just this, um, I guess you could call it like a euphoric high. 

[00:09:44] Peter: Tell us about it. But I was, what, what was the typical day that got you to that euphoric high? 

[00:09:48] Kelsey: Um, what was it that got me there? 

[00:09:51] Peter: No, tell us, tell us about a typical day there. Cause you said it was euphoric high, so what were you doing? What was a typical day like for you? 

[00:09:57] Kelsey: Absolutely. So what I would do is I would, um, wake up and, um, you could actually pick what kind of work you wanted to do. So, um, wake up, they actually, they feed you. They give you kind of room and board. It's, it's very nomadic, like I said. So it's, um, you know, it's not for prim and proper. It's, you know, you're, you're dirty and you're not. It's not a hotel, but you're living, well, you're living on someone's property and you're, you're helping, you're giving back to a really good cause and, um, and you're treated very well. So I would wake up, um, have breakfast and um, you know, you kind of just, Get started, you've just kind of developed this routine and you're told, okay, you know, you're in charge of the horses today or you know, the donkeys or you know, go out in the field and start um, you know, doing kind of the farm chores. And they of course had walked me through how to do that every single day. And, um, I specifically wanted to work with animals cause that is one of my biggest passions. So I would go out and kind of complete all the farm duties, and that would take a couple hours. Um, it wasn't easy, I will say, but it didn't feel What kinda,

[00:11:02] Peter: when you say farm, when you say farm duties, what were you doing?

[00:11:05] Kelsey: Yeah, I was, um, kind of like bailing the hay in, um, feeding all the animals and, um, I actually was milking the cows as well. Wow. Um, and doing a lot of different things just, um, to kind of keep all the operations up and running. This was a, I had worked on a couple different farms, um, up in the PNW area. Um, Northern California and um, also one in Montana as well in the, the Bozeman area. So each farm was different. So you do have to really just adjust to, um, the owners and their expectations, what they would like you to do. Um, but it was like a little bit of gardening as well. There was a little bit of, um, you know, learning how to manage a garden. Um, and also a lot of the food prep, you know, kind of taking in the eggs and the milk and kind of doing a little bit of food prep in the kitchen. So it kept me busy, as you can imagine. Sure, yeah. Um, a six hour shift would go by like a snap of the fingers. And I could not remember the last time I felt so, um, so busy and, um, productive and I felt like I was back in college again where I'm learning new things and you know, I'm interacting and I'm away from my phone for, you know, that period of time. And I'm just really, really happy. I feel like this is a good fit for me and this is what I need. Um, so I kind of felt like I had become a drone before that. Um, just kind of masking and blending in and trying to do what was expected of me. And then I finally chose to do something that I thought would help me grow. Um, that's a little bit unconventional, but it worked and it did really help me establish a hard work ethic again. Um, which in turn helped me kind of decide what I wanted to do next, um, with work. So, um, but it did definitely teach me that I prefer to work by myself. Um, I, I like to be independent. I like to, um, I prefer the more the self-employment route I guess you could say. So I kind of, uh, discovered my entrepreneurial spirit during that time and, um, learned a lot though. And I did that for, um, about a year and, um, did a little bit of traveling in between there. 

[00:13:25] Peter: That's very, very cool. 

[00:13:26] Kelsey: Tell us as well, so very risky. 

[00:13:31] Peter: Tell us, uh, I guess this is my, my only my, my last question to you, because this is fascinating to me. What. You re would you recommend this lifestyle for a year or two years or three years for other people with h adhd? Because it seems to be for people who are stuck and, and in this sort of A D H D, um, uh, spinning their wheels type mentality, which we've all been in from time to time. And there are some people who are just looking for, okay, maybe this is a way to break everything and, and change everything up. Would you recommend it? 

[00:13:59] Kelsey: I would, and I'll tell you why, and I know a lot of people can relate to this. I had a lot of people trying to stop me from doing this. They said, you know, you're gonna fall on your face. You're not gonna make it. Um, you don't have enough money, you don't have enough experience with life. You know, all these things. And um, and I had always found that the more people told me not to do something, the more motivated I was to do it. Um, and so I stopped kind of sharing. I stopped oversharing and I started to really just quiet the noise around me, um, and stopped comparing myself to, you know, other people. Um, and that's hard to do in your twenties, as you can imagine. It gets easier as the years go by, but, um, I thought to myself, you know, this is smart. This is a way that I'm not really losing any money. I'm not really. Um, the biggest, you know, fear I guess is just a couple months off of a real corporate job, you know, but at the same time, with everything we have in our remote world today, digital marketing, you know, you can start your own business online. There's a, there's a ton of ways to be creative and make money, and I thought.. I don't think this is gonna be hurting me. I think this will help me grow. This will reshape my perspective of life. Um, kind of bring back that childhood spirit, you know, that childhood energy and, um, get me excited about life again. And not learning the same thing in an office day after day. Um, I just, I also really wanted to rediscover my work ethic. I wanted to feel like I was really, really earning my time and my money. Um, and, you know, feel fulfilled at the end of the day. And I did. I feel like it really helped me reset, um, and put me back on the path that I was meant to be on. So it changed my life, it really did. And I know I, um, I know others have had much, you know, greater experiences with moving to different countries or traveling. but.. it definitely gave me that travel bug and that, um, thirst for life. And, um, I recognized that there were other neurodivergent people that were in that environment and I didn't feel alone and I felt, wow, there are other people like me that have struggled and just had to do something that was a little bit crazy to uh, maybe find themselves and discover where they're meant to be. Um, so I 

[00:16:29] Peter: What are you doing now? 

[00:16:30] Kelsey: Um, so now I am, um, kind of, I'm also still working remotely in a, a software, um, company that does analytics for, um, LMS systems. So we're kind of tracking the performance analytics for instructional designers that are creating different courses over different LMS systems. So I'm kind of working as more of a, I guess you could call me a jack of all trades, a customer success kind of manager slash business sales representative slash operations manager. So I'm, I'm in a role right now that is a really good fit. Um, it really does let me wear all the hats I like to wear. Um, and it also lets me thrive because I'm, um, working independently and, um, I don't really have anyone overseeing anything I'm doing. It's just, I'm just kind of given the reins to run with it. 

[00:17:25] Peter: That's awesome. So, very cool. Kelsey, how can people find you if they wanna learn more? They, I have a feeling this might change in lives. How can people find you? 

[00:17:32] Kelsey: Yeah, they can actually, um, find me on, um, LinkedIn. Um, I'm pretty active on LinkedIn, just Kelsey Sterkenberg um, or they could find me on. I have Instagram, I have Facebook, um, all those tools and my name is pretty, um, un uncommon. Yeah, true. So I think, uh, it won't be too hard to track me down, but yeah, and I'd be happy to, you know, provide my contact information if needed.

[00:17:58] Peter: Very cool guys. Kelsey, thank you so much for taking the time. Really appreciate it. Kelsey. This is a really interesting interview. I found myself really fascinated by this. Thank you so much, Peter. Awesome guys. Listen to Faster Than Normal. We want to hear what you want to hear. Let us know what you think. Don't forget, uh, the Boy with a Faster Brain is still number one. It's burning up the charts. Grab your copy, buy a copy and donate it to a library. They're shutting down libraries in this country. Man. This is. Keep libraries alive, buy a copy and donate it to a library. And if you do that, shoot me an email, let me know you did and I'll send you something fun. But either way, keep listening. We'll have another episode next week. ADHD is a gift, not a curse, as is all neurodiversity. We love that you guys are here and we're greatly thankful that you tune in every week. Stay safe, stay well. We'll talk to you soon.

Credits: You've been listening to the Faster Than Normal podcast. We're available on iTunes, Stitcher and Google play and of course at www.FasterThanNormal.com I'm your host, Peter Shankman and you can find me at shankman.com and @petershankman on all of the socials. If you like what you've heard, why not head over to your favorite podcast platform of choice and leave us a review, come more people who leave positive reviews, the more the podcast has shown, and the more people we can help understand that ADHD is a gift, not a curse. Opening and closing themes were composed and produced by Steven Byrom who also produces this podcast, and the opening introduction was recorded by Bernie Wagenblast. Thank you so much for listening. We'll see you next week! 

 

Apr 5, 2023

Having ADD or ADHD is a gift, not a curse. Hear from people all around the globe, from every walk of life, in every profession, from Rock Stars to CEOs, from Teachers to Politicians, who have learned how to unlock the gifts of their ADD and ADHD diagnosis, and use it to their personal and professional advantage, to build businesses, become millionaires, or simply better their lives.

Hey guys, Peter Shankman the host of Faster Than Normal. I wanna talk for a second about the Skylight Calendar, the wonderful sponsors of this episode and one of the things that keeps myself and my daughter on track. Skylight sits on your wall and tells you what you have to do today; what chores your child has to do today. It's basically a family calendar all-in-one. You can color code. It is amazing for people with ADHD. I am truly in love with this thing. We look at it every single day. It tells us the weather. It tells us what's on our calendar. It tells us what chores are left to do. Oh, time to feed the dog! - Mark it off on the calendar. My daughter can check the box when she's done and the chore disappears. It is one of the best things we've ever had. You can get yours with a discount using code: PeterShankman for 10% off, up to 30 bucks off. You’re gonna love this Skylight calendar.  And you are gonna love.. I mean, truly it is amazing for people with ADHD or basically anyone who wants to keep track of their schedule. It sits on the wall, added bonus. You can throw your own photos onto it as a screen saver- on your wall! So now your wall has pictures. That's cool. Check it out. I'll put the link in the show notes. https://www.skylightframe.com Discount Code:  PeterShankman for 10% off, up to 30 bucks off.

--

Entrepreneur, social media expert, influencer and now CEO of the hottest events in NYC, Liv Schreiber has a vision for changing how New Yorkers meet and build relationships and social communities. In the past, it was intros from friends, families, gym workout buddies or boring dating apps. Today, New Yorkers are growingly turning to the 26 year old Schreiber who's “Hot and Social” events are selling out in 36 seconds. Hot and Social has developed an event strategy where the attendees not only have an opportunity to meet and speak with their peers but an invitation to become friends in a world that many times seems so uninviting and cold. The events have continued to gain traction, and the waitlist for Liv comes from a family of entrepreneurs which you frequently will see in her content. The tagline of her company is "99% of the attendees show up alone, 100% leave as friends". This unique concept has led to some of the largest restaurant and club companies in NYC to reach out with the hope of securing a Hot and Social event for some of the most well known venues in the City. Schreiber is overwhelmed with the support and can't wait to bring her concept to other cities.  Schreiber has already worked with brands such as Anheuser-Busch, Moxy, REVOLVE and Rumble. Her TikTok and Instagram accounts have been blowing up- giving Schreiber the ability to package her social, with Hot and Social's accounts and event sponsorship. The Digital Renegades CEO Evan Morgenstein sees Schreiber as a perfect new client, "Myself, coming from Rockland County and having my family in the event promotion business most of my childhood, I see Liv as a refreshing new take on bringing people, brands and unique experiences together. Liv is so smart, she lives this lifestyle- so it's authentic and she has her finger on the pulse of the 22-35 year old market in NYC and beyond. We are going to make this an international brand and I can't wait!"

00:40 - Thank you so much for listening and for subscribing!

01:44 - Welcome and introducing Liv Schreiber!

02:17 - On the importance of not feeling alone in a classroom setting.

03:34 - We don't need a lot of friends, but we need a few good ones. Would you agree with that?

04:20 - Tell me what your story is, how you came up with this idea. What's your background?

05:00 - Ref: Brand Caffeine

06:24 - What pushed you to decide to do something for friendship; as opposed to like dating, relationships, or the usual fare?

08:40 - Tell us about the people who go to & enjoy these events? To me it sounds like a root canal?

09:43 - What do people talk about?

11:00 - Why do you think we as adults sort of forget how to make friends?

12:26 - How do people find out more about you Liv? Web:  https://www.livschreiber.com

Socials: @livschreiber on INSTA and TikTok  Then.. @hotandsocial on INSTA and Liv’s Styling account is @styledbylivschreiber in INSTA & TikTok

12:25 - Can more friendships benefit everyone with ADD or ADHD and Neurodiverse?

13:07 - Thank you for your work here Peter! 

13:18 - Thank you Liv!

13:20 - Another big shout out to Skylight calendar!

13:24 - We are thrilled that you are here!  ADHD and all forms of neurodiversity are gifts, not curses. And by the way, if you haven't picked up The Boy with the Faster Brain yet, it is on Amazon and it is a number one bestseller in all categories. So check it out. Click HERE or via https://amzn.to/3FcAKkI

My link tree is here if you’re looking for something specific. https://linktr.ee/petershankman

14:06 - Faster Than Normal Podcast info & credits.

Guys, as always thanks so much for subscribing! Faster Than Normal is for YOU! We want to know what you’d like to hear! Do you have a cool friend with a great story? We’d love to learn about, and from them. I'm www.petershankman.com and you can reach out anytime via email at peter@shankman.com or @petershankman on all of the socials. You can also find us at @FasterNormal on all of the socials. It really helps when you drop us a review on iTunes and of course, subscribe to the podcast if you haven’t already! As you know, the more reviews we get, the more people we can reach. Help us to show the world that ADHD is a gift, not a curse! 

TRANSCRIPT via Descript and then corrected.. mostly somewhat: 

[00:00:40] Peter: Hey everyone, what's up? My name is Peter Shankman. I'm the host of the Faster Than Normal podcast, and I wanna give a big shout out to Skylight for sponsoring this episode again, Skylight Calendar, guys, I told you about this thing before. I love it. It sits in my kitchen wall and tells my daughter exactly what she has to do. It tells her what she has to bring to school. It tells her what she can leave home. It tells her what chores have to be done. I don't have to yell at her anymore. She doesn't complain. We can throw photos on there of family, of friends, of my parents, of her, of of her mom's parents, everyone. She sees everything. She can touch screen it when she's done. She loves going over feeding the dog and then touch screening to say that she's fed the dog and the chore disappears. They're color coded, which is great for people like me who have ADHD and people like you. Check out Skylight. It is a phenomenal, phenomenal calendar. It'll make your life so much easier and simpler,. You'll have so much less to complain about. Skylightframe.com . Use code Peter Shankman and get up to 30 bucks off your first offer. And I wanna thank them again for sponsoring the podcast. The Skylight calendar is incredible. Skylight frame.com. Check it out. https://www.skylightframe.com Discount Code:  PeterShankman 

 

 

Okay guys, another episode of Faster Than Normal! I am thrilled that you're here! About two or three months ago. I had coffee with the one we're about to talk today. Her name is Liv Schreiber and Liv calls herself, the one who's making friendship cool again, and it's really interesting. She runs a very cool company where she basically throws parties to let people make friends, and we're talking about that, but we're also talking a bigger picture about friendships. So Liv, welcome to Faster Than Normal- so good to have you!

[00:02:11] Liv: Hey Peter, you're the best. So good to finally get to be talking to you here. This is awesome! 

[00:02:17] Peter: Now I'm glad to have you. I wanted to do this for a while. It's, um, you know, it's interesting, the, the, I was, I was talking last week to a elementary school. I was reading them the new book, the Boy with the Faster Brain, and everyone was, you know, it was funny to watch the kids, right? Because 30 kids in the classroom and they bun Bud buddy up with their friends to walk to the auditorium where we were doing the speech that's, I was following them, you know, talking to the teacher and I look over and all the kids have somehow buddied up with another kid and they're all holding hands and there's one who, I guess, I guess someone was absent and didn't have anyone to hold hands with and he's just sort of like walking behind everyone. And he looked a little sad. My daughter was with me cuz she had the week off from school and she walked up, she grabbed the kid's hand. Right. And my daughter's nine. This kid I think was like five or six or whatever. And, and you immediately saw the change in the kid. The kid was like, he went from like, we have no one to talk to. Like, oh, someone's holding my hand. Yeah. And he was all happy and everything. Uhhuh. It really is amazing. We don't, you know, we joke, I joke a lot that I hate people. Right. I don't think we talk enough about how valued and how important friendships are, not relationships, not dating, not marriage like crap, but the concept of friendships, right? We don't need a lot of friends, but we need a few good ones. Would you agree with that? 

[00:03:29] Liv: Absolutely. And when you think about it this way, like you're, you know, that kid grows up and he moves to New York City and he doesn't know anyone and he is starting a new job and he doesn't have anyone to talk to. Like, that's debilitating and, and just one person can make a huge difference in his life. So, you know, I was that kid. I moved to New York and I knew no one, and I was jealous of people in the street who had plans. And Peter, I'm not weird, you know. I have friends, but for some reason in your twenties and your thirties, it's so hard to make those adult friendships that really can make a huge difference. So, um, I noticed that and just kind of got sick of having this, this issue and figured other people might as well. 

[00:04:12] Peter: Tell me for, okay, so let's go back. Tell me what you do. Tell me your story. Um, you're not, you have never been diagnosed ADHD but you're pretty sure you have it. I met you, I knew in about three seconds you did. Tell me what your story is, how you came up with this idea. What's your background? Tell us the whole thing. 

[00:04:26] Liv: Yeah, absolutely. 

[00:04:27] Peter: As far as my audience is gonna know, looking at your photo, they just say, oh, she's six foot. Of course she goes to all the clubs. Of course she has tons of friends. I'm right.

[00:04:34] Liv: I'm actually five four. I'm not six foot. 

[00:04:36] Peter: You come across very tall in your photos. Tell us the biggest story about you.

[00:04:39] Liv: So I'm uh, from New Jersey. I have a twin brother. Grew up with a family of entrepreneurs. Every single hu human in my family line has been an entrepreneur. My dad has major ADD, um, and I've always just had a million different things that I love to do. My brain is non- stop. It's exhausting being inside of it. Um, I have a really hard time focusing on just one thing. Um, I have little quirks and, and things that I actually read about in your book that I thought were just me things, that happen to be, um, ADD things. So I've kind of harnessed it as my superpower and the things that I really love. I've been able to turn into businesses that make money. So the first is brand caffeine. Uh, my twin brother and I own a digital marketing agency and we launch content strategy, paid ads for brands and personal brands. Um, so we're responsible for making people blow up on social media and their sales. Um, but in terms of my personal, I, on Liv Schreiber have, um, a following on Instagram and TikTok, both of which, um, on my explorer pages think I have ADD as well. So I'm constantly getting fed, you know, signs. You have ADD every day. Um, and then, you know, I started Hot and social about a year ago. Where people come to meet new people. It's not weird. They're not weird people. It's all super cool and um, the premise is everyone comes solo and leaves as friends. So it's really, really special and very fulfilling. 

[00:06:12] Peter: I like that. What brought you to create something where people, you know what, most people have created a dating app. Create a relationship app. I remember, I remember going to the hell back in like early two thousands, going to the hell that was the J-Date, matzo balls every Christmas and, and, and leaving and thinking that there was no hope for humanity and I wasn't really wrong. But, um, tell me what, what, uh, pushed you to decide to do something for friendship as opposed to like dating relationships, which is usually where everyone else goes.

[00:06:39] Liv: Yeah. Number one, I'm not like a, a very sexual influencer showing my boobs on Instagram. So it, it just wouldn't, as a Lisa Lit, our shared friend would say, no fit my brand aesthetic. Um, That's number one. Um, it started out as hot and single because my twin brother was single. And I go around and I interview people who are hot and single, but that's just not the root of who I am. So in honor of that authenticity, um, switched it over, rebranded to hot and social. And the point is, is that when you come in just looking for friends or just looking to meet one other people, you're always pleasantly surprised and leave with more, especially if you do happen to meet a romantic connection. It's not something that you went in looking for. And I think that's the problem with a lot of dating apps is people are going in with this expectation and being let down every time. 

[00:07:32] Peter: Yeah, it makes sense. I mean I think that that, you know, especially cuz dating apps need people to get let down in order for them to continue to make money. Exactly. Right. If everyone on dating apps found everyone immediately, they're, they're, you know, dating apps anymore. 

[00:07:43] Liv: Right. And the great thing is there is a cap in, I guess some societies on romantic partners, but there's no cap on friendship. You can come and come back and come back again and still, you know, be excited by new people that you're meeting. 

[00:07:58] Peter: It's very possible. Um, tell us about the people who go to these events, because I imagine that if you're going to an event to make friends, right, there's two types of people who go to the, to an event to make friends type of people who, you know, I don't think people imagine like, oh, this is actually gonna be fun. I'm looking forward to this. You know, for, for a lot of people, d, ADHD, going into a room full of people where the expectation is you have to talk to all these people. You've never met. Right. And you have to, uh, make small talk for an hour, two hours, three hours is the equivalent of going to a dentist. 

[00:08:33] Liv: No, no, no. 

[00:08:35] Peter: I'm not saying, I'm not saying that's what you do, but for a lot of people with adhd, I mean, I don't necessarily know if going to a, going to a room, Hey, you're gonna go to this room and you're gonna, there's a hundred people there and you're gonna talk to 50 of them, and good luck. You know, that, that, that, I don't know. Root canals, I, I sort of broke up my mind. So tell us why this is different and tell us how people sort of survive this and enjoy it? 

[00:08:54] Liv: Okay. I love that. That's really funny. Um, so the number one thing is everyone's on the same page, so you're picturing yourself as going somewhere alone, where other people may know each other. This is. Peter. This is like freshman year of college. Everyone's on the same playing field. No one knows each other at the events. I show up solo. So it's really exciting because if you're someone that's looking to challenge themselves or just try something new or get out of the typical bar scene, it's really awesome because the energy is actually like ADD puppy. It's so friendly, so warm, so welcoming, so much great energy because you can literally turn to anyone there and know that they want to talk to you. I know that you wanna talk to them. Um, 

[00:09:43] Peter: what do people talk about? 

[00:09:44] Liv: Talk about everything. Where are you from? Where in the city are you? And we always have an activity, so it's not just like gathering people in a room with drinks. I barely drink, so it, that just wouldn't make sense. What we do is we do fun things. So, um, we're having pickleball tournaments. We had one on Friday, we have another one this coming Friday. So you know, everyone like does some rose and rally. We're drinking rose, and then we're going to rally. And learn how to play on the courts. We have comedy shows coming up, so it's like there's always an experience and something to talk about or look forward to or bond over. Um, and I think that's what makes us different. 

[00:10:19] Peter: There's obviously a need for these things, right? Why is it so hard to make friends and not so much just, you know, oh, in New York, I think it's hard for adults to make friends, period. Because we're, as kids, it's sort of expected of us, right? I remember I have this great photo of my daughter, um, when she's like two years old and she's with a bunch of her friends on the playground and we, someone said, okay, it's time to go, everyone, get your buddy. And they just walked over and they immediately held hands and there was no, uh, issue with that because that's what they're trained to do, right? So we trained them to do that. But at some point as we mature the concept of go find your buddy disappears, right? And people either go out on their own or they have their own social circle and they don't wanna move out of. Why do you think that is? Why do you think we, for lack of a better word, forget how to make friends?

[00:11:10] Liv: I think we get so absorbed by our own selves and, and by our own lives that we kind of forget that the world is going on around us. Like I, I think work comes into play and finding a partner comes into play and friendship kind of gets pushed to the side. Um, and it's sad because people kind of start, stop growing, right? Like, you know, every year in college we're forced to learn something new. But you become an adult and you kind of forget that that life is like a classroom too, and you have to constantly be pushing yourself and learning new things and meeting new people. So, you know, I, I don't think it's anything to shame ourselves about. I think it's just about remembering, oh, this thing's still going on, and, and there's so many people that are super cool that are out there that we don't even know exist yet. 

[00:12:02] Peter: It's very, very possible. I think that, that we get into these ruts, we get into sort of these moments where it's like, okay, I'm good. I have enough. Right? I don't need more. I don't want go through because it's hard to make friends, right? No one ever said it was easy, and so if we don't, if we have what we have and we're comfortable and we're in our comfort zone, we don't necessarily have to do more because that's hard to do. The problem is nothing grows in your comfort zone, and so over time you need to do that.

[00:12:23] Liv: No, I, I, exactly. I hear you. I agree with that.

[00:12:26] Peter: Uh, Liv how can people find you? What? I know you have a phenomenal Instagram. I follow it. What, what? Tell people what it is. So how people can find you more. 

[00:12:31] Liv: It's at Liv Schreiber. L i v s c h r e i b e r. Um, and Hot and Social is Hot and social. H o t and s o c i A L. Am I okay. I need to wake up. Um, But yeah, I'm super excited and I think also having ADD or undiagnosed ADD for everyone who's watching is actually such a benefit in friendships because you know, there's no one else who can text 20 of their friends at eight in the morning and check in on them and ask them how they're doing. Like I think having ADD actually is a huge, um, it, it, it's really a huge asset to my friendship. So, Peter, I'm really grateful that you've taught me that and reading your book and hearing, uh, you know, about all your tips and tricks on this podcast has really helped me. So thank you so much. Yeah.

[00:13:18] Peter: I appreciate it. Thank you. It's great. It's great to have you and, and, and hopefully we can connect again and see each other in person again. I had a lot of fun over that coffee a couple months ago. It was fun. 

Um, Guys, you've been listening to Fast Than Normal. We appreciate you. We love that you're here. If you haven't already checked out the new book, the Boy With the Faster Brain, it was on Today in New York yesterday on the Today Show. It is blowing up. It is. It is gaining a lot of traction, if you haven't, please leave us reading on Amazon. We love that. But either way, we will see you next week with a brand new episode. Thank you again to Skylight frames, skylight calendar, https://skylightframe.com. Check them out. To 30 bucks off with code PeterShankman. We will see you guys next week. Have a wonderful, wonderful week. Stay safe, stay healthy! ADHD and all Neurodiversity are gifts, not curses. We'll see you soon. 

Credits: You've been listening to the Faster Than Normal podcast. We're available on iTunes, Stitcher and Google play and of course at www.FasterThanNormal.com I'm your host, Peter Shankman and you can find me at shankman.com and @petershankman on all of the socials. If you like what you've heard, why not head over to your favorite podcast platform of choice and leave us a review, come more people who leave positive reviews, the more the podcast has shown, and the more people we can help understand that ADHD is a gift, not a curse. Opening and closing themes were composed and produced by Steven Byrom who also produces this podcast, and the opening introduction was recorded by Bernie Wagenblast. Thank you so much for listening. We'll see you next week! 

Mar 29, 2023

Having ADD or ADHD is a gift, not a curse. Hear from people all around the globe, from every walk of life, in every profession, from Rock Stars to CEOs, from Teachers to Politicians, who have learned how to unlock the gifts of their ADD and ADHD diagnosis, and use it to their personal and professional advantage, to build businesses, become millionaires, or simply better their lives.

Hey guys, Peter Shankman the host of Faster Than Normal. I wanna talk for a second about the Skylight Calendar, the wonderful sponsors of this episode and one of the things that keeps myself and my daughter on track. Skylight sits on your wall and tells you what you have to do today; what chores your child has to do today. It's basically a family calendar all-in-one. You can color code. It is amazing for people with ADHD. I am truly in love with this thing. We look at it every single day. It tells us the weather. It tells us what's on our calendar. It tells us what chores are left to do. Oh, time to feed the dog! - Mark it off on the calendar. My daughter can check the box when she's done and the chore disappears. It is one of the best things we've ever had. You can get yours with a discount using code: PeterShankman for 10% off, up to 30 bucks off. You’re gonna love this Skylight calendar.  And you are gonna love.. I mean, truly it is amazing for people with ADHD or basically anyone who wants to keep track of their schedule. It sits on the wall, added bonus. You can throw your own photos onto it as a screen saver- on your wall! So now your wall has pictures. That's cool. Check it out. I'll put the link in the show notes. https://www.skylightframe.com code:  PeterShankman

00:40 - Thank you so much for listening and for subscribing!

01:38 - Say hello to my daughter Jessa Shankman!

02:17 - How old are you and what grade are you in?

02:22: So when you think of the letters ADHD what do you think of?

02:43 - Do you get distracted sometimes? What do you do when you do- if you do, to re-center and focus?

03:30 - About daily routines

03:50 - What do you think about your Dad and ADHD?

05:00 - On getting distracted and realizing that you have become so. How do teachers help?

05:22 - What do you think kids can do to be more focused? 

05:52 - When is a fidget spinner really helpful?

06:42 - Can a little water help you focus? If so why do you think that is?

07:15 - What would you tell a kid who realizes that they are being distracted, doesn't like school and doesn't know how to fix any of it? 

08:09 - Ref: Amanda Steinberg’s interview sponsored by Bouncy Bands https://www.fasterthannormal.com/ftn-052-failing-doesnt-mean-youre-a-failure-with-guest-amanda-steinberg/

08:24 - On the importance of being comfortable and being able to employ a comfortable posture

08:52 - Do you think that when you exercise it helps or hurts your focus?

09:10 - What about recess?

09:30 - Do you feel more focused if you've had a good night of sleep?

10:01 - Anything else you wanna tell kids who might have ADHD or might be distracted once in a while?

10:48 - Jessa and Peter’s big shout outs to Skylight calendar!

11:18 -  The Boy with the Faster Brain is now out! https://amzn.to/3FcAKkI

11:40 - Faster Than Normal Podcast info & credits.

[After this interview Peter's dog, Waffle submitted a request to share more 'screen time' in future interviews. You can check-in on him here:  @petersdogwaffle on INSTA 

Guys, as always thanks so much for subscribing! Faster Than Normal is for YOU! We want to know what you’d like to hear! Do you have a cool friend with a great story? We’d love to learn about, and from them. I'm www.petershankman.com and you can reach out anytime via email at peter@shankman.com or @petershankman on all of the socials. You can also find us at @FasterNormal on all of the socials. It really helps when you drop us a review on iTunes and of course, subscribe to the podcast if you haven’t already! As you know, the more reviews we get, the more people we can reach. Help us to show the world that ADHD is a gift, not a curse! 

TRANSCRIPT via Descript and then corrected.. mostly somewhat: 

[00:00:40] Peter:  Hey guys, Peter Shankman, host of Faster Than Normal. I wanna talk for a second about the Skylight Calendar, the wonderful sponsors of this episode, and one of the things that keeps myself and my daughter on track. Skylight sits on your wall and tells you what you have to do today, what chores your child has to do today. It's basically a family calendar with all in one, you can color code. It is amazing for people with ADHD. I am truly in love with this thing. We look at it every single day. It tells us the weather. It tells us what's on our calendar. It tells us what chores are left to do. Oh, time to feed the dog, mark it off on the calendar. My daughter can check the box when she's done and the chore disappears. It is one of the best things we've ever had. You can get yours with a discount using code: PeterShankman for 10% off, up to 30 bucks off. You’re gonna love this Skylight calendar.  And you are gonna love. I mean, truly it. It is amazing for people with ADHD or basically anyone who wants to keep track of their schedule. It sits on the wall. Added bonus. You can throw your own photos onto it as a screen saver on your wall. So now your wall has pictures. That's cool. Check it out. I'll put the link in the show notes. https://www.skylightframe.com code:  PeterShankman

[00:01:37] Peter: Hey guys, Peter Shankman, host of Faster Than Normal. I wanna talk for a second about the Skylight Calendar, the wonderful sponsors of this episode, and one of the things that keeps myself and my daughter on track. Skylight sits on your wall and tells you what you have to do today, what chores your child has to do today. It's basically a family calendar with all in one, you can color code. It is amazing for people with ADHD. I am truly in love with this thing. We look at it every single day. It tells us the weather. It tells us what's on our calendar. It tells us what chores are left to do. Oh, time to feed the dog, mark it off on the calendar. My daughter can check the box when she's done and the chore disappears. It is one of the best things we've ever had. You can get yours with a discount using code: PeterShankman .Check for the link in the show notes. And you are gonna love. I mean, truly it. It is amazing for people with ADHD or basically anyone who wants to keep track of their schedule. It sits on the wall. Added bonus. You can throw your own photos onto it as a screen saver on your wall. So now your wall has pictures. That's cool. Check it out. I'll put the link in the show notes. 

Welcome to Faster Than Normal. My name is Peter Shankman. I am sitting here today on a one-on-one interview with one of the most incredible people I've ever met, and I guess I kind of have to say that cuz we're talking to my daughter. We're talking to Jessa Shankman. Say, hi, Jessa. 

[00:01:54] Jessa: Hi, my name is Jess Shankman and I am the daughter of Peter Shankman. 

[00:01:57] Peter: We are gonna talk today about, we're gonna talk to my daughter about what it's like to have a Dad with ADHD. And we're sitting here, we're joined by Waffle the dog. And we'll take a picture and, and put it up as well of all three of us on all family on one couch. But we are talking today about what it's like for a Dad and for a Daughter when a Dad has ADHD and how a daughter deals with it. So, Jessa how old are you?

[00:02:18] Jessa: Nine. 

[00:02:19] Peter: Nine. What grade are you in?

[00:02:21] Jessa: I'm in fourth grade.

[00:02:22] Peter: Fourth grade. So when you think of the words ADHD and letters, adhd, what do you think of? 

[00:02:27] Jessa: Well, when I think of adhd. I just think of like the letters and the word or, yeah, the letters. I think of like, like a, what do you call? Like a just random numbers, like math. I just think of like when I think of adhd, I think of people who get distracted. 

[00:02:43] Peter: People get distracted. Okay. And do you get distracted sometimes?

[00:02:48] Jessa: Yes. A lot actually.

[00:02:49] Peter: A lot. And what do you do when you get distracted? 

[00:02:51] Jessa: Well, sometimes when I get distracted, I. lose focus or I, like, I keep doing it, but then if I realize I've gotten distracted, like today I was just, uh, like fidgeting or singing or something and I wasn't paying attention that I have to read my book. So then I was like, okay, yes, you have to read your book and be focused. So I just try to do that. 

[00:03:15] Peter: And how do, what happens when you, when you do, do you do anything special to help you refocus? We talked about sometimes you do exercises or, um, 

[00:03:24] Jessa: I don't usually do exercises, but sometimes I just need to get my mind. So I take, I don't usually take deep breaths, but I just try to get my mind in focus by using my mind.

[00:03:35] Peter: So breathing helps though, right? Sometimes taking deep breaths. Yeah. And sometimes when you're a little too hyper or sometimes we'll do exercises together. We'll do like, 

[00:03:42] Jessa: I was too hyper to read today, 

[00:03:43] Peter: too hyper to read today, what didja do like a Peloton workout or something. Normally if you get a work workout in the morning, you're pretty much focused all day.

[00:03:49] Jessa: Yeah. 

[00:03:49] Peter: Yeah. But I mean it also happens cuz you know you're also nine, so sometimes that happens. What do you think about when you think about your Dad and ADHD? 

[00:03:57] Jessa: Sometimes when I like ask him to like read me this or do something, he doesn't listen the first time and he sometimes gets distracted. But then if I say again, he's like, sorry, what'd you say? And then he listens. 

[00:04:14] Peter: So I think anyone can really have that. Anyone can get distracted. Right? So sometimes, but, but you also know that I do certain things to help you, control my ADHD like what? What do I do to control it? Like exercise and stuff like that? Exercise, yeah. I get on my bike every morning, 

[00:04:27] Jessa: right? Get on the bike If I [unintelligible] every morning. Yeah. 

[00:04:30] Peter: So I get on the bike and I do things so I'm able to focus better. But it's not, do you, do you see, like, do you have friends who have a hard time concentrating too? 

[00:04:39] Jessa: I don't think so. Most kids are prob, most kids are, oh yeah. One friend is, uh, but I think some, some of my friends are, but then they get, um, like focused.

[00:04:54] Peter: I think a lot of times what happens, especially when you're younger, is that you get distracted and you don't realize you're distracted. Right? So you're like, oh, what? And then you were like, oh, wait a second. I wasn't paying attention. 

[00:05:02] Jessa: that's what I do.

[00:05:03] Peter: Right. And that can be, that can get you in trouble sometimes. Like if a teacher's saying something, you have to listen. Right? 

[00:05:08] Jessa: Sometimes my teacher does point it out to me. 

[00:05:10] Peter: So your teacher, when your teacher points out to you, what does he say? 

[00:05:13] Jessa: He says, Jessica, Jessa.. Like, he just says that and he, 

[00:05:18] Peter: so he just says your name and then you like it sort of snaps you back in.

[00:05:21] Jessa: Yeah. 

[00:05:22] Peter: What do you think kids can do to be more focused? 

[00:05:27] Jessa: Have a fidget maybe near them, but also be, that being said, a fidget is a fidget. It could be more distracting. 

[00:05:35] Peter: Well, you're sitting here right now, you're playing with a little bit of slime, right? . 

[00:05:38] Jessa: Yeah, but I'm focused. 

[00:05:40] Peter: You're focused because you're giving your fingers something to do. Yeah. Right. So you're playing with your slime and you're rubbing it and like, so turning it into a ball, a ball or something like that. 

[00:05:49] Jessa: Sometimes a fidget can be really helpful and sometimes it can be distracting. 

[00:05:52] Peter: When is it really helpful? 

[00:05:54] Jessa: Uh, helpful. Like when you're, when you are kind of focused, but then like your hands are just like, Just like doing anything and you like, it's just, I don't really know how to say this, but sometimes when you're distracted, if like you're doing a math class or any class that you don't love and you like get bored, you should get something in your hands. Or it could be like a marble or it could be a piece of slime, but like not, not something to really get you distracted, like something that you can make a whole town out of. like clay. You can't have that. We You can't. It's a little something. Yeah. Just like a marble or like a, A magnet. Or a fidget spinner.

[00:06:34] Peter: That's a really good suggestion. So the goal is like to keep yourself sort of a little bit occupied. Keep your hands busy. 

[00:06:39] Jessa: Yeah. Keep your hands busy, but keep your focus on the teacher. 

[00:06:42] Peter: Do you think that you get more or less distracted if you've drank some water? Less like you drink water and you get less distracted.

[00:06:49] Jessa: Sometimes I do that, like sometimes I'm like, okay, I gotta go and get my water bottle. And then I drink, like, um, I drink a little bit of it, and then I'm like, okay, sit back down and focus on the Math. 

[00:07:00] Peter: So sometimes your distractions, your brain can be helped by water. Why do you think that is? 

[00:07:06] Jessa: Maybe the water just gets you refreshed.

[00:07:08] Peter: Yeah. 

[00:07:08] Jessa: And like,

[00:07:09] Peter: because your body may have like a lot of water. Yeah. The majority of your body is water, right? Yeah. What would you tell a kid who realizes that he or she is being distracted and doesn't like in school and doesn't know how to fix it? 

[00:07:22] Jessa: I would tell them to, if you realize you're getting distracted, then just notice it and try or drink a and drink water or just shake it up.[as Waffle laps at his water bowl in the background] Maybe like I would say raise your hand. Just go to the back of the room and maybe do like, maybe like I, you can't do jumping jacks in the middle of a class. Maybe some squats. But I would say, yeah, not even, maybe just like, maybe just moving your feet or something. Maybe standing up. Yeah, just standing up. Cuz sometimes if you're sitting down, you could easily be distracted. Just stand up and take a breath or take a break.

[00:07:58] Peter: I think there's also, there's um, you know, there's a company we had on the podcast called Bouncy Bands, where they make little bands that go on the bottom of the chair and you can just move your feet to those. Oh, really? So yeah, those are like helpful too. But yeah, I think at the end of the day, movement just stand up movement. Really helpful. Right? Really? Yeah. Just it's hard to sit down all day. Yeah. Back when, back when we were cavemen, we never sat down all day. If we sat down, we were sleeping. If we stood up, if we, if we weren't sleeping, we were hunting stuff and getting food.

Right? 

[00:08:24] Jessa: Yeah. Like also there's like, I sit on something that does not support my back and that makes it even harder to really sit and my back sometimes during the day. 

[00:08:35] Peter: What do you sit on that doesn't Like a chair or just a bench? 

[00:08:38] Jessa: You know, there's a bench. Oh, they bench in school. Yeah. But then most of the time if I'm like, I wanna, I want like I need to stand up, I would do that and then I would grab a chair, which, you know, it's better for me, like,

[00:08:51] Peter: yeah, definitely. Do you think that when you exercise it helps or hurts your focus? Helps. 

[00:08:56] Jessa: Helps. I just say like move your feet. Like you can't like, just like maybe like do, I don't think you should do like jumping jacks or squats. No. That's kinda tough in the middle of the class, but I think you should just like move your feet or move your arms.

[00:09:10] Peter: Like how do you feel after recess? Are you focused?

[00:09:12] Jessa: After recess, I am focused, but sometimes a little bit distracted. Recess gives you a time to run around, but some people don't run around. But .Do you? I sometimes, yeah. I, I don't love to run around that much. I don't love the game tag or, but sometimes I just sit and like try to get myself ready for the next. Or for the class or just, you know.

[00:09:35] Peter: Do you feel more focused if you having a good night sleep? 

[00:09:36] Jessa: I think so, yeah. Because sometimes I'm really tired in class and I'm like, I probably didn't get a good night's sleep. That explains, I went to bed at nine last night. Um, but I think sleep, I think you should really get a good night's sleep for you to help. Cuz you could be really tired in class. Yeah. And that wouldn't be good. You would fall, you would like almost fall asleep or you could just be like really tired that you would just fidget and just do this and you wouldn't pay attention to anything. 

[00:10:01] Peter: Anything else you wanna tell kids who might have ADHD or might be distracted once in a while.

[00:10:05] Jessa: I think just standing up, taking a break and then sitting back down, sitting in a comfy seat. You don't wanna sit in like a bad seat where you can get really distracted easily. I think you should just sit in a chair and listen or try to listen. Just take a break if you feel distracted or something like that. And yeah, that's it. 

[00:10:28] Peter: Awesome. Guys. That was my daughter, Jessa Shankman, who is enough to come on the podcast today, interrupting her day of, she's off this week, so interrupting her day of playing with slime and, and, and playing Roblox and, uh, talking to her friends. But really, really appreciate you taking the time, Jess. I love you very much.

[00:10:43] Jessa: Love you too. 

[00:10:43] Peter: Okay, guys. You've been listening to Faster Than Normal, my name is Peter Shankman. As always, we are thrilled that you're here. Big shout out again to Skylight Calendar. That frame, that calendar has saved my life countless times.

[00:10:53] Jessa: Can I tell them about it? 

[00:10:53] Peter: Yeah, go ahead. 

[00:10:54] Jessa: Skylight is really good cuz it helps me with my chores and like if I see like feed the dog, or clean up after breakfast, I can just tap it when it's done. And it also has cool pictures. You can upload pictures on it. 

[00:11:04] Peter: Yep. It is a very, very cool product. We both love it. Strongly recommended. Check the link out in the show notes, get a discount with the code. Peter Shankman. Guys, thank you so much for listening as always thanks to Steven Byrom, our wonderful executive editor and producer who creates amazing episodes for us every week. [Thank you too Peter! -sb]  We will see you next week. We are thrilled that you are here. ADHD and all forms of neurodiversity are gifts, not curses. And by the way, if you haven't picked up The Boy with the Faster Brain yet, it is on Amazon and it is a number one bestseller in all categories. So check it out, The Boy with the Faster Brain. It is a children's book about neurodiversity. 

Jessa: I love it. 

Peter: Thank you, Jessa. Guys, thanks for listening and we'll see you next week. Say bye, Jess. 

[00:11:39] Jessa: Bye 

[00:11:40] Peter: Bye guys! 

Credits: You've been listening to the Faster Than Normal podcast. We're available on iTunes, Stitcher and Google play and of course at www.FasterThanNormal.com I'm your host, Peter Shankman and you can find me at shankman.com and @petershankman on all of the socials. If you like what you've heard, why not head over to your favorite podcast platform of choice and leave us a review, come more people who leave positive reviews, the more the podcast has shown, and the more people we can help understand that ADHD is a gift, not a curse. Opening and closing themes were composed and produced by Steven Byrom who also produces this podcast, and the opening introduction was recorded by Bernie Wagenblast. Thank you so much for listening. We'll see you next week! 

Mar 22, 2023

Hey guys. Peter Shankman here, the host of Faster Than Normal. I wanna talk to you for a second about the Skylight all in one family calendar. So Skylight sent me one of these a couple of months ago and I hung it on my wall. And God, how do I put this? My daughter no longer skips out on her chores! I know when her events are at school, we don't miss them. Everything is in front of us. It's a touchscreen. It's visible. It is the easiest thing I have ever used. It's beautiful. You can import your photos to it, or use the screen savers and it's right there. We sit down at breakfast. Everything she has that day is right there. Everything I need to know is right there. Did she do her chores? She does them. She checks off the box on the calendar. Oh my God. Greatest thing ever. It is amazing. I am in love with the Skylight Family calendar. I am using it constantly, literally every day, and I strongly recommend you guys pick it up too. They're a great supporter of Faster Than Normal. Neurodiverse families are going to love this. Use code: PeterShankman for 10% off, up to 30 bucks off. You're gonna love this Skylight calendar. It has changed my life with my daughter. It'll change yours too. Enjoy it. See you guys soon.

Today's encore! I have been listening to our guests for well more than a decade! They have been part of my playlist since the summer of 2006 when their music helped me run the NYC Marathon faster than I ever had before. You surely know their music too, even if you’ve never heard the name Shinedown! Their song “Get Up” is the most inspiring, straight to the point, song I’ve ever heard that challenges the stigmas of talking honestly about mental health. They are some of the hardest working Artists in the world, so I was honored when they agreed to spend some time with us here today, helping to grow & inspire more honest conversations about mental health. Shinedown is a multi-platinum rock band. The song "GET UP" is from their latest album "ATTENTION ATTENTION?"
Enjoy!

In this episode Peter, Brent and Eric discuss:

1:08-  Intro and welcome Brent Smith and Eric Bass!

2:00-  After 136 shows spanning 48,000 miles, you guys were labeled The Hardest Working Artists of 2018! That’s a ton of work & a healthy mantle! How do you make sure that you are taking care of yourselves mentally?

5:37-  On loving what you do & being driven

6:10-  On the importance of surrounding yourself with good people & a good support system

9:49-  Brent, you wrote “Get Up” for Eric. The majority of folks don’t know how to talk to a friend who is, or might be struggling. What did you learn from writing this song?

14:08-  “You are not going to be defined by your failures. You are going to be defined by the fact that you refuse to give up- no matter what” -Brent Smith

16:05-  Peter on the importance of Music, and how music will pull you through  ref: “I Dare You  ref:  Peter gets arrested for exercising, makes news.

18:24-  What is it about music, not books, movies, tv, etc, but music that people always credit with bringing them through a rough spell, or helping them remember a moment in time, etc. Why?

20:52-  Talk to me about the stigma around mental health. Finally there is a solid movement- between you guys, people like Erik Kussin who have started WeAreAllALittleCrazy.org, etc. What can people do to help grow the national/international conversation about mental health? ref:  Erik Kussin’s FTN interview here #SameHere

Follow Shinedown at:  http://www.shinedown.com FB Twitter INSTA YouTube AppleMusic Shazam Spotify

26:07-  Thank you Brent and Eric!! And thank YOU for subscribing, reviewing and listening.  Please.. stop right now and write us a review, EVEN IF you’ve reviewed us before, so that we will all be able to help & reach even more people!  You can always reach me at peter@shankman.com or @petershankman on all of the socials. Also at @FasterThanNormal on all of the socials.

27:02-  Faster Than Normal Podcast info & credits

As always, leave us a comment below and PLEASE drop us a review on iTunes and of course, subscribe to the podcast if you haven’t already! The more reviews we get, the more people we can reach. Help us to show the world that ADHD is a gift, not a curse! Know of anyone you think should be on the FTN podcast? Shoot us a note, we’d love to hear!

Mar 15, 2023

Having ADD or ADHD is a gift, not a curse. Hear from people all around the globe, from every walk of life, in every profession, from Rock Stars to CEOs, from Teachers to Politicians, who have learned how to unlock the gifts of their ADD and ADHD diagnosis, and use it to their personal and professional advantage, to build businesses, become millionaires, or simply better their lives.

We have a new book to tell you about:  

00:40 - Thank you so much for listening and for subscribing!

The Boy with the Faster Brain is now out! Click HERE to see & get it! https://amzn.to/3FcAKkI

12:35 - Faster Than Normal Podcast info & credits.

Guys, as always thanks so much for subscribing! Faster Than Normal is for YOU! We want to know what you’d like to hear! Do you have a cool friend with a great story? We’d love to learn about, and from them. I'm www.petershankman.com and you can reach out anytime via email at peter@shankman.com or @petershankman on all of the socials. You can also find us at @FasterNormal on all of the socials. It really helps when you drop us a review on iTunes and of course, subscribe to the podcast if you haven’t already! As you know, the more reviews we get, the more people we can reach. Help us to show the world that ADHD is a gift, not a curse! 

TRANSCRIPT via Descript and then corrected.. somewhat: 

[00:00:40] Peter:  Hey guys. Peter Shankman, the host of Faster Than Normal. How you doing today? I wanna do a podcast on the new book; the children's book I wrote, that's coming out pretty soon, but as I was thinking about specifically how to do it in, in such a way that it wasn't just basically a podcast about my brand new book that read like an Ad. I was brainstorming ways on how to talk about it and that sent me down a rabbit hole of thinking about what it was like to be when I was a kid. And I thought about a couple of specific instances and, and as I thought about them, I wrote them down and um, I just wanna share them with you today. This won't be a long podcast, but there's a reason, there's a method to my madness here.

So I'm just back from boxing. I did an hour, uh, again at the gym. I'm going probably like three or four times a week now and I just love it. I, it is, it is like no other sport. It's, it's, for me, it's better than running. It's better than triathlon. It, it's just an hour of, of, of me one on one of the coach. And I realized why I love it so much. Not only cause I get to hit things and, and the more things I hit, the less people I have to hit. But there's a, a bigger reason for that. And I think as ADHD people we can relate to this. Boxing is finite and it's why I love skydiving the same way. When I'm boxing, the gym operates on bell system. There is a three. There is a bell that rings at the start of three minutes, at the end of three minutes, and at the end of a one minute break. No matter what I'm doing, no matter what I'm, I'm, no matter how much pain I'm in, no matter how much out, out of breath I am, whether I'm getting hit, whatever the case may be. I know that there's going to be a bell and that bell is going to give me a one minute respite, or in some cases the end of my workout. 

And I was thinking back, I remember in high school, I guess freshman year of high school, sophomore year of high school, I got, I got mugged and. I guess my Dad decided that it might be smart. I mean, I lived in New York City, it was understandable. My Dad decided to be smart to send me to a gym, to, to learn self-defense and lift weights and, and, and get bulked up. And, um, there weren't many weightlifting gyms. Um, I think it was the mid eighties, so it was like the era of, uh, Jack Lalaine or, or. Cardio Jazzer size or whatever, there weren't a lot of gyms and, and even fewer gyms that that allowed kids. But my parents found a gym, like an old school gym with, you know, weights and, and problem was, it wasn't a trainer like Mick from Rocky, which is what I was hoping for. It was some. Juiced up. I don't wanna say Guido cause that's an offensive term, but you get, you get the idea of of of what I mean that's what I remember and I, I certainly meant no offense by that, but it was, it was definitely a guy with an accent that probably from Brooklyn, or Queens, and everything we did for the week or two that I went there before I quit was, yeah, hit harder, kick some ass. No one's, no one's gonna mess with you and it was the exact opposite of what I was hoping for at a gym. And I, you know, obviously didn't last long there. I, I hated it. And, uh, I wasn't that kind of kid. I wasn't the kid who wanted to go get jacked up and, and, and, and, and, you know, I just wanted to, to put on a few pounds or shed a few pounds and build a few pounds of muscle. It was total opposite what I needed.

And I was thinking about that because growing up, everything I ever tried like that. I mean, I remember going to a gym with my Dad when I was like 10, lasted a couple weeks there. And I remember going, you know, I, I to be on diets and I'd try this and that. Nothing really took. Wasn't until my late twenties when I discovered running and running took because sort of now that I think about the same reason as boxing, running at a start point and an end point. Right, I'm running five miles. Well, that meant I'd run five miles and when those five miles were over, I would stop running . 

Um, and I think that's a big thing that when you're ADHD especially when look, when you're a kid, I mean, I can tell you about my daughter; no matter what I make her do. . It has to be, how long do I have to do it? Jessa did you get your reading done tonight? Every, every night she's supposed to do 30 minutes of reading. Right. So there's, you know, and, and she loves, she's a great reader, but she, and she loves when she gets into a good book, but she doesn't like reading as a concept. And so there'll be times when it's like, Jessa, did says, you do 30 minutes of reading. Uh, no, I'm gonna start, can I, can I only do 20? No, do 30. And then she'll set an iPad timer. And I swear to you the, the, the, the millisecond that thing dings, she's. Doesn't matter if she's in the middle of a word. Doesn't matter if she's about to find out who the killer is. Ding, okay, I'm done. Did 30 minutes. In her mind. It's about those 30 minutes.

Now all kids are like that. But I think the problem I had with exercise as a whole growing up, it was not my thing. I I, I've said this before, I, I ran by pressing X on a joystick and then college, I ran to the store for cigarettes and that was about it. Um, I think that what I learned. or what I didn't have then that I have now in like boxing and running is the premise of a finite time, a finite workout. You know, a lot of times we try and figure out, okay, I'm gonna go to the gym and I'm gonna exercise every single day and I'm gonna do this and that. And we don't put a start putting an end point to it. And because of that, in our mind, we're five minutes in, and it's never going to end. Well. If it's never gonna end, I might as well quit right now because there's no way I could do this forever. And one of the things that I've found, About boxing. It ends after three minutes, it's over for a minute and you can breathe. 

So perhaps one of the ways we talk to our kids about ways of getting the dopamine and the serotonin and the adrenaline that we need; is we introduce them to timed things right. I remember when I ran, when I, I started running last summer with my daughter, and of course she hated it until she started liking it. She got her first dopamine hit. She's like, Ooh. But we started running in a half a block. In how much further do we have to go until we, you know, and we, I said, we're gonna go to the end of this block and then we're gonna turn, make a left to go three blocks down and then three blocks back up, and then we're gonna come home. And as soon as I said that, she stopped complaining because she could envision in her mind, how long she had to do. Right? Three blocks. Three blocks. Turn around. Three blocks. Three blocks. And I think that's something that not only is good for our kids with ADHD, but good for us as well. It's why we all set timers. Okay, I'm gonna work for 55 minutes. I'm gonna spend five minutes standing up, go to the bathroom doing deep stretches, and then work for another 55 minutes. It's why I do when I on a plane, I know that I have 14 hours to write this book. , I'll break that into six hours and then break the, you know, we're seven hours break, seven hours, two and a half hours, whatever.

I don't think we give enough appreciation to time, even though time's a manmade, manmade construct. The premise of breaking things into smaller bits of time is very, very beneficial for someone with ADHD or a faster brain or any form of neurodiversity because it allows us to not be frightened by a massive thing, right? We're not frightened of a, oh my God, I have to do an hour of exercise. I know that when I go to the gym, I'm gonna be working out nonstop for an hour, but I know that every three minutes I get 60 seconds off, and by the end of that hour, I'm sweating my ass off and I'm dying but, I get 60 seconds off and that gets me through the next three minutes and the three minutes after that, and then three minutes after that and all of a sudden it's an hour and I'm told to take off my wraps and my gloves, my wraps, and go home. So let's think about that. Let's think about assigning time values to things that might help us get through a lot of stuff.

So that's probably a good lead in to this book. I wrote a book called The Boy with the Faster Brain, and it's, it's a fiction book that's autobiographical. How about that? It's about Peter, a 10 year old, very hyperactive kid who gets a lot of notes home. Every day, gets a note home from the teacher about how he made jokes in class, how he interrupted the class, how he did all these things. Peter gets in a lot of trouble. Peter, doesn't mean to get in a lot of trouble. Because what Peter discovers is that when he tells those jokes and his class laughs, he gets this jolt of bolt of lightning, this jolt of electricity in his brain and it allows him to focus. Of course, he usually has to focus on walking himself down to the principal's office to get in trouble.

I wrote this book because I don't ever want one another kid to grow up going through in school and even as an adult. For years going through what I went through as a kid and an adult, I don't ever want anyone to go through that again, and if this book helps even one kid understand that they shouldn't hide their differences, but embrace them, then I've done my job. 

The book is launching on the 21st, but for listeners, it's launching earlier and I'm putting a link down below. [awaiting link and code]  And I am very excited about it. I'm excited because it's my first non-business book. No, it's my second non-business book, Faster Than Normal being my first one, but this one, it's for kids. It's my first children's book and I am, I'm just really psyched about that. I hope it helps a lot of people, including you and including your children. 

It's my, also my first self-published book, and so I can do a lot with it. So you guys want me to come and speak to your school? Want me to come and speak to your company? Company? Sure. Buy some books. We'll work something out. Um, I can give them away, I can donate them to schools. I can do whatever I want. It's my book. And what I found also is that I'm starting to get a lot of calls lately from corporations. Hey, can you come in and talk about neurodiversity in the workplace? I, gave a keynote to. Google last week I have Morgan Stanley coming up in a couple of weeks. I'm in talks with several other large companies to come in and talk about, um, not customer experience but neurodiversity in the workplace. And so if that's something that I can help you guys out with as well, shoot me a note. I have several keynotes on it and I'd love to do more about it. And we can work something out where you buy some books, donate them to a school or something, and I'll come and speak. I'm excited! 

The Boy with the Faster Brain. I really hope it changes some lives. I really do. 

So as always, thank you for listening. I love you guys. I'm greatly appreciative. My email is peter@shankman.com. I answer all my questions. Any I answer all my emails personally. Ask, email, tell me what's up, and let's chat. Thank you for listening. Thank you for your excitement. All the emails you've sent me about the Boy with the Faster Brain, I am really stoked as well. And I'll see you next week. 

And . Again, I wanna give a huge shout out to Skylight. [LINK WAS NOT READY AT THE TIME OF THIS RELEASE- SHALL BE UPDATED AT WWW.FASTERTHANNORMAL.COM] This frame and this calendar that hangs on the wall has changed my life with Jessa, it makes life so much easier. It has a short chart and has meal planning, and it cus custom lists weather, you can get a mobile app for it. It has share access. You can invite your spouse or your ex-spouse or your co-parenting partner kids, close friends, anyone you want. Um, you can color code. My daughter is pink. I am red. You can ch change the views and you can, the coolest thing is you can take all your photos and turn them into a screensaver when you're not using the calendar. Just random photos of like, me, Jessa, and my dog show up. So it's pretty cool. Uh, the, the link is below skylightframe.com . The um, uh, coupon code is below as well. And, uh, yeah, I am really, really excited to work with you guys and see what you're doing with the frame. Send me some photos. I'll send it over to them. We'll get you on Instagram, but yeah, it's gonna be good. The, the Frame, the book, The Boy with the Faster Brain, the podcast, I owe you guys a lot for being here. And don't ever think I'm not grateful cause I really am. Love you guys. Talk to you next week!

Credits: You've been listening to the Faster Than Normal podcast. We're available on iTunes, Stitcher and Google play and of course at www.FasterThanNormal.com I'm your host, Peter Shankman and you can find me at shankman.com and @petershankman on all of the socials. If you like what you've heard, why not head over to your favorite podcast platform of choice and leave us a review, come more people who leave positive reviews, the more the podcast has shown, and the more people we can help understand that ADHD is a gift, not a curse. Opening and closing themes were composed and produced by Steven Byrom who also produces this podcast, and the opening introduction was recorded by Bernie Wagenblast. Thank you so much for listening. We'll see you next week! 

Mar 1, 2023

About our guest today, Teresa Clark:

An innovative and forward-thinking leader Teresa Clark is the founder and alchemist of The Wellness Revolution. A pioneering culture and employee wellbeing company reimagining the workplace to unleash human potential. Built on the belief that the world of work plays an important role in transforming society and that by supporting people to live happier and healthier lives we can co-create happier and healthier societies together. She is deeply passionate about social justice, human flourishing, and the power of creativity to transform society. A public speaker, transformation and resilience expert, Teresa’s moving personal journey as a woman who received a 4-year prison sentence for the deaths of 3 of her friends in a car accident where she fell asleep at the wheel after a festival, has led her on a turbulent journey of personal recovery from extreme physical injury, psychological and emotional trauma. The deep remorse and transformative journey of finding peace and amends birthed a life trajectory driven by a magnanimous compassion to create positive social change centered around a deep passion and purpose to help others.  With 12 years of experience working within mental health for the criminal justice system, NHS, and charity sector, she has consulted at local and national levels and led cultural change across organisations through the design and development of award-winning programmes and services. Through her work, she has empowered thousands of people to reconnect with their authentic selves and transform their lives creating synergistic outcomes from collective shifts in mindset to social impact.  Enjoy! 

In this episode Peter and Teresa Clark discuss:  

00:40 - Thank you so much for listening and for subscribing!

01:00 - Intro and welcome Teresa Clark

01:24 - What gave you the idea to start a career in mental health?

02:45 - On masking strains and normalizing dishonesty in the workplace 

03:48 - How are companies beginning to take mental health seriously enough to implement change? [versus the bottom line]

05:00 - Are companies really making fundamental shifts? How and to what extent?

06:31 - On Google’s big bad goof-up

08:22 - “Don’t Be Evil” -Google

09:00 - What do you do once inside a company; how does consulting work best? Definition of reticent

10:10 - Breaking the stigma takes courage and intentional, comprehensive systems of support, time, training, positive reinforcement and encouragement, inclusive of leadership.

12:58 - How can people find more about you? 

Web:  www.thewellnessrevolution.co.uk

Socials:  @thewellnessrevolution_ on INSTA  @ThewellnessR on Twitter

13:23 - When HR and Business Leaders allow certain foundations for our people to flourish, our business will flourish. It's a natural thing. And it’s been proven. Ref: Deloitte article Deloitte study: Mental Health and Employers: The Case for Investment – Pandemic and Beyond

14:40 - The Boy With the Faster Brain is out very soon!!

15:14 - Faster Than Normal Podcast info & credits.

Guys, as always thanks so much for subscribing! Faster Than Normal is for YOU! We want to know what you’d like to hear! Do you have a cool friend with a great story? We’d love to learn about, and from them. I'm www.petershankman.com and you can reach out anytime via email at peter@shankman.com or @petershankman on all of the socials. You can also find us at @FasterNormal on all of the socials. It really helps when you drop us a review on iTunes and of course, subscribe to the podcast if you haven’t already! As you know, the more reviews we get, the more people we can reach. Help us to show the world that ADHD is a gift, not a curse! 

 

TRANSCRIPT via Descript and then corrected.. somewhat: 

[00:00:40] Peter: Hey everyone. Welcome to another episode of Faster Than Normal. My name is Peter Shankman. I'm your host. I will guide you through this journey today where we talk about A D H D in the workplace and all neurodiversity really in mental health in the place for a change. We're talking Teresa Clark. And Teresa Clark is the founder I believe, of the Wellness Revolution. She's based in London, England, and her job is to help company culture, enhance employee experience, and unleash the potential of the people who work for said companies. They are a pioneering culture and employee wellbeing company built for businesses of the future. They support forward-thinking organizations to create cultures of happiness fueled by passion, purpose, and creativity. So welcome, good to have. 

[00:01:19] Teresa: Thank you for having me. It's great to be here. 

[00:01:22] Peter: So let's dive in. What gave you the idea to start a company focusing on business mental health? 

[00:01:29] Teresa: So I, my career is in, um, working for the N H S. I've worked in mental health for about 12 years, and it was during my time when I worked for, um, a big mental health trust in North London when I was working actually in a hospital. And, um, I started to kind of look around and just see, we had a really high turnover of staff and the nature of the work was very intense because I worked in forensics, which is, um, a part of type of mental. Services, which when people commit offenses, they go into hospital as opposed to prison. So as you can imagine, you, you are, you know, experiencing quite a lot of sad cases. It's the works quite heavy. But even so, um, we just had this huge turnaround of staff and as I was there longer and longer, I realized that we weren't looking after our own people's mental health and that the workloads were huge. People were really stressed out if somebody came and said that they were experiencing. their own issues. It wasn't treated very well. In fact, there was a kind of real fear culture that nobody would've said that. Um, and they would've just gone off work with, you know, explained it underneath another sickness. But it was actually to do with that. And what was happening, which was really, really sad, was that was actually affecting patient care. So I started to sort of think, wow, if this is happening in a mental health trust, what's happening in the real world? And I started to kind of look at my family and friends and acquaintances and kind of see that, you know, we all struggle with something. Some of us might talk about it, others might not. But you know, mental health is just the same as physical health. And I just started to, to sort of think about how many toxic work cultures there are in the. and that we really need to do something about it because we spend 90,000 hours of work in our lifetime. And that is a long time to be stuck somewhere where you feel miserable and the, and the outcomes of that in terms of your own physical and mental health, but also the ripple effect that it has on your family, your friends, uh, and just sort of society at large, really. So I thought if we can really shift the workplace to be somewhere where. It actually lays the foundations for people to reach their potential, you know, optimal wellbeing. You know what a, what a different world we would live in. Sounds very idealistic, but I really do believe that we can do it. 

[00:03:48] Peter: So my first question is this. How are companies reacting to this? Because companies, you know, at least in the US, companies don't particularly like spending money on anything that doesn't help their bottom line, obviously. Mental health and mental wellbeing in the workplace does help the bottom line, but that's a hard explanation to give. I've been there. So how are, how are companies, uh, reacting to that first and foremost? 

[00:04:06] Teresa: Yeah, great question and you're right. I think there's still some attitudes that we need to change around wellbeing as a fluffy topic and that it's a nice to have but not actually imperative to your business success. But the good thing is there's, you know, the, the bodies of evidence of studies and case studies. Just, uh, continuing to rise and really, really being able to show that r roi, I call it return on happiness, to show the difference between a company that does foster, you know, positive experience for their employees and emo, um, employee wellbeing compared to one that doesn't or that does it surface level. So it's really about kind of presenting the figures, you know, talking to the people who are making the big decisions, because that's another thing that I think is really important. You know, getting the C-suite and people in leadership roles really involved so that it's not just a bottom up, it's a, you know, a top down and a bottom up approach. And that does really work. It's still, you know, it's still difficult. I think there are a lot of companies out there that are doing what, what's sort of known as like wellbeing, washing, similar. What people do on pride and things like that is sort of saying that they do it, but. You know, doing the opposite.

[00:05:16] Peter: Well, I mean, that's my, that was my next question. You know, the, we are, we're all familiar with, you know, uh, what are they doing for mental health? Oh, they're allowing wacky tie days on Friday. You know, it, it, it's, it's, you know, or free sandwiches does not equate to mental health and mental, mental, uh, caring. And so I think that, that one of the big. Um, issues that I've seen is that companies say, this sounds like a great idea, but then again, it's that question of actually getting 'em to commit because there's no, you know, the ROI isn't immediately seen. 

[00:05:45] Teresa: Yes. Yeah. And I think what we are seeing now because of this, is we are seeing kind of mass exodus at companies where people are, are leaving, you know, the great resignation or we wanna call it the great awakening. Either way, people are looking for a very different experience, particularly Gen Z. And millennials. And so if a company doesn't start to do these things, it's, you know, when you look to, to, to start a new company, if your company doesn't have a flexible working policy that doesn't have some sort of ea and that doesn't kind of offer some kind of wellbeing provision, it's gonna make you think twice about whether you take their offer because money's not everything, as we all know. And again, the research shows that people would rather take a pay cut to have those things and go and work for an organization that doesn't have that now. It's pretty shocking at what the kind of world is like at the moment, because I don't know if you'd, you'd seen that, you know, Google's laid off a load of staff just now, 

[00:06:39] Peter: including their, including the director of mental health and wellbeing. Yes, I saw that. 

[00:06:43] Teresa: So that's, you know, really, really scary considering that some, the company like Google is doing that. It's just, 

[00:06:49] Peter: that's also really telling, because if a company is big and as, as supposedly forward thinking as Google doesn't give a shit, why should any other company. 

[00:06:56] Teresa: Well, yes, it's true, but I'm, I I think it's also a very, very bad move for Google because they're losing their credibility as an employer. Like their, their employee brand is really suffering because it's not just about the businesses, it's about the people that work there and, and we, people that work that have as much sort of say in terms of, you know, whether they wanna work at an organization like that or whether they want to go and work for Microsoft. You have all of those benefits. So it's a about, you know, the companies really need to think about what their brand reputation is because that does, you know, in a marketplace it's gonna get more and more difficult now for, you know, jobs for everybody. That's something that everybody's gonna be looking at. Yeah. And how much money does it cost? I was gonna say, how much money does it cost to, to recruit somebody? Especially for a company like Google, you're probably thinking, you know, it's in the grands isn't it? So you don't wanna be not being able to retain your staff, cuz that's just gonna cost you more and more. So it'll be interesting to see the data on that bad decision and how that's gonna infect Google because it is gonna really affect them. I. . 

[00:08:01] Peter: Well, I think that's really the question, you know, is it we, and we'll have to wait and see on that. But I, I mean, I agree with you. I just, I feel like, you know, and, and this is maybe the, the New York City cynic and me, I just feel like companies that try, uh, you know, oh, we're gonna care, wanna care, you know, Google's, I mean, do you remember who Google's original motto, company motto was? Back in like the, the, the early two thousands? 

[00:08:20] Teresa: No, I don't think I do.

[00:08:22] Peter: It was literally don't be evil. Oh wow. Yeah, that was their, that was their corporate motto, their corporate culture motto. And, and they publicized it and they talked about it and they go, we're gonna be the good company. Because back then Microsoft and, you know, Yahoo, were the bad companies and. All of a sudden, you know, here they are laying off their, their, their, their vice president of, of, of mental health and wellbeing. So I, I, I think that companies talk a lot of, talk a great game and I wanna do this. And I think it's a lot harder to sell that story, um, in the real world because at the end of the day, you know, they're, they're shareholders are looking at the next quarter and not the next quarter centuries, which is, which is obviously a much bigger problem. Talk. What are you doing into, in terms of once you get into a company, you know, are you, are you listening? Are you holding sessions? How, how does this whole process work? Because, um, I remember the one time I did work for a company back in the nineties, I worked for America Online, and they had someone in-house who actually, uh, was a mental health, and this is, this is again the mid nineties, so that was pretty impressive that they were that forward thinking. And they had someone where you could just go in, you could say, Hey, you know, having a bad day, not having a good time, having a mental health day. And again, before any of this was, was popular. So, so how does it work from a consulting point of view?

[00:09:29] Teresa: Yeah. So what we do is we kind of go in and we just really get to understand the organization. We look at the values, we look at how the values are being lived. We look at the kind of main challenges around the people. We look at what they're doing really well, what they could do better, and then we speak to, um, the employees and we kind of find out anonymously what they're thinking. Cause I think. , that's a big thing. You know, companies have a lot of in-house surveys and things like that, but people are quite reticent to be honest. Completely, because there's kind of like a lot of fear about, you know, will I, right, will I be looked at differently if I say that I've got a mental health condition or that I'm struggling, or, you know what? How does my culture support mental health and wellbeing as it is now. So we kinda understand the energy of the organization, what's going on, what's going on that can't be seen, and then we kind of present that to, um, the C-suite or the people team, and we sort of talk about. , you know, what we can do to support them, what they wanna focus on first. Cuz sometimes you go in and there's quite a lot of things that they didn't realize are going on. So it's almost, you know, too much of a big job to do everything all in one go. So it's like, where do we start first? So that can be things like helping them to set up like wellbeing champions so that they're embedding wellbeing more regularly within their culture because it's gotta be kind of a movement that goes forward. We do a lot of workshops and webinars, training. Taking like a design thinking approach to the employee experience. So thinking about when you have new starters, like what's their experience like, how do we deal with, um, you know, when somebody comes to us with a problem, how do we make more space in our teams so that we are having more interaction socially? Because a lot of companies we work with now become completely remote. So you have to be really intentional about that employee experience. You know, as a brand, like how do we want our employees, what are our team rituals? How do we embed wellbeing so that it's not something that we're having to deal with when it reaches crisis point, that we've kind of creating a culture where people can come and talk about things. So we are supporting each other. So when we have a team meeting, somebody says, we do a check-in and someone says, I'm having a bit of a bad day today. , we are normalizing it cuz you and I both know as well, people that have ADHD you know, sometimes we are, we are having a terrible day, sometimes we're having a great day. But sometimes it's difficult to say that you are without, you know, fear of being judged because you don't wanna seem like you can't do the job or that, you know, they can't trust you. So there's so many things around that. So what we do is we try to really help, well, not we try, we do help the organizations to, to really look at that and then just getting some defining, um, ways of approaching that as an organization and as teams and as individuals. And we do, um, some really cool offsites and sort of revolutionary retreats where we look. Kind of issues are within leadership, and then we create kind of like a two day conference, which is much more based on sort of like human potential and like how we can be the best leaders and really kind of like changing the mindset in more of a kind of intense short way, which, which are really successful. Um, and we do panel talks like loads of things. We, we, what we do as an organization is we just try to be really innovative and approach mental health in a very different way than, uh, the sort of traditional sort of pathology of it. 

[00:12:58] Peter: Awesome. I love it. Well, the website is called the wellness revolution.co.uk and you can find everyone there, you can find the whole team there. And it is really great to have you on the podcast. I appreciate you taking the time. It is. With any luck, this is sort of the start of, you know, more and more people understanding that, that there is something here and that we have. Uh, pay attention. We can't just let this go, right, Teresa? 

[00:13:23] Teresa: Oh, definitely. And I wanted to, to give you a, a, a really interesting stat actually. Yeah, please. For those leaders out there that, um, are still kind of struggling to see the, the real kind of returns on it. D Deloitte did a report here recently, I think it was last year actually, so it could do with renewing now. But they said that for every pound that's spent, and obviously I know it's in pounds, not dollars for every pound that's spent on wellbeing and mental health interventions, company receives up to six pounds back in returns on reduced absenteeism, reduced presenteeism, reduce, and um, higher retention rates. So there really is like such a business case and I think what we're gonna see from now on, as well as obviously with things being so uncertain with economic kind of unrest, is that this is the main, you know, people are our highest value assets if we think about it like, So if we look after our people and they're, we are supporting their mental health cause we're still kind of suffering the fallout from Covid, you know, psychologically. that's still very much kind of impacting people in different ways. If we really do sort of, you know, give those foundations for our people to flourish, our business will flourish. It's a natural thing. So just, yeah. I hope that's kind of stuck into some people's heads and that they'll really start to look at it differently.

[00:14:40] Peter: I love it. I love it. Teresa, this is great. Thank you so much for taking the time. I really appreciate it. 

[00:14:45] Teresa: Oh, it's my pleasure. 

[00:14:46] Peter: Guys, as always, you know the drill Faster Than Normal is for you. We wanna know what you want to hear. Shoot us a note, let us know. And, uh, the children's book is coming out, should be out in about a month. The title is The Boy With the Faster Brain, so we are really excited for that. Stay tuned for more on that next week and we will see you next week. A D H D in all forms of neurodiversity are gift not a curse. Pay attention to your mental health. It is just as important, if not more so than your physical health. We'll see you soon. Thanks for listening! 

Credits: You've been listening to the Faster Than Normal podcast. We're available on iTunes, Stitcher and Google play and of course at www.FasterThanNormal.com I'm your host, Peter Shankman and you can find me at shankman.com and @petershankman on all of the socials. If you like what you've heard, why not head over to your favorite podcast platform of choice and leave us a review, come more people who leave positive reviews, the more the podcast has shown, and the more people we can help understand that ADHD is a gift, not a curse. Opening and closing themes were composed and produced by Steven Byrom who also produces this podcast, and the opening introduction was recorded by Bernie Wagenblast. Thank you so much for listening. We'll see you next week! 

Feb 15, 2023

Evie Kirshner is an 18 year old gap year student studying in Israel on Kivunim. She graduated from the Heschel school and will be attending Emory university in the fall. Evie has ADHD and anxiety. In her spare time, she loves photography, watching movies, and reading. Today we learn why she was diagnosed early in her life, about some of the choices and decisions she’s made thus far, how they’re working out and her advice to you. Enjoy! 

In this episode Peter and Evie Kirshner discuss:  

00:40 - Thank you so much for listening and for subscribing!

01:05 - The Boy With the Faster Brain comes out in about a month!!

01:40 - Intro and welcome Evie Kirshner

01:50 - How’s the weather in Israel today?  Ref: The Kivunim Institute 

02:34 - So you were diagnosed in 1st grade. Tell us your story?

03:28 - Kind of how things go in first grade with ADHD or ADD

04:23 - What were some of your symptoms? Did you get in trouble much?

04:40 - Were you put on meds? Did they work?

05:20 - To sparkle or not to sparkle…

06:20 - You can't live the rest of your life just talking out of turn; or can you!? What happened?

07:02 - On resolution and resolve

07:54 - Is there anything you think you may need to change? Or for in the future?

09:05 - What was your parents’ reaction upon your diagnosis? 

10:00 - What would you tell a kid who's seven years old and getting diagnosed today?

10:20 - How can people find more about you? 

Socials: @EVKirshner on INSTA and Snapchat

11:28 - Faster Than Normal Podcast info & credits.Guys, as always thanks so much for subscribing! Faster Than Normal is for YOU! We want to know what you’d like to hear! Do you have a cool friend with a great story? We’d love to learn about, and from them. I'm www.petershankman.com and you can reach out anytime via email at peter@shankman.com or @petershankman on all of the socials. You can also find us at @FasterNormal on all of the socials. It really helps when you drop us a review on iTunes and of course, subscribe to the podcast if you haven’t already! As you know, the more reviews we get, the more people we can reach. Help us to show the world that ADHD is a gift, not a curse! 

TRANSCRIPT via Descript and then corrected.. somewhat:

[00:00:42] Peter: Hi everyone. Welcome to Faster Than Normal. My name is Peter Shankman. It is great to have you for another episode. If you are binging this welcome back. Uh, someone emailed me today and they go, Hey, I found your podcast last week. I'm like, really? Which one? How many episodes do they go? All of them. I'm like, Just doing some quick math in my head. That's a lot of time, but either way, I am thrilled that you're here. It's great to have you guys. And if you haven't already heard, uh, the Children's book is launching in about a month. It is called The Boy With the Faster Brain. So I am super, super excited about that. We have a fun guest today. We're going to Israel. We are going to the Promised Land today to talk to Evie Kirschner, who's an 18 year old gap year student. She's studying in Israel on Kivunim, and she'll explain what that is. She graduated from the Herschel School. She'll be attending Emory University in the fall. She has ADD and anxiety, and she got diagnosed when she was in first grade, so around seven years old. I love talking to kids who are like 18 years old. They're like, yeah, I got diagnosed in first grade. I'm like, Mike Ben, when I was in first grade. They didn't even know what ADHD was. Welcome to the show. It's good to have you. 

[00:01:40] Evie: Thank you. 

[00:01:41] Peter: Well it's snowing here in New York. How's the weather in Israel?

[00:01:44] Evie: Oh, it's, it's actually pouring rain. I just got caught in the rain actually. It's not pretty out.

[00:01:49] Peter: Okay. And I don't feel so bad. good. Alright. Well, welcome to the podcast. Glad to have you. So I discovered you because I have lots of friends who send me articles and stuff all the time and say, oh, this person is adhd, you's interviewing them, and, and you caught my eye cause you wrote a beautiful article and you so, so first of all, tell us what you're doing in Israel. 

[00:02:07] Evie: This year I'm studying and traveling on a program called Kivunim. So five months out of the year we're studying, like basically taking college classes, you know, five days a week. And then for three months out of the eight we are traveling around the world. I'm going to 13 different countries and studying contemporary culture and ancient history and Jewish history and communities that existed in all those countries. So it's like, it's really cool stuff. It's, it's pretty awesome. 

[00:02:34] Peter: That's very, very cool. So let's talk about ADHD so you were diagnosed in first grade. What was that like? What was what? How did it come about? What the teachers say? Tell me your story. 

[00:02:43] Evie: I thought it was cancer. . I, I was so em embarrassed. I was fir when I was told I was devastated and I wouldn't tell anybody. It was like my deepest orca secret. I thought it was the only person in the world with adhd. My parents like sat me down and told me. I mean, they were running tests on my brain at NYU by the time I was eight. Really? Yes. I had a severe case especially, and this was in 19? This was in 2000, 2011. 12. Okay. I was always told I had the energy of a boy inside a girl and they had never seen anything like it, and that made me feel. I was like, oh no, I'm, I'm secretly like, have the energy of a boy, and this is like, I can't tell anyone. I have this like, big, heavy secret weighing on me. 

[00:03:28] Peter: Yeah. And that's in first grade. In first grade, that's kinda hard to handle. 

[00:03:31] Evie: Oh, it was really hard to handle. I was devastated and I, I, I really felt it all the time. Like I had something that made me different that I couldn't tell people about. Um, and I think, like as I got older, you know, people always say to me, well, everyone's a little ADD everyone's a little ADHD , and I'm like, well, hmm, hmm. . Um, I think like when you're, you know, doing, you're getting up in first grade and spinning circles around your desk while everyone's sitting and writing, I think like there's a difference. You know, there's the, there's dozing off and then there's like, actually there's not being able to function in a classroom at seven years old. 

[00:04:09] Peter: Yep. So what was, is that, was that some of the symptoms you were just a little, little hyper, a little. 

[00:04:14] Evie: I was hyper, I was crazy. I was, time and place did not occur to me. I kind of marched to the beat of my own drum. 

[00:04:23] Peter: Okay. That's funny. It's exactly what my mother used to tell me all the time. did it. Uh, did it get you in trouble at all? . 

[00:04:29] Evie: Oh, all the time. I was in the principal's office, like I'd say until high school, almost every day of, of middle school, at least. I think like in lower school, they were more lenient on me. Yeah. But I was in the, yeah, I was in the principals a lot. 

[00:04:43] Peter: So you were diagnosed in first grade, but were you put on meds? What happened?

[00:04:47] Evie: I was put on meds in third grade actually. Um, and I stayed on the same meds almost every day until my junior year of high school. Okay. 

[00:04:57] Peter: And were they, do you, did you feel like they were, did you feel like, did you feel like they were working?

[00:05:01] Evie: Oh, they were totally working, but they dulled my sparkle. Yeah. So I decided it was, it was time to let it go. 

[00:05:11] Peter: I understand that. And so, so when you say dulled your sparkle, why .Did it make you, obviously it made you more focused, but it, did it take away that ooph or did it take away that creativity?

[00:05:20] Evie: It took, it took away the oomph. It took away a lot of, it just kind of suppressed everything. It's almost as if, the way I describe it to people, like it's if you turn the saturation down, I'm like the way you, the way you see everything. 

[00:05:32] Peter: So you decided to get off of it in seventh grade. 

[00:05:35] Evie: Um, in junior year of high school I started oh, junior 

[00:05:37] Peter: high school. Okay. Okay. But you said you were in the principal's office a lot in high school? No, in middle school. In middle s. Okay. I'm confused. So you were on the meds and still gonna the principal's office. Oh yes. Interesting. Okay. And what were, what were your charges? What were you, what were you usually busted for?

[00:05:53] Evie: Um, making an inappropriate song in the middle of class. , um, texting, um, chatting with a friend over here, not being able to control what came outta my mouth, things like that. Examples like, 

[00:06:09] Peter: All right, so obviously there are a ton of people listening right now who hear themselves in your story, , I mean, including me. Um, so what did you do, right? It's obviously you can't live the rest of your life just talking at a turn. I mean, maybe you can. So what happened?

[00:06:26] Evie: I think it actually wasn't necessarily anything that changed in me, but something that changed in the people around me in that I think they realized I was a well-intentioned kid. Smart. I had a good head on my shoulders and I meant, I meant well. Um, I was loving and deep down I was really respectful. I just didn't always show respect and often displayed disrespect. But, um, it had nothing to do with how I felt about my teachers or my peers and more to do with something that I was struggling with internally.

[00:07:00] Peter: Interesting. So, am I getting sort of the feeling that you just, for lack of a better word, just decided I'm gonna live my life. 

[00:07:09] Evie: Yeah, I did. I think like, I mean, I'm still at the point where I'm, you know, deciding, okay, I don't have to change this. I don't have to be self-conscious about this anymore. People around me are gonna have to learn to accept this, and I don't have to be the one that stops kicking the desk or stops, you know, biting my fingernails or dozing off or seeming like I'm not paying attention when someone's speaking because if they know me well enough, they'll know that I am. . And I think like I'm, I think I'm still getting to that point in many ways and I'll see other ways in which that manifests itself over time. But I think I have like chucked a lot of it in the efit bucket like I think that, um, there were many things, especially the way it manifests itself in the classroom, that I just said to myself, okay, so this might be something that I have to explain to teachers, not change, 

[00:07:54] Peter: Is there anything that you think may have to change? I mean, I, I am all in the category of, hey, here's who I am, deal with it. But I also know that there are times, right. Especially in my quote unquote adult life, um, where I have to, okay, you're, you're going to listen to this visiting professor. You probably shouldn't make a joke in the middle class, or things like that. Mm-hmm. . So are there any points that you've seen that yet?

[00:08:17] Evie: Yes. So I think now that I'm kind of in a more of a college setting, um, I find that, and even in high school, I find that when it, when it gets hard and I feel impulses coming on, or it's hard for me to sit still in class, I just, I just leave and come back. Okay. Or I'll do, I'll do something else. I can't be sitting still with thoughts and impulses and wanting to speak, and I'll either be doodling or tapping my foot or bit like, uh, or, or I'll just leave the room. 

[00:08:49] Peter: Interesting. Interesting. So you are, you've basically accepted what you have. You don't take meds for it and you're sort of pulling a a, a Greatest Showman. This is me. 

[00:09:02] Evie: Yes. This is me. . 

[00:09:04] Peter: Awesome. Okay. What did your, um, parents, uh, how were they when you first got diagnosed? What was their, what was their, uh, reaction?

[00:09:13] Evie: They, well, I, they took it very seriously, which is I think why I thought it was such a huge deal. They were like, you have ADHD , we're gonna take you to a therapist, get you meds. And I was like, oh shit. I'm like, dying of something as hard . I was, I was really, I was really scared. Um, but my parents took it very seriously. I, lucky enough, I have a mom who works in the world of learning disabilities um, and she very much like got me the help I needed academically early on. You know, taught me that it's a, it's a gift, not a curse. And, um, even though I felt for a lot of my childhood, like it was, and I think I, I had parents who always reminded me that I'm gonna realize one day that my, I actually really do love the way my brain works. 

[00:09:59] Peter: Awesome. I love that. So what would you tell a kid who's, uh, seven years old getting diagnosed? 

[00:10:05] Evie: That their brain is beautiful. Mm-hmm. .And it might take time to realize. And other people are gonna see it first. And other people are gonna tell you it's not there, but you'll see it over time. 

[00:10:17] Peter: Very, very cool. Very, very cool. Tell us how people can find you. Are you on any of the socials? 

[00:10:23] Evie: I am, I'm on social media. I am on Instagram and Snapchat. I don't really have any other, 

[00:10:30] Peter: what's your username on Instagram? I. 

Evie Kirshner, the letters E & V K I R S H N E R. 

Okay. Very cool. Well, okay. Thank you so much for taking the time. I appreciate it. 

[00:10:42] Evie: Thank you.

I'm gonna have you back, I'm gonna have you back next year and see how, uh, Emory's treating you. I have a lot of friends who went there.

Oh, really? Okay. Well that'd be awesome. I'm looking forward to it.

[00:10:50] Peter: Very cool. Guys, you've been listening to Peter Shankman and this is, that was Evie Kirshner talking about Faster Than Normal and talking about how she grew up A D H D and when she finally decided to say screw it, and live her life and sounds to me like she's doing just fine.

We'll be back next week with another episode. As always, wanna hear what you think, you can leave us, review anywhere, you can tell us what's going on. Wanna thank Steven Byrom, who's our editor and producer, who constantly shakes his head when in the middle of an episode I go, oh, by the way, Steven, do this. So we love you, Steven, [Your Producer/editor loves you too, is proud of the work this podcast is doing and hopes that these transcripts are helpful] and uh, we will see you guys next week with another episode of Faster Than Normal, and hopefully by then I'll have some info on when the book will be out. So stay tuned. Thanks for listening. We'll talk to you soon!  

Credits: You've been listening to the Faster Than Normal podcast. We're available on iTunes, Stitcher and Google play and of course at www.FasterThanNormal.com I'm your host, Peter Shankman and you can find me at shankman.com and @petershankman on all of the socials. If you like what you've heard, why not head over to your favorite podcast platform of choice and leave us a review, come more people who leave positive reviews, the more the podcast has shown, and the more people we can help understand that ADHD is a gift, not a curse. Opening and closing themes were composed and produced by Steven Byrom who also produces this podcast, and the opening introduction was recorded by Bernie Wagenblast. Thank you so much for listening. We'll see you next week! 

Feb 8, 2023

Nik's Social Media Channel ADHDVision is a global movement aimed at improving well-being, productivity and overall life quality for people with attention deficit disorder (ADHD). With over 150 Million views in just under 2 years Nik has rapidly created a community of over 1.8 million people who follow him and are inspired by his work to live their BEST life with their brain. He is currently running an international inner circle of ADHD business owners and is on a mission to make the knowledge around creating and thriving as a business owner with ADHD more accessible. Enjoy! 

In this episode Peter and Nik Hobrecker discuss:  

00:40 - Thank you so much for listening and for subscribing!

00:47 - Intro and welcome Nik Hobrecker!

01:47 - Tell us your story; when were you diagnosed?

02:41 - It all was kind of like an ‘explainer bomb’

03:30 - You live in an especially beautiful part of Thailand. How do you stay productive? Ref: Faster Than Normal book

05:00 - On rejection sensitivity and living in a ‘vacation destination’.

06:30 - What have you been learning from your new Mastermind group; how best to lead?

07:30 - Ref: Perfectionism, decision paralysis, imposter syndrome

08:14 - How many people do you have in your group?

08:45 - What are some of the things you’ve learned by running this group?

09:49 - What would you tell an entrepreneur who's just been diagnosed; next steps, etc?

14:40 - How can people find more about you? 

Socials: @ADHDVision:  YouTube  INSTA  TikTok  Twitter

This was great- thank you Nik!

11:37 - Drumroll please:  I have a new book coming out mid-February! The title is….

12:21 - Faster Than Normal Podcast info & credits.

Guys, as always thanks so much for subscribing! Faster Than Normal is for YOU! We want to know what you’d like to hear! Do you have a cool friend with a great story? We’d love to learn about, and from them. I'm www.petershankman.com and you can reach out anytime via email at peter@shankman.com or @petershankman on all of the socials. You can also find us at @FasterNormal on all of the socials. It really helps when you drop us a review on iTunes and of course, subscribe to the podcast if you haven’t already! As you know, the more reviews we get, the more people we can reach. Help us to show the world that ADHD is a gift, not a curse! 

TRANSCRIPT via Descript and then corrected.. somewhat:

[00:00:39] Peter: Hello everyone. Good morning and welcome to another episode of Faster Than Normal. My name is Peter Shankman. I wanna say how many words I could say all in one breath. Good to have you guys. It is a pleasure to see you all again. Talk to you all again. It is wonderful to be back, pretty much back weekly. Now we have a bunch of episodes in the can, so things are good. Let's take a trip today.

Let's take a trip. All the way over to Asia, into Thailand, where we're gonna meet up with Nick Hobrecker. Nick has a really cool backstory and I'll let him tell you, but all what all you need to know is he runs a social media channel called A D H D Vision with over 150 million views. Atta aimed at improving wellbeing, productivity, overall life quality for people with A D H D. Sounds like someone you know. He's created a community of over 1.8 million people who follow him and are inspired by his work to live their best life with their brain. He's running an international circle of ADHD business owners again. Sounds like someone you know. Nick, welcome to the podcast. Good to have you, 

[00:01:35] Nik: Peter. Lovely to be here. Thank you for having me, my friend. 

[00:01:38] Peter: It's great to, great to have you. It's great to find someone on the other side of the world doing the same thing. Tell us your story. How are you diagnosed? How'd you figure it out? Um, how old are you? What's, what's the, what's everything? . 

[00:01:48] Nik: Yeah man. So first of all, I'm from Germany, so, um, the whole notion of ADHD, uh, is still arriving there as we speak. Um, I got diagnosed in college, so quite late. I was about 21. If my memory serves me correctly, probably won't, but about 21. And, um, I was studying entrepreneurship in college. It was my fourth, fifth semester and, you know, classical story, mind blown. My whole life has explained itself to me all in a flash. And that's when I started creating content. I was active on YouTube way before then, you know, I was making funny videos on some random games. You know, Roone Scape League of Legends was always a passion of mine. And then I found a way to channel that passion into something helpful for people, which, um, you know, has now gained me that, uh, the amount of followers and, and the views that, that you just mentioned. I'm very grateful for it. I'm really, really happy to be able to reach the people that I do. And, um, Yeah. It's just, you know, showing people what my journey has been and trying my best to, to educate, uh, them so they don't have to say, have the same mistakes and go through the same struggles that I did.

[00:02:51] Peter: Yeah, it is, it is a wake up call when you figure out exactly what's going on and how you can use that to your advantage, isn't it? 

[00:03:00] Nik: It is, it's, it's huge. Um, you know, I keep going back to the same thing, saying the same thing, but it always, for me it's just, it's like an explainer bomb, right? All of a sudden, you know Exactly, um, who you are, why you do the things you do, and why you've been different your whole life. And, um, yeah, wanted to give that, that knowledge and that awareness to more people, because for me, it was a game changer. Ever since then, my, my life completely turned. 

[00:03:27] Peter: Tell me about, uh, an average day for you. Cause right now you're in, you're in Poquette, Thailand, which is one of the most beautiful places in the world. It's, it's a favorite place of mine. I've been there many, many times and I don't necessarily know how productive I'd be living in a place like Phuket Thailand. So tell us what you're doing to, to sort of stay productive and how are, how are you surviving that? 

[00:03:46] Nik: Man, let me, let me tell you, it's . It's a constant struggle, but, uh, there are a few routines in place, um, you know, occasional fun routines that I use to, to, uh, to stay on top of everything. So I do also wanna mention Peter, I, you know, your book Faster Than Normal helped me, um, a lot when I got diagnosed and it was actually part of my inspiration to go out and use my brain for, um, for its benefits. And, uh, what you mentioned in your book, uh, has stayed true, you know, pretty much ever since I've read it, which is just exercising, right, um, exercising in the morning, not just doing something for the dopamine for that reward chemical at the end, but doing something because you enjoy it. I really enjoy running. , right. Um, so every morning I try to do my run. I, I try to do my, my ab exercises. Um, I've got a gym just around the corner. Accessibility is everything, right? If the gym is around the corner, the motivation hurdle is a lot less steep. So that helps me. And other than that, you know what? Thailand is beautiful and the nature just also gives you that energy, right? There's been different studies, I think, on A D H D and nature and how can I help you focus. We've got a beautiful garden, outback, um, and you know, sometimes it's just great to to, to tank up the creativity that, that I need for from my videos.

[00:04:59] Peter: That's awesome. So it's, I mean, it's a beautiful, there's no question it's a beautiful location. Um, how is it working there in an environment that, that doesn't necessarily lend itself to work, per se? I mean, tell us what you're doing. Like, you know, what do you do to get sort of like a dopamine hit in the middle of the day. Are you gonna go out and run on the beach or are you gonna go for a swim or, you know, tell me about that. 

[00:05:18] Nik: What I like to do is just do something different to what I usually do. So it's just novelty. Novelty for me, gives me that dopamine kick, gives me that creative spark that I need to create new and and meaningful content. So, uh, for me it's just all about exploring this, this beautiful place. You know, we've, we've done so many different trips. I'm here with two of my very good high school friends who are also, you know, we like to call ourselves digital nomads, right? So we travel the world don't really have one specific place that we stay. And we just like to explore this, this beautiful island. I mean, you yourself, I think you've been here, Peter, right? It's, it's beautiful. You have um, this amazing culture shock of just, by the way, people are amazingly nice here. Yeah. Which is very nice for rejection sensitivity, cuz you never get rejected. Everybody's so nice to you, you know? Yeah. Um, on the one hand, on the other hand, you've got these, these beautiful beaches, these um, these amazing, I mean, we went to this huge statue of like a big Buddha. Um, it was a bit of a steep climb, but we went up there and inside this Buddha, they were actually meditating. Meditation has been a huge remedy for me and my A D H D right? Mindfulness. Um, and even though it's a struggle, um, sitting there in a big Buddha meditating with monks, I never knew I had a bucket list until that. You know what I mean? So that was, that was crazy. 

[00:06:33] Peter: That's very cool. Tell me about, um, let's, let's flip gears a little bit to the business side of things. Tell me about what you're doing in terms of, so you run a mastermind or, or a, a group. Yeah. Um, all focused, adhd. Are people coming to you with, are you finding that people coming to you from an ADHD standpoint with all the same problems? Um, you know, the lack of focus, the ability is everything different? 

[00:06:52] Nik: I mean, look, this mastermind that I'm now creating, right? We are in the very early stages. You know, it's, um, there's a lot of things that we still need to get right, but um, it's an experiment and we're testing things out, um, to see what's gonna give everybody the most value in the long term. Um, and what I've found, and the reason for creating this mastermind for ADHD Entrepreneurs in the first place is, you know, A D H D is often put on a pedestal when it comes to entrepreneurship, which it should be. We are great entrepreneurs, right? Five times more likely to start a business, et cetera. But, um, you know, we really talk about the struggles that do come with owning a business and having a D H D, right? Perfectionism, uh, decision paralysis, imposter syndrome. , all these different things that, that mass up into this, uh, big, you know, ball of, well, what the hell do I do now? Right? And that's where the inception of the group came from to have a support system. Right? One family that supports one another that gets one another, right? I think as business owners, Peter, you're probably gonna relate to this, is just as ADHD business owners, we often don't feel like the other people get it. You. 95% of people usually don't. And having a circle of like-minded people who get each other, um, and who can network with each other all at the same time, um, so far has been proving incredibly valuable. 

[00:08:14] Peter: Awesome. Uh, how many people do you have in the group?

[00:08:16] Nik: Right now? We've got 13. I wanna keep it really small because this is, you know, we're starting out. It's, it's an experiment. I wanna get everybody's feedback. I wanna make this the most kick ass group. Um, there, there is. And, um, you know, to do that, uh, we gotta dig down in the trenches and I wanna, you know, I've got feedback calls lined up with everybody. Um, and it's more like that we're creating this group together rather than just me, you know, spearheading it.

[00:08:38] Peter: Yep. That's awesome. That's awesome. What, what have you learned, um, about yourself from running a group like that? Because, I mean, I know that when I ran, when I run mine, one of the things I learned consistently, consistently, consistently over and over again is that I'm, that any problem I think I can have, right? Any problem I think that I, I'm probably the only person in the world that has this, there's no one else with, is not everyone has the same issues. Um, we just don't talk about 'em a lot. Right. So when you get into a group and you start doing that, it changes everything. So what are some of the things that you've learned?

[00:09:04] Nik: I mean, yeah, it's just, it's just exactly what you said. So I'm, I'm very fortunate to be in the position of being, um, you know, a bystander to listen to these amazing, vulnerable stories that do get shared. Um, and, you know, these are all very successful business owners that we have in this group. And you know what a lot of them talk about is, you know, problems like not really being understood, right. Wanting to people please everybody, even though it's your business. And, you know, certain things like that where you just, you. And you're like, damn, that's been, that's exactly been my experience. I just haven't been able to verbalize it. And just hearing that from people feeling at home is, I mean, I don't think there's any, um, any higher value than, than that. 

[00:09:48] Peter: Yeah, no question about it. What would you tell an entrepreneur who's just gotten diagnosed and who has all these questions and, and, and really doesn't know what the next step is? 

[00:09:58] Nik: Well, um, it's a great question. I don't think I can answer that in like one or two sentences, but the first thing that I would wanna tell them is that you've got a unique set of strengths that work for you, and you should use those strengths, get better at those strengths, right? Build your strengths, but. Try to outsource your weaknesses rather than like, try your best and like force yourself like, oh, I really have to do these financial, uh, statements right now. Like, no, get a virtual assistant for that. Right? You know, like there are certain things that your brain is just not meant to be doing. If you are an entrepreneur, of course, if you don't have the money, you're gonna have to stick through it. But, you know, virtual assistants are quite affordable nowadays, especially online. I know. Oh, totally. Um, I'm sure Peter, I don't know if, if you have, uh, I mean, how many virtual assistants do you have? Do you have one , two?

[00:10:44] Peter: I've, I've been fortunate. I've had the same assistant going on 15 years now. And she was originally, she originally started with me and then she moved, uh, went and got married. Uh, so she lives in Massachusetts now, but still works for me. Wow. 

[00:10:54] Nik: Well, fif 15 years. That is, um, that is awesome. 

[00:10:56] Peter: She saved my life. She saves my life on a, on a regular basis. 

[00:10:59] Nik: Yeah. Yeah, I hear that. I hear that. I've got one now. You know, we've been together, been together. Sounds, sounds odd, but you know, it's been 3, 4, 5 months. Um, and, um, yeah, she's, she's also been a lifesaver. So, I mean, but to get back to your question, that's what I would say. Focus on your strengths, outsource your weaknesses. 

[00:11:14] Peter: Awesome. I love it. Guys, thank you so much for listening. I really, Nick, thank you so much for taking the time. How can people find you? 

[00:11:21] Nik: Um, just at ADHDVision on Instagram, YouTube, TikTok, you'll find me. Um, I'll be very happy to, uh, share some content with you.

[00:11:31] Peter: I love it guys. Check Nik out. And as always, if you like what you hear, leave us a note. And I told you some good news last week. I'm gonna repeat it again this week. There is a children's book coming out and I can share the name with you now. It is called The Boy with the Faster Brain. And it is, you know, the first question I get every time I say that first question is, oh, is it autobiography? Well, yeah, kind of. But I think you're gonna like it. I think you're gonna enjoy reading it, and it should be coming out mid-February, so I will have a lot more info on that soon. It is gonna be for your kids, anywhere from ages 8 to. 14. It's gonna be a lot of fun, so stay tuned for that. As always, thank you for listening. Thanks to our guest. If you know a guest you think should be on as cool as Nik, shoot us a note, peter@shankman.com or at Peter Shankman, all the socials or @ FasterNormal . We will see you guys next week. As always, thank you for listening. Stay strong. Bye. We'll see you next week.

Credits: You've been listening to the Faster Than Normal podcast. We're available on iTunes, Stitcher and Google play and of course at www.FasterThanNormal.com I'm your host, Peter Shankman and you can find me at shankman.com and @petershankman on all of the socials. If you like what you've heard, why not head over to your favorite podcast platform of choice and leave us a review, come more people who leave positive reviews, the more the podcast has shown, and the more people we can help understand that ADHD is a gift, not a curse. Opening and closing themes were composed and produced by Steven Byrom who also produces this podcast, and the opening introduction was recorded by Bernie Wagenblast. Thank you so much for listening. We'll see you next week! 

Feb 1, 2023

Abbie McCarthy is an award-winning TV / Radio presenter & DJ, you’ll find her hosting BBC Music Introducing in Kent on the airwaves every Saturday night and also bringing great new music & fun interviews to your TV screens on 4Music and E4 Extra with Fresh This Month. Abbie is known for bringing the party with her DJ sets and this year has played at a whole host of festivals, including Glastonbury, Latitude & Knebworth, as well as playing several arena shows. Abbie is also the host and curator of popular gig night Good Karma Club, which has put on early shows for the likes of Tom Grennan, Mae Muller, Easy Life & many more and has even featured some famous faces in the crowds over the years - Alex Turner, Lewis Capaldi & Wolf Alice. Abbie’s huge contribution to both the radio & music industry was celebrated when she was inducted into the Roll of Honour at Music Week’s Women In Music Awards 2018. Abbie has been highlighted by the Radio Academy as one of the brightest young stars in radio, recently featuring in their esteemed 30 under 30 list and winning Silver for Best Music Presenter at the ARIAs 2020. Aside from music, Abbie’s other passion is sport, which really shines through in her entertaining coverage on Matchday Live for Chelsea TV. You’ll also find Abbie guesting frequently on BBC Two’s football show, MOTDx and doing online coverage for England and the Lionesses football teams. How has she been so successful already, especially having just recently been diagnosed, and what advice does she impart to us? Enjoy! 

In this episode Peter and Abbie McCarthy discuss:  

00:40 - Thank you so much for listening and for subscribing!

00:47 - Intro and welcome Abbie ‘AbbieAbbieMac’ McCarthy!

03:00 - So you just got diagnosed a year ago, so tell us your backstory?

05:51 - What rituals have you put into play for yourself to be able to get through the boring stuff?

07:00 - Do you get a dopamine release after having completed a list, or boring stuff?

07:38 - Who happens when you have to quickly adjust course? How do you balance your dopamine producers at all hours of the day and night, as various types of work demands?

10:30 - How do you handle negative criticism, and keep performing at one hundred percent even on tough news days?

12:32 - What have you had to fight through with respect to your being a Millennial, and a Female in a often-times patronizing industry?

14:23 - Americans are learning more about Premier League Football thanks to Ted Lasso. Who’s your team?

14:40 - How can people find more about you? 

Web:  https://abbiemccarthy.co.uk

Socials: @AbbieAbbieMac everywhere:  Twitter  INSTA  TikTok  FB

This was great- thank you Abbie!!

Guys, as always thanks so much for subscribing! Faster Than Normal is for YOU! We want to know what you’d like to hear! Do you have a cool friend with a great story? We’d love to learn about, and from them. I'm www.petershankman.com and you can reach out anytime via email at peter@shankman.com or @petershankman on all of the socials. You can also find us at @FasterNormal on all of the socials. It really helps when you drop us a review on iTunes and of course, subscribe to the podcast if you haven’t already! As you know, the more reviews we get, the more people we can reach. Help us to show the world that ADHD is a gift, not a curse! 

16:00 - Faster Than Normal Podcast info & credits.

TRANSCRIPT via Descript and then corrected.. somewhat:

[00:00:40] Peter: Yo, everyone! Welcome to Faster Than Normal, another episode. Thrilled to have you as always. We got someone fun today to talk about- Abbie McCarthy is joining us from the OK. She's an award-winning TV and radio presenter and DJ. Okay, you'll find her hosting BBC music, introducing intent on the airwaves every Saturday night, and also bringing great new music and fun interviews to your TV screen on 4 Music and Eve four extra with fresh this month. She brings the party with her DJ sets. She has played a whole host of festival. She's played Glastonbury, Latitude & Knebworth, as well as playing several arena shows and she's serious. Like, no joke. She doesn't, she doesn't fuck around. You're gonna, you're gonna like this one. She's the hosting curator of popular Gig Night. Good Karma Club. God, what else has she done? Uh, she was nominated, she was inducted into the role of honor at Music Week's, women in Music Awards 2018. She's been highlighted by the radio academy as one of the brightest young stars in radio, recently featured and their esteemed 30 under 30 lists and winning silvers for best music presenter at the Arias 2020 I. Being in PR week, magazines 30 under 30, and I'm now 50. So yeah, now I'm all pissed off. It's gonna be a shitty interview. All right. Anyway, Abby, welcome. I feel old. How are you?!

[00:02:03] Abbie: Oh, I'm good, thank you. How are you? Thank you so much for having me. 

[00:02:05] Peter: I'm thrilled to have you. So you came to us because you, you were reading Faster Than Normal, the book, and you identified with it, and you found yourself in it.

[00:02:13] Abbie: Absolutely. I really loved it. I just loved the whole concept of it. The fact that you kind of said our our brains are like Lamborghinis. They just work faster than everybody else. But if you do the right things, you can use it quite efficiently. I thought it was a really nice way to approach it. Cause I think there's some books that you read and it's about kind of, Dismissing that you have A D H D or kind of not embracing it. But I thought that the whole approach was great and yeah, I took so much from it. And because I've only recently been diagnosed, it was such a useful book to lose myself in. I actually managed to read it in a couple of days and obviously everyone listened to this that has a D H D knows that's not always, that's not always easy. So I think it, uh, became my hyper focus for a couple of days. I really enjoyed it. 

[00:02:56] Peter: Very true. We don't, we don't normally finish things like that. Um, now tell us, so, so you just got diagnosed a year ago, so tell us your backstory. Tell us about what it was like growing up before you were diagnosed. What was it like as a kid? Did you, what was school like for you? Things like that.

[00:03:10] Abbie: I think I'm one of those classic people where, I was, I was, I was okay at school. I got like fairly good grades and I was always being told off for talking too much, which obviously makes a lot of sense now and I think that would happen more and more in the classes of things that I wasn't particularly interested in. Uh, you know, you mentioned at the start, I do lots of different things within music and, and some within sport as well. So I'm, I'm a creative person, so some of the more academic subjects I didn't particularly like, but I. Was Okay and, and got good grades, um, which maybe was why it wasn't picked up, I guess, when I was a teenager. Uh, but I, it's, I have this thing where I guess I. I just always felt like I was different, but I couldn't quite put my finger on why. And you know, even as I've got older and I've got to do some great things in my professional life, like being on the radio to me is my dream job. I still can't believe I get to do that. I get to go on the airwaves, pick amazing music, and connect with people and share it with them, but that's awesome. You know, it's, it's. It's, you know, you might look at me and be like, oh, she's getting to do her dream job. But then it's like, it's more like all the things I struggle with at home, I guess. It's like, you know, keeping on top of errands and, and things like that and organizing other aspects of, of my life. And I think that's the thing with A D H D, isn't it? Someone on the surface might look a certain way, but you never know what's. Going on in, in somebody's head. Do you, you know, my brain is racing constantly. Yeah. Um, but you know, I've, I've managed to, to hold down a job and I guess I'm lucky because it's , it's, it is in things that I'm interested in, so that makes it easier too. 

[00:04:50] Peter: Well, that's, I mean, that's really the key. You know, we, we all have to realize, you know, there are people who, who don't have faster than normal brains who can just sort of wake up, go to their job every day, do it for 40 years, retire, get their little gold watch, you know, and, and whether they love the job or not, is irrelevant to them. I. It's a means to an end. It's a way to make money. If we don't love what we're doing, we're not doing it well. 

[00:05:10] Abbie: Yeah. Or you just don't wanna do it full stop. Exactly. So I feel so blessed to be doing something that I absolutely love and I. I'm so excited to go into work every day and the, you know, what I do is really varied as well, which I think works with our brains too. Like, I'm not gonna get bored. Each week can be very, very different. Sometimes I'm in the studio doing a radio show, then it's something like festival season where I'm kind of here, there and everywhere DJing. It might be going to interview somebody, you know, on the other side of the country. It might be going to a gig somewhere else. So it, it's, yeah, it's, it keeps it interesting. It's, it keeps it lively. 

[00:05:43] Peter: Tell me about, um, so let's talk about the stuff you're not that great at. Let's talk about like, you know, what is it like to, you know, running the errands, things like that. What kind of, um, sort of rituals have you put into play for yourself to be able to get through the, the, the, the boring stuff?

[00:05:57] Abbie: I actually got this piece of advice from somebody on social media when I first posted that I'd got a diagnosis and they were saying the things that you don't enjoy, things like housework and errands and food shopping. It's almost like, think of it in a different way, sort of set yourself, um, a bit of a competition or like, so you're trying to do it in the quickest amount of time or, you know, you set yourself a reward once you've finished it, things like that. So then actually that those, those activities aren't just draining. You are in some way getting a little bit of dopamine and I think it's just like picking the right time in the day to do some of this stuff as well. I think now I try and get up, exercise is a big one for me and I know it's for, for you as well from, from reading your book, getting up, going to the gym, even if I don't feel like it, which I don't a lot of the time, I always feel so much better afterwards than kind of getting all of those errands and boring things out of the way and then I can just enjoy the rest of my day and I kind of don't feel the guilt that I haven't done all the, all the adult things I guess that I think I should have. 

[00:07:02] Peter: Well, it's interesting because that there is a, there are some studies that say that getting the boring stuff and stuff that you don't love getting it done is actually a dopamine release. Um, once they're all, not from doing them per se, but from that feeling you get of, oh, I don't have to do them anymore because I did them. 

[00:07:17] Abbie: Yeah, that's true. Yeah. You actually completed something that you set out to do, so that's gonna give you a buzz, isn't it? 

[00:07:22] Peter: Talk about, uh, some times where it's not that easy. Have things happened, whether you are in, uh, you know, whether you're at work or whatever? How do you deal with the things that, you know, you're, you're going a million miles an hour, right? When you're, when you're DJing or when you're working whatever, you're going a million miles an hour. What happens when you have to adjust course, uh, suddenly when you suddenly, you know, find yourself going off track or something like that. How do you keep yourself going, especially in a high energy job like that, because there's really only so much dopamine mean you can give. Uh, to get through over the course of a day, right. At some point, you know, I know that, that if I time it right, I give a keynote, I get done with the keynote, I get into the airport, get back onto the plane, and that's when I pass out. Right. So, how are you sometimes you're doing, I, I, especially as a DJ you're doing late, late nights, right? You know, into, into the wee hours in the morning. How are you holding that up? How are you keeping yourself aligned? 

[00:08:14] Abbie: I think when I am DJing or I'm, yeah, playing a big event, I get so in the zone. I get so pumped for it. So I kind of have enough energy to, to get through it. I think the thing that I struggle with the most is when I've had, you know, a really great run of work, so something like festival season or because I work in football, you know, the, the Premier League season that we have over here. I've just been getting to work on loads of games with that. When that stops and there's just naturally a tiny little lull in work, and I say a lull, it's like four days or something, and. Get really down cuz I'm like, I dunno what to do with all of this energy that I've got. I almost dunno how to, to harness it. And then I have a real low and I'm kind of waiting for the buzz and the high again of, of doing all the things that I love. And I think that's been a learning experience for me is when I have these days off. Which I really crave when I'm in the thick of it. You know, when you are like working back to back and you're traveling everywhere, you can't wait for a day where you are. You can just not think about work and relax. But when it gets to those days, I find it really hard to actually lean into them. So that's something I need to work on to be honest. Um, but the other thing that I think is a bit of a struggle in the job that I do, and maybe you'll relate to this or other people will relate to this. Do more of a kind of public facing job is, you know, the sensitivity we can have to rejection and criticism. It's very much part of my job, you know, it'll be like, I'll be presenting something or I'll send off a show reel sometimes I'm super lucky and I get the job. Sometimes I don't. That's just part of the business, but I might then be really upset about that for a little while, and I think sometimes. The emotional deregulation thing. I can f I can feel a little bit. So that can be hard. I guess if you are, you're in the fields and you're not feeling so great and then you've gotta, you know, go on air and give people a good show, give people a good time. But sometimes I imagine that's a savior because you kind of have to put on this. I thought, great, let's have a good time. And you're doing it for other people. You're doing it for that feeling. It'll give somebody else. And the connection that you have with you and your listeners is really special. So you kind of wanna keep that. So sometimes in a way it can get you out of your funk, which I think is good. 

[00:10:30] Peter: That's actually a really interesting point because I imagine that, you know, especially as a creative right, you do these amazing DJ sets, you, you're, you know, on the radio, whatever, and then yeah. You know, millions of people might love it, but there's one person who posted comments somewhere that's negative and that's all we think about, right? The same thing happens to me in keynotes. Mm-hmm. , but it's a real, you, you, you gave us a really interesting point, the concept of going on stage and having to put on that smile regardless of whether you're feeling it or not. You know, you don't have a choice, right? Mm-hmm. . So I would think that, yeah, in a lot of ways that's probably very, very helpful because you know that which you believe you eventually achieve, so, right? So, so you, you put that happy face on, you give that speech or you, you do that set at the end of it, you're gonna have that dopamine regardless. So it's a nice sort of, a nice sort of, uh, I guess, cheat sheet to get out of it. 

[00:11:20] Abbie: Yeah, it actually is. Yeah, cuz it kind of gets you into that mental space, even if you really weren't feeling it beforehand. It might be, you know, you've got some really bad news an hour before I'm gonna go on the radio, but then as soon as I'm on the radio, I'm there to. I'm there to give it everything and to hopefully, um, bring people great music but also, you know, some good stories and, and keep them company as well. So it can be very useful cuz it can definitely switch you into a more positive place. And like you say, access that dopamine that we are always searching for.

[00:11:51] Peter: Tell us about, um, how, first of all, how old are you, if you don't mind telling us. 

[00:11:54] Abbie: I'm, uh, I'm 32, so I got diagnosed when I was say 31. 

[00:11:58] Peter: You're 32 and you're female, and you're in an industry that's predominantly male focused and male driven. Right? So you are coming in as sort of a, I guess, uh, what are you, A millennial, I guess. Are you a millennial or Gen Y? What are you? 

[00:12:10] Abbie: Yeah, I'll be, I'm a millennial. I wish I was a Gen Z yeah. 

[00:12:12] Peter: You're in the cusp of a millennial, right? You're coming as cusp millennial. Tell us about some of the fights you've dealt with and some of the battles you've fought coming in as a millennial, a neurotypical, a neuro atypical millennial, um, who's a female in this male dominated industry. Right. You've, I'm, I'm sure you've, you've had to step up several times, both in, in football as well as DJ ing, 

[00:12:32] Abbie: Yeah, I feel like I feel it the most as a DJ actually to be honest, where you'll turn up to DJ at a festival and a club and predominantly a lot of people working in that industry, it is changing, which is great to see. But a lot of people working in that industry, uh, are male. And sometimes you can get a few patronizing kind of sound engineers who are like, oh, do you know how to use the equipment? Do you need any help with that? And you're like, yeah, that's why I'm here. I'm here to, I'm here to dj. I'm here to do the thing that you booked me for. Or the, or, you know, the, the place book before. So I feel like you can experience a bit of that and I think a lot of stuff like where, you know, you are doing as good a job as your male counterparts, but you're probably not getting paid the same. But I think so much is changing. There's a real positive shift in like entertainment, in music, in sport. To, to even things out. But I do, um, some stuff for, uh, for B B C sport and uh, a sport. Chelsea, sorry if you don't, or sorry if people listening don't. So I do some of their matchday live programming as well, and I, I sometimes feel most vulnerable being like a woman in sport. Cause I think often people are just looking to just dismiss what you say because that industry is still so, so male dominated. That one's probably got the most catching up to do. Um, so dealing with that sometimes, but then it's, I think sometimes you just have to, although we find it hard, it's like shut out the outside noise and, and thoughts and just have real confidence and belief in what you are doing and what you are saying. That's the only thing you can do. 

[00:14:10] Peter: Shut out the outside thoughts. I love that. So I've actually been a, I've been a Premier League fan for, for years, and I can tell you over the past few years here in America, I'd say millions more people have suddenly learned about non-American football thanks to Ted Lasso. So I think that, um, people are definitely learning a bit more , um, about it. What is your, who's your, who's your team? 

[00:14:31] Abbie: Uh, Chelsea. Chelsea Football Club. Yeah, I've been a fan since I was like six or seven. So the good times and the bad times, and the Inbetweens . 

[00:14:40] Peter: Very cool. I love this, Abbie! This has been so much fun. How can people find you? 

[00:14:44] Abbie: Uh, people can find me on socials, uh, a Abbie Abbie Mac. That's my handle on everything. So A B B I E. Um, yeah, come and say hello! You know what? Us people with A D H D are like we, we love to connect. So yeah, please do, uh, get involved. Gimme a follow and uh, shout me in the dms and thank you so much again, Peter. It's been so fun. 

[00:15:04] Peter: Oh, I'm so glad to have you! Guys listen to her stuff. She really is amazing, Abbie it's pretty incredible. Abbie McCarthy, thank you so much for taking the time. 

Guys. By the time this comes out, you will probably. Have already heard the news that, uh, Faster Than Normal is being turned into a kid's book. It is. I can give you a title now. It's called The Boy With the Faster Brain, and it is my first attempt at writing a children's book and I am so excited. So I will have links, uh, on where to purchase and how to purchase and how to get fun stuff like that and how to have me come in and, and talk to your schools and your kids and, and whatever soon enough. So stick to that. As always, if you know anyone that we should be interviewing, shoot us a note. Just people as cool as Abbie and all and above only. Those are the only ones we want. No, I'm kidding. Anyone, anyone you think has a great story, we would love to highlight them on the podcast. My name is Peter Shankman. I'm at Peter Shankman on all the socials. We're at Faster normal as well, and we will see you next week. Thank you for listening and keep remembering you are gifted, not broken. We'll see you soon!

Credits: You've been listening to the Faster Than Normal podcast. We're available on iTunes, Stitcher and Google play and of course at www.FasterThanNormal.com I'm your host, Peter Shankman and you can find me at shankman.com and @petershankman on all of the socials. If you like what you've heard, why not head over to your favorite podcast platform of choice and leave us a review, come more people who leave positive reviews, the more the podcast has shown, and the more people we can help understand that ADHD is a gift, not a curse. Opening and closing themes were composed and produced by Steven Byrom who also produces this podcast, and the opening introduction was recorded by Bernie Wagenblast. Thank you so much for listening. We'll see you next week! 

Jan 25, 2023

Nathan Minns is the founder of Green Light Improv, a professional training company that cultivates resilience, enhances creativity, and improves communication, all while inspiring connection through improv comedy. Beginning as an actor in 2015, Nathan soon realized that his acting training was positively affecting other work skills, from creativity and confidence, to communication and decision-making. Ultimately, the change he saw in himself led him to create Green Light Improv in 2019. Green Light Improv inspires connection through improv comedy. The company doesn't teach improv comedy, but instead uses improv comedy as a tool to teach other work and life skills. In 2022, Nathan quit his job and is now working full-time to spread applied improv training. An Ohio State University graduate, Nathan has previously spent most of his career in the startup ecosystem as an employee and a 3x founder. How does this all work with his ADHD? Can Improv Comedy work via your ADHD too? Enjoy! 

In this episode Peter and Nathan Minns discuss:  

00:40 - Thank you so much for listening and for subscribing!

01:01 - Intro and welcome Nathan Minns!

02:50 - So Improv is a cult right? What got you into it? What got you excited?

05:51 - Can improv positively affect your mental health? Focusing on 2 things tandem?

07:10 - What is the reason people with neurodiverse brains are drawn to the improv community?

07:50 - How do you feel on stage? Why do you continue to practice improv?

08:30 - What kinds of folks are you working with; what all is your  Green Light Improv company doing?

09:45 - Can you share an example you’ve experienced in where a new client ‘gets it’ for the first time, as you did?

12:40 - Is it about the 8 people you’re in a room with, or the eventual audience?

13:48 - Neurodiverse brains. Conversation engineering and management. Improv is a team sport.

14:48 - How can people find more about you? 

Web:  https://greenlightimprov.com  Personal: https://nathanminns.com

Socials:  @ linkedin.com/in/minns on LinkedIN and via YouTube

15:06 - We should talk about improv as a tool and subject again- than you Nathan!! 

Guys, as always thanks so much for subscribing! Faster Than Normal is for YOU! We want to know what you’d like to hear! Do you have a cool friend with a great story? We’d love to learn about, and from them. I'm www.petershankman.com and you can reach out anytime via email at peter@shankman.com or @petershankman on all of the socials. You can also find us at @FasterNormal on all of the socials. It really helps when you drop us a review on iTunes and of course, subscribe to the podcast if you haven’t already! As you know, the more reviews we get, the more people we can reach. Help us to show the world that ADHD is a gift, not a curse! 

15:49 - Faster Than Normal Podcast info & credits.

TRANSCRIPT via Descript and then corrected.. somewhat:

[00:00:40] Peter: Hey everyone. Peter Shankman is with you today. Welcome to another episode of Faster Than Normal, the podcast where we talk about ADD, ADHD, Autism, Executive Function Disorder, anything and everything having to do with the neurodiverse brain, we here look at all of those things as gifts, not as curses, and we're thrilled that you're here. I am joined today by someone who I've been talking about improv both in my books and on the podcast and in my courses and things like that. As something that you kind of have to do. And why do I say that? Because improv allows you to focus on improving yourself from the inside out. An ex-girlfriend who used to do improv all the time, and I never really got it. And one day she invited me. She said, just come take class. And look, I was a drama major growing up. I went high school, the whole thing. I took this class and the simple act of having to think inside your own head in real time, massively, massively opened up my brain. and I was a fan, have been a fan ever since. So we're talking to Nathan Minns, who's the founder of https://greenlightimprov.com , a professional training company that cultivates resilience, enhances creativity, and improves communication, all while inspiring connection through improv comedy. He began as an actor in 2015, and he soon realized his Actor training was positively affecting other work skills from creativity and confidence to communications, decision making, things like that. So that's where he created Green Light Improv in 2019. It inspires connection through improv comedy. The company doesn't teach Improv. , but rather uses improv as a tool to other work and life skills. That actually, uh, resonates with me because I think that when I, when I talk to companies, when I go and speak to companies, I like to do a little improv just to get them to sort of break down those barriers that are inherent in business and inherent, I think in our brain. You know, a lot of companies, Nathan, um, more than ever before are focusing on, uh, employee mental health and employee mental wellbeing. And I think that, that you might just be at the right place at the right time type thing. That, so welcome to the podcast. First. 

[00:02:44] Nathan: Thank you for having me. I loved your podcast for a long time, so I'm happy to be here.

[00:02:49] Peter: So improv. So, you know, look, I, before I started going and started becoming a fan of it, I always assumed improv was kind of a cult. Um, you had to go, you had to bring 10 friends, you had to buy two drinks, you know, the usual, right? Yeah. And I was quickly disabused of that theory, uh, my first time there. So what got you into it? What got you excited? . 

[00:03:08] Nathan: Well, I started performing in 2015 and I saw my first improv show in 2016, and when I saw the show; they were just, their brains were working so fast. I knew that it was something that I wanted to do too. So I went out and auditioned for these two groups that I saw perform, and I felt like I was doing incredibly well. I was making everyone in the room laugh and I was having a blast. And the only small hiccup that came was that it seemed like I was the only person that thought I was doing well. Because, yeah, I didn't get in, so I did not get into either group and I said, okay, I know this is something I wanna do. I've seen improv, I've done theater. So I took a step back. I started taking some classes and trying to put in the work to be able to get up to that level. Then I went back later, I auditioned again, and I did so much better. And in the end, the exact same thing happened. Really? In total? Yeah. In total. I auditioned across the two groups seven times before I got into an improv group. 

[00:04:17] Peter: Wow. But you got into it. 

[00:04:19] Nathan: I did . I did get into one. Um, but I, I realized there that many people, like what you were describing, see improv as this thing that they would never be able to do. And it's a learnable skill. It's something that you can figure out how to do. There's training to be able to learn it. And I was very naturally bad at it, but I like to think I'm a little bit better these days than when I first started. 

[00:04:47] Peter: I love that. Naturally bad at some. Well, being naturally bad at something is the first step to kind of eventually being good at something, right? Yeah, exactly. Tell me about, um, you, you mentioned the, the brain working faster. Everyone's brain working faster in improv. You know, the thing about A D H D is that we're constantly, our brains are constantly working faster and, and while we're thinking one thing, we're making a joke about something else and we're thinking about something else, and you know, like four different things at the same time. And I found that the only place where that doesn't, two places where that doesn't really work well. One is in a relationship, um, when you're not entirely focused on the person. And yeah. The second one I've just discovered recently is in boxing because I'll be thinking, I'll, I'll, I'll be focusing on my punches, I'll be throwing, I'll doing it, and then something clicks in my brain and half a second later I'm four tangents away, uh, you know, wondering whether or not, um, beavers fall in love. And yeah. Next, next thing I know, I've just gotten rocked with a, with a hard right to the head, so that is, uh, something I'm focusing on, but, but talk about from an ADHD perspective or from mental health perspective. Talk about how improv can positively affect that.

[00:06:00] Nathan: Yeah. I, I find that improv is one of the only places that I have gone into that community where the traits of A D H D are often rewarded. So when I'm on stage, I feel very comfortable. I feel everyone's watching me. Of course, I'm performing. But there's something about that heightened feeling that makes me very focused. And also in improv, we have to be fully present in the moment. And I think the stress, almost stress of being on stage helps that helps us to stay focused. And while we're being fully present on stage, we have to be able to come up with a lot of creative ideas very quickly. And discern which ones are good, which ones aren't worth pursuing. And I find that my ADHD is very helpful in allowing me to come up with a lot of different ideas and see what works. So I feel like it is a incredible community where it is the highest percentage of people with ADHD that I have ever been a part of any group. 

[00:07:10] Peter: Interesting. Why do you think and and do you think the reason people with neurodiverse brains are drawn to it is because of the speed, is because of the quickness, is because it's, you know, it's, it's like that perfect place for a brain, for brains like ours. 

[00:07:22] Nathan: Yeah, I think that it's, it's rewarded. Some of those quick thinking skills are rewarded where it may not be rewarded in the corporate sphere, where we often do more monotonous kind of tasks in 80, in, in improv. we're doing a lot of different things and we have to come up with a lot of different ideas. So I definitely think that, um, that's a, that's a solid reason why we're drawn to improv. 

[00:07:51] Peter: Interesting. Tell me about how you're feeling when you're on stage. I mean, are you getting. . You know, when I get off the stage after a keynote, I'm, I'm just a wash with dopamine. Right. Do you have that same sort of feeling? Is that, is that one of the reasons you, you keep doing it? 

[00:08:03] Nathan: Yeah. It, it's an incredible high being on stage. I now feel more comfortable on stage when I don't know what I'm about to say next . And in improv than when I'm in a play, or I'm doing a keynote, something like that. I feel very comfortable. Um, when I just, I don't have a script and I can just float along with it. I find I'm incredibly focused. Yeah.

[00:08:29] Peter: That's very cool. Um, Where do you, uh, see it taking you? I mean, you're, you're working, what kind of companies and, and groups of people are you working with now in, in the company? And tell us about what the company's doing. 

[00:08:42] Nathan: Yeah, so I'm 24 right now and I started the company in 2019 in my senior year of college at Ohio State. And I found, at the very beginning that I found that working with colleges and universities, uh, worked very well. That has stayed something that's pretty consistent working with a lot of colleges, uh, university programs. Now we're expanding into more of the corporate sphere, small business sphere, non-university, university sphere. Um, I see it growing into a place where we can have, uh, a variety of facilitators doing this work at, at the same time, we can have the basis of the curriculum too, but I think that improv can be used for so many different things that we can start to have different branches from, uh, a law school, a social worker school and, and any other, any other groups that we think can really benefit from this kind of training. 

[00:09:44] Peter: Very, very cool. Talk about one of your, uh, talk about someone who came in with sort of that same attitude I did the first time. Oh, this is, this is bs, whatever. And talk about that moment when they sort of got it and you saw, you saw the change.

[00:09:59] Nathan: So I saw, I went into one group. There were 40 people, and I started my initial talk. It's about, usually the workshops are about 10 minutes of me talking at the beginning. And then the entire rest of the workshop is exercise debrief. And in the exercise we're doing paired exercises for about half the time and groups of four to six for the rest of the time. So I start this 10 minute talk of just what is improv? How are we going to use it today? Why are we doing this? And about 30 seconds into this talk, someone raises their hands, think, okay, this, this isn't typically a time when people raise their hands, . Um, I said, Oh, ok- , what would you like to say? And there was this woman, she was probably around 60 or 70, and she said, Nathan, I just wanna let you know that we are all introverts and we're gonna hate this. Ha ha. And I was like, I appreciate your honesty,., thank you for telling me that. It's nice to see where, where our starting point is. And in that workshop I knew; okay, this might be a tougher audience than my typical workshop, but as we started getting going, I told her, let's just give it 10 minutes. Just give it a little bit of time and we'll see what happens. Within 30 minutes maybe, she was volunteering in front of the entire group, which isn't a thing we force anyone. , but we just, I asked would anyone like to share or represent the group? And she started, started doing it because I, I think they realized that this isn't an activity that's only for extroverts or, um, only for people who like to speak up all the time. Um, this is an, an activity that we, anyone can do, we can use it for, for any group. Yeah. And they can do something and have fun and get something out of it. 

[00:12:07] Peter: You know what always interests me, the the introvert concept is interesting because a lot of people with neurodiverse brains are what you might call the most introverted extrovert you'll ever meet. In the respect that, you know, I love being on stage, I love speaking. I love doing that because it's me to many. Yeah. Right. But if it's me to a few, like at dinner party or whatever, I hate everything about that. Hmm. Right. You know, I, I, I, I love being on stage talking to thousands of people, or I love one-on-one, you know, having dinner with a friend or whatever. But the concept of, of, uh, you know, sitting with her in a room with eight people where we all have to make small talk. , you know, I'll be in the second bedroom playing with the cat. And so I think that one of the keys about improv is that it is a small group of people talking to each other, but in essence talking to an audience.

[00:12:52] Nathan: Yeah. And in improv it is very much a conversation with the audience, not in the way that we actually expect the audience to talk to us through the performance. But when we're, because in improv, just so we're all on the same page, it is often when five to six actors get on stage, they ask for a single word, and they use that word to inspire a variety of scenes that have never been done before. Never been written before, and will likely never be done again. So something that that we find is that we have to create all of those scenes live and we can use what the audience is giving us all, whenever they laugh, we can say, okay, that is a, a button that we just pressed. Right. That something was funny there. Let's dig into that. 

[00:13:42] Peter: That's really smart because you're, you're listening to the audience and you're, you're, you're letting them give you the cues not even realizing they're doing it. 

[00:13:48] Nathan: Exactly. Yeah. It, we're not performing in a vacuum. We're not writing in a vacuum, so it's a nice way to, to have a conversation on that kind of scale.

[00:13:57] Peter: It's interesting cause that's what people who understand their neurodiverse brands tend to do is they, they tend to, uh, engineer the conversation in the respect that I can go in and start talking about something with someone knowing full well that I'm leading them, uh, down a path that I want to go to get to somewhere I wanna talk about, but making it seem like it's their idea.

[00:14:16] Nathan: Yeah. And, and in improv, you know, we, we all have, I have a ton of ideas when I'm on stage, my scene partner has a ton of ideas and that's where the connection happens. Because in improv we're not doing just what I'm thinking. We're not doing just what they're thinking. The ideas very much meld together, and that's much of the basis of how we use it for connecting and trust building. Because improv is a team sport. It's not like standup where it's just you on stage. You win and lose as a team. 

[00:14:53] Peter: Totally. How can people find out more about, about you and about, uh, Green Light Improv? 

[00:14:58] Nathan: You can go to https://greenlightimprov.com

[00:15:02] Peter: I love it. I love it. Nathan, thank you so much for taking the time today to be on Faster Than Normal. Really appreciate it. Improv, I think, is the subject that we, we should touch on again. Um, I think, I think it, it, it is an underrated tool for those with Neurodiverse brains; so I really appreciate you being here, man. We'll have you back. For sure. 

[00:15:17] Nathan: Thank you for having me!

[00:15:18] Peter: Guys, as always, we wanna hear what you think! Shoot me an email, peter @shankman.com. Let me know about a guest that you think might be great on the show. Uh, we'd love to know. You could follow us on all the socials and I'm gonna give you all a little, uh, piece of secret news that haven't really announced yet. Children's book .Coming in February. I'll leave it at that. Thanks for listening. We'll see you guys next week here on Faster Than Normal. 

Credits: You've been listening to the Faster Than Normal podcast. We're available on iTunes, Stitcher and Google play and of course at www.FasterThanNormal.com I'm your host, Peter Shankman and you can find me at shankman.com and @petershankman on all of the socials. If you like what you've heard, why not head over to your favorite podcast platform of choice and leave us a review, come more people who leave positive reviews, the more the podcast has shown, and the more people we can help understand that ADHD is a gift, not a curse. Opening and closing themes were composed and produced by Steven Byrom who also produces this podcast, and the opening introduction was recorded by Bernie Wagenblast. Thank you so much for listening. We'll see you next week! 

Jan 11, 2023

Welcome back and thanks so much for staying with us here in 2023! So today we’re catching up with our former guest, Sharon Pope. [her first interview focusing on Shelpful and Instant Human Accountability can be heard HERE].  Sharon is the co-founder and CEO of Shelpful, the instant accountability service that pairs you with a real-human buddy to help you build good habits (they nudge you and hold you to big habits like getting exercise, or small tasks like taking out the trash on time). Prior to starting shelpful, Sharon was a startup executive for 15 years, running marketing and product. She advised startups at the famous startup accelerator, Y Combinator, and was Chief Marketing Officer at ZeroDown, Green Dot (NYSE: GDOT), GoBank and Loopt. Prior to that she managed PR and content for a range of tech companies at leading San Francisco-based PR agencies. Today we welcome back to talk about how her super helpful company Shelpful has changed, if she’s still using exercise as medicine, and what new important things she has learned since our visit last year. Happy New Year! Enjoy!

In this episode Peter and Sharon Pope discuss:  

00:40 - Thank you so much for listening and for subscribing!

00:50 - Intro and welcome back Sharon Pope!

01:48 - Since our last visit HERE, she has been up to a lot! Let’s talk about rituals- 

02:17 - On dealing with your tasks, habits, routines 

02:45 - About your brain and habit formation

03:41 - A note on keeping perspective and overwhelm

04:05 - On becoming a certified habit coach

05:43 - What can we do right away to begin feeling a sense of accomplishment of achieving a goal?

08:18 - What is it with people start/stopping on very specific dates? Does that even work?

09:15 - On bursts of motivation and will power

10:52 - What have you learned that might surprise people in regards to accountability and habits?

11:00 - ADHD getting small things done, asking for help when you need to, and not feeling bad

13:28 - How can people find more about you? 

Web:  www.SHELPFUL.com  

Socials:  @shelpful on Twitter  INSTA  Facebook & TikTok

13:39 - A little more on how Shelpful works.  Ref: Oak Journal and method 

14:38 - Thank you Sharon!

Guys, as always thanks so much for subscribing! Faster Than Normal is for YOU! We want to know what you’d like to hear! Do you have a cool friend with a great story? We’d love to learn about, and from them. I'm www.petershankman.com and you can reach out anytime via email at peter@shankman.com or @petershankman on all of the socials. You can also find us at @FasterNormal on all of the socials. It really helps when you drop us a review on iTunes and of course, subscribe to the podcast if you haven’t already! As you know, the more reviews we get, the more people we can reach. Help us to show the world that ADHD is a gift, not a curse! 

15:00 - Faster Than Normal Podcast info & credits.

TRANSCRIPT via Descript and then corrected.. somewhat:

[00:00:40] Peter: Hey everyone. Welcome back to Faster Than Normal. My name is Peter Shankman. I am thrilled that you're here for another episode. We are talking again to a recurring visitor, Sharon Pope. Who was on about two or so years ago runs a company called Shelpful, and I love the concept. It's the instant accountability service that pairs you with a real human buddy to help you build good habits, like big habits like getting exercise or small habits like taking out the trash on time. I could use one to remember to walk my dog, but actually we can do that too. the dog. The dog reminds me to do that. I could, I could use my other thing, but, um, awesome. You are, I mean, Sharon, Sharon has tons and tons of, of awesome background. We've had her on before. Um, she ran marketing products. She was a, she, she advised startups at Y Combinator. She worked at zero down Green dot GoBank Loops. She managed PR back in the.com boom for a bunch of tech companies. So she's, she's been around the block quite a few times. So Sharon, welcome. At the beginning of the year here, 2023. Tell us what's been going on in the world of she and, and, and what, what new and interesting things you're doing and how, more importantly, how can our listeners take away some advice on building good habits, good rituals, forget about resolutions, let's talk about rituals. 

[00:02:00] Sharon: Yeah. Resolutions, I feel like is the hot topic right now, but it's really about those big goals that I think people try to set. Right. Um, and we at Shelpful a lot of that, right? So Shelpful obviously the place where people can go to get support on whatever they're trying to get done. So tasks or habits, routines. Um, and so we often have people come in and say, I want to do X, Y, z. You know, like a giant list of things and a whole overhaul. And our, our response is always, you know, let's start smaller. Um, and not just because. That helps in a text message conversation or in a workshop setting, which is often how we're helping people. But it's because the research proves it out, right? So you know, the actual habit formation that happens in your brain happens when you feel successful. And if you have these giant goals that you set that are almost unachievable, then after a few days you, your brain, literally, Push against the habit because it's not feeling successful and doing it. So we like to have people really lower the bar, not because they're lazy, but because in lowering the bar, you're actually setting yourself up to feel successful, number one and number two to do the habit the next time. So whatever it is that you're trying to do, whether it's. You know, get movement in every morning. Wake up when your alarm goes off, do gratitude, take your dog for a longer walk, . Um, all these things are, are habits, and if you can work on wiring them in, you know, it, it can help, it can help you feel more successful the whole year instead of just, I don't know, the first month of the year, for instance. 

[00:03:41] Peter: So, so basically what we're looking at here really is the concept of eating the elephant one bite at a time.

[00:03:47] Sharon: Oh yeah. I think that's a great analogy. I think, and it's, it's, I think people often get, stir that analogy up when you're talking about tackling a big thing. because it's, it's what seems logical to get it done piece by piece. But what's been really enlightening for me as I I, so I became an actual certified habit coach in this path after starting Shelpful to solve my own problem, which was feeling completely overwhelmed with everyday stuff, right? The little things would just follow from my list, like getting movement and getting fresh air. Yeah, like you mentioned, taking my dog for a very long walk instead of just like having go to the bathroom. All these things that were important to my self-care were just falling off the list. So completely geeked out on habits became a sort of a habit coach through Dr. BJ Fogg who wrote the book Tiny Habits, um, and is kind of one of the preeminent. Behavioral scientists in the field, his research backs this up, that if you shrink something down to tiny, tiny, tiny, not only are you making it harder to not do, but you, it's that feeling of success from that small, small action is what wires the habit into your brain. So that's something we spend a lot of time. We have kind of a workshop now that we try to teach people those skills of feeling successful for the smallest thing. Cause it actually is a skill. You kind of have to learn that and, and especially for an ADHD'er who's very comfortable and a shame spiral situation. Yeah. I think that it, it's, it's hard to accept that the smallest version is okay, but that it's not only the reality and something that would be helpful for self-compassion, but the research backs it up! 

[00:05:26] Peter: Yeah, no question about it. So tell us about, tell us a little more about that, because the, the premise of, you know, oh, it's the new year, we lose 30 pounds in January. No, you're freaking not. Right, right. You know, we, we, let's, let's be honest. No, you're not. Um, so you have to sort of start at the beginning. Um, what can people do just off the top of their heads, you know, what can we do right, right away, um, to sort of give us a little confidence that we can achieve these goals.

[00:05:50] Sharon: Sure, and let's, let's play out your example, right? So if the big goal is to lose 30 pounds or, um, improve your health, then I think the first step would be, first of all, trying to think of an ongoing habit you can work on that you actually want to do. So if you love. Paddle boarding, then maybe pick a habit, like an exercise that you wanna do regularly that helps improve your balance, that would help you with that habit or that that activity that you really, really love, um, or that you're cooking more. If you love to cook, then maybe we're working on a habit that involves meal planning or um, meal prep on Sundays. Things that you genuinely want to do because like we, we talked about, we're working on kind of hacking the brain and so we have to like the thing. That's why bad habits are formed too, because cookies are delicious and and I love them, then I can form that habit. So picking something you really want to do, I think is key. And it might sound obvious, but you know, starting with box jumping, if that's not your thing, is probably not the way to go. Right. Um, And then the second step is making it super, super small. So, um, instead of, I'm gonna work out for 20 minutes every morning, there's, we can make it tiny. Like, after I walk outta the bathroom, I'm gonna put on one walking shoe. Or after I put my toothbrush back in the cup, I'm gonna turn on my Peloton. Right. Literally just, and that's it. And that's, and, and then we actually say the hack is to celebrate that small thing. Because on the craziest busy day, maybe sometimes you'll try on the Peloton. and literally have to just walk away from it. But you can still say you did your habit. Yep. Um, and so that's, I mean, those are the key things is, is making it smaller and attaching it to something you already do. So I mentioned like putting your toothbrush away. This is something that, um, is an existing habit so we can kind of hack the brain a little bit to, to stack those habits together. Right? So just like when I walk through the door as an adult, my hand goes behind me to pull it shut. That's what we're kind of trying to create is this habit, muscle memory. By making it small, by making it part of your existing routine. Right. That can help you form that. And th this is the type of thing that I would define as success, Peter, that if you told me that you turn your Peloton on every day after you put your toothbrush away, I would say that's something to celebrate. I would have no follow up question that I, I assume that some days you would've gotten the workout in too.

[00:08:08] Peter: Right. Yeah, that makes sense. That makes a lot of sense. You know, it's interesting I think that, that people tie and I, I'd be curious your, your opinion on this. People tend to tie. Whether it's resolutions or rituals, to specific dates like, oh, dry January, or mm-hmm. , or, um, you know what, whatever, whatever those are, uh, the month before Memorial Day to get in shape. But why does it have to be tied to something? Why can't you arbitrate? I mean, when I quit smoking back in 2015 mm-hmm. , I mean, I quit years and years before that, but every once in a while I'd bum one, but the last time I had an actual, honestly got cigarette was March, fif March 17th, 2015. I just, I. no tie to that date whatsoever, I'd say, you know what? Screw it. I'm done. 

[00:08:49] Sharon: Had a good, had a good St. Patrick's Day, and you're done. 

[00:08:52] Peter: Yeah. Why is it so hard to just go to that, to go say, you know what? I wanna do something and make that change today, but, oh, you know what? I'll do it in February. I'll do it March 1st. Why? Why are we so stuck on tying it to something?

[00:09:07] Sharon: Yeah, I, I think that, I mean, in smoking obviously has other addiction elements that I'm certainly not an expert on, but I think I can definitely relate to this Diet starts Monday mentality or, you know, big nears resolution, those things. And I think it, it's related to our tendency to have these bursts of motivation and willpower, which don't sustain, like you can kind of map it, right. You can see. Okay. Big burst of motivation and willpower, especially for an adhd, right? These things can't be dependent upon. So we have these moments where we kind of, um, we put a lot of our kind of motivation eggs in one basket of, okay, this is gonna happen. I'm doing it big, go big, go home. Never say die, right? Keep up the streak. All these things. And our culture. Our culture stokes this, it it, it makes us feel like it has to be all or nothing, which is why I think we have to put a start date on it. But what we always, I mean, what we work with people on, and as you know, we have, we kind of have our habit coaching, but we also have these accountability buddies that you text with. And the big part of what. I've seen from our members is that, start today with something small. Celebrate your small successes, and that adds up to something big. And if, if it's small enough, you can always start today. Usually, you know, like unless it's something that depends on you getting some piece of equipment or something you have to get from your Amazon order. But generally you could start if it's, if you make it small enough, you can start today. And if you can't. It's probably a sign that you're not starting small enough. 

[00:10:43] Peter: Yeah, no, that's a really, really good answer. That's a really good answer. What else have you learned, um, as you've been going through? So, so you've been running the company now for a few years. What, what else have you learned? What would you, what would surprise people, um, about whether it's habits or about whether it's accountability? . 

[00:10:59] Sharon: Yeah. We started this company in early 2021 as a response to my own frustration. And I, I've obviously, through that journey, I've found out or was finally diagnosed with my own adhd, which explained why so many people with ADHD were signing up for our service. Um, and I think, I think the main thing, it's, it's been interesting. I have, I've had this parallel path of learning a lot about myself and learning a lot kind of what, what support needs to exist in the world? Um, on my own track, I think being able to instantly see when I launched this service that I wasn't alone, that a lot of people felt a lack of support on the little things in life. Just felt like they were completely alone in these tasks of taking care of everyone in their life and taking care of work, but not taking care of themselves. It was, I wasn't alone in that. Which for me was not only enlightening and exciting from a business perspective, but just made me feel this immediate sense of community and and gratitude to be able to help people just like me. Yeah, and I think the other thing I've really learned is, As I, I've had this parallel path of understanding about my ADHD as I've been helping people with adhd and I've found it transformative. So the advice I just spat out on starting small and not falling to the shame spiral, that was advice I would not have been taking two years ago. And so I've had this kind of personal journey of being able. to number one, name a specific thing as adhd, like, I didn't pay that bill. I have adhd. I'm not a horrible person. , let me reach, let me, you know, I, I have a shelter. That's our, that's our name for an accountability buddy. So I, I literally texted her last night like, please, please, please make me cancel this fitness subscription that I haven't used and I like, and they're making me call, which is complete paralysis for me, of course. And so instead of blaming myself and being like, I suck as a person because I can't pick up the phone and cancel subscription, I mean, you know, you, I'm sure you can completely relate to this and a lot of people can, someone making me call them is like, oh, the worst thing in the world, the literal, worst thing in the world. Like I, I'd rather start a company. I'd rather learn to fly a plane , like there's a million things I'd rather do than c all a person to cancel something. Right. So I, I have, I've had this, I think, journey of self-compassion that I, I'm accepting support, that I know I need help on little things, and I'm not a bad person for that.

[00:13:23] Peter: Yeah. I love it. I love it. Very cool. How could people find you? 

[00:13:30] Sharon: Yeah, we are at www.Shelpful.com S H E L P F U L. Rhymes with helpful. Um, and we have all sorts of services you can find there. Our most popular thing is that one-on-one work with your own real human buddy who will remind you of your crap , basically, and help support you on any habits or tasks you're trying to get done. But we also have groups where you can be put in a group with four, with three other people and work on the same thing. So we have, we actually have folks with adhd. Um, we have groups, people working on all trying to get movement in, drink more water, anything under the sun, and we actually have some specialties. Um, in partnership, there's a company called Oak Journal that we're partnering with, and they have this kind of daily method where you do gratitude every day and set your top priorities every day. So groups are kind of going through that process together so they can stay on track and work toward bigger goals. So that's been really fun to do as well. 

[00:14:26] Peter: Very cool. Well, Sharon, thank you as always for joining us at Faster Than Normal. I love it when you come by. It's great to hear from you. Glad things are going well, and we'll have you on again towards the end of the year. We'll see how we're doing with our, our, our, our rituals.

[00:14:37] Sharon: Thanks for having me Peter.

[00:14:38] Peter: All right, guys, as always, listening to Faster Than Normal. We love that you love us. Have any ideas for great guests like Sharon, let us know. Shoot me an email peter@shankman.com we'd love to include, and we will see you with another episode next week. Stay safe, stay happy. Bye bye :)

Credits: You've been listening to the Faster Than Normal podcast. We're available on iTunes, Stitcher and Google play and of course at www.FasterThanNormal.com I'm your host, Peter Shankman and you can find me at shankman.com and @petershankman on all of the socials. If you like what you've heard, why not head over to your favorite podcast platform of choice and leave us a review, come more people who leave positive reviews, the more the podcast has shown, and the more people we can help understand that ADHD is a gift, not a curse. Opening and closing themes were composed and produced by Steven Byrom who also produces this podcast, and the opening introduction was recorded by Bernie Wagenblast. Thank you so much for listening. We'll see you next week! 

Dec 14, 2022

Professor Esme Fuller-Thomson is cross-appointed to the Faculties of Social Work, Medicine, and Nursing at the University of Toronto. She is also Director of the Institute for Life Course & Aging.  She has published more than 170 articles in peer-reviewed journals including the New England Journal of Medicine, The Lancet, and Cancer. Her research examines ADHD and mental health, the association between early adversities and adult physical and health outcomes, and disparities in health. She has recently been focused on resilience and flourishing mental health.  Her work has widely cited in the media including the New York Times, Forbes, Wall Street Journal, Time Magazine and CNN. We’re thrilled to welcome her back and hear about her latest research in our last episode of 2022. Thank you for joining us all year long! We hope you have a happy, healthy and safe holiday season, everyone. Enjoy! 

In this episode Peter and Professor Esme Fuller-Thomson discuss:  

01:20 - Thank you so much for listening and for subscribing!

01:15 - Intro and welcome back Dr. Esme Fuller-Thomson!

01:57 - Since our last visit HERE, she has completed some new research on Anxiety and ADHD

03:00 - Women with ADHD were 5x more prone to anxiety, compared to women without ADHD

04:20 - What is the percentage of researchers who study ADHD and Anxiety?

05:45 - On budget, finance and anxiety + ADHD

07:17 - Are you one of the people perhaps more at risk for anxiety? Ref: Research Aug. 31, 2021

08:00 - ADHD and finding moderation with controlled substances/impulse control

09:40 - And now for the new good news! 

11:00 - Ref: Corey Keys at Emory University and his three pillars of “Excellent Mental Health”

13:00 - More than 2 out of 5 are flourishing w/ excellent mental health; how do we get more of us here?

15:12 - On keeping perspective and not hyper-focusing on the bad stuff.

17:25 - A look at the factors in the study of those flourishing with ADHD

18:29 - 300 years ago, exercise was a mandatory part our daily life because we needed it to simply exist

19:40 - People who use spirituality to cope w/ their day to day troubles were much more likely to be in complete mental health.

20:43 - Point | Counterpoint on relationships and marriage

21:17 - Happiness and chronic pain

22:00 - Remember, just a few years ago it was still rare for Women to get an ADHD diagnosis

23:56 - What is CBT and can it be helpful? Ref: Cognitive Behavioral Therapy 

00:00 - How can people find more about you?  Just type in Fuller-Thompson + ADHD, HERE on Google Scholar, or via https://socialwork.utoronto.ca/profiles/esme-fuller-thomson/

25:00 - Thank you Esme!

25:18 - “Thank you Peter for what you do for the whole community of people with ADHD. We all appreciate it!!”

25:28 - The Faster Than Normal book is still being printed, and this is awesome, THANK YOU and I’m so happy it’s helping!!!!  

26:07 - Happy Holidays!! 

Guys, as always thanks so much for subscribing! Faster Than Normal is for YOU! We want to know what you’d like to hear! Do you have a cool friend with a great story? We’d love to learn about, and from them. I'm www.petershankman.com and you can reach out anytime via email at peter@shankman.com or @petershankman on all of the socials. You can also find us at @FasterNormal on all of the socials. It really helps when you drop us a review on iTunes and of course, subscribe to the podcast if you haven’t already! As you know, the more reviews we get, the more people we can reach. Help us to show the world that ADHD is a gift, not a curse! 

26:35 - Faster Than Normal Podcast info & credits.

TRANSCRIPT via Descript and then corrected.. somewhat:

[00:00:40] Peter: High, high, high. Hope you're well. This will probably be last episode will be recorded before Christmas and the holiday break. I hope that you are all going somewhere warm or if. You are doing something that keeps you busy or maybe going somewhere cold if you live in a warm area right now, like to all my friends in Australia anyway, I'm not, I'm in New York City, it's 12 degrees or some crap like that. Um, I am getting outta here later in the week for about a week and, and gonna bury my head in the sand somewhere warm. So that's nice. Anyway, we have a g returning guest. We. Esme. Okay, I gotta stop you right here. Cause first of all, you understand I love this person. This person is one of the few people who's out there doing hardcore research on girls, women, and adhd. So I want to welcome back Esme Fuller Thompson, Dr. Esme Fuller Thompson. She's an incredible guest. We had her right, we think about God two or three years ago, I think it was pre pandemic. So it's wonderful to have you back as we welcome and you got tons of new stuff to talk about. 

[00:01:36] Dr.Fuller-Thompson: Absolutely. And some of it is really positive because last time I came it was all about the negatives. And I still have some, I remember. Yeah. But I promised you that I had in the works, um, some research on flourishing among h adhd. So do you wanna start with the bad stuff or the good stuff? Which one? 

[00:01:52] Peter: Let's get the bad stuff outta the way. 

[00:01:54] Dr.Fuller-Thompson: Okay, so, um, when I was with you, which I think was about two years ago, we were talking a lot about women with h ADHD which is dear to my heart. Um, I think it's a neglected population. People really haven't been looking at it, but we, we, in that time we talked about, um, depression and suicidality. But we didn't really know very much about anxiety. So I worked on a paper that came out, um, uh, almost a year ago on generalized anxiety disorder among A D H D and life. It, it's not too surprising that the rates are higher among people, um, with adhd cause life is anxiety producing because things are sometimes quite chaotic, right? So yes, indeed. Um, We found that people with A D H D had four times higher odds of anxiety disorders compared to their peers without

[00:02:52] Peter: Wow. Four times higher odds of anxiety disorders when you have ADHD. Wow. 

[00:02:57] Dr.Fuller-Thompson: Yes. Yeah, so I mean, I was expecting maybe double, but. Four times and it's women. Insane. Were even worse. Women, women with a adhd were five times compared to women without h adhd. Now these are young, relatively young, like 20 to 39 year olds. And um, ooh, you know, that, that, that's hard. It's hard to, to manage. Uh, that doesn't mean that they actually have it necessarily at this moment, but they've had anxiety disorders. So some have overcome it, but, but it's, um, it's a significant barrier that, that a lot of people with a d h ADHD have to go through. And as I said, women have, um, a harder time with it even than men, even though women in general have higher anxiety., Women with ADHD proportionately are doing worse than women without ADHD compared to men with ADHD versus men without, so interesting. It's, it's, uh, it's a real issue and I think it's neglected. I don't think, I think the other behaviors, you know, the, the depression and substance abuse, those ones tend to get more attention, but anxiety can be crippling. And I think we need to think about it as, as clinicians and also as as people with A D H D and, and also people who love people with A D H D, that keeping an eye on that anxiety and thinking about interventions to help with it because there are some really good interventions. 

[00:04:18] Peter: I know for a lot of people who are getting help with A D H D and they're getting help, uh, you know, whether it's medication, whether it's, uh, D B T or whatever, you know, there are a lot of. What do you think the percentage of of psychologists or or therapists are that put together the link between ADHD and anxiety? 

[00:04:38] Dr.Fuller-Thompson: Well, certainly I know with, um, some of my research on women and other people's research that women are much less likely to get the correct diagnosis and Right. So they might have, they, so sometimes they might be that anxiety or the depression or flagged and they haven't put it together that it's A D H D. If people are brought in young, uh, be maybe because of school related stuff for A D H D, they may not be screening for, um, depression or anxiety. So it's, I what I, my plug is if you have people presenting with anxiety and depression, think about A D H D. If you have, um, have patients or clients with a D H D think about depression and anxiety. Not that everybody has it, and we'll get the good news at the end. But it is more, much more likely to occur. And among those with, uh, among women are more vulnerable than men. But there's other things too. Um, low income is very anxiety producing, whether you have ADHD or not. 

[00:05:40] Peter: Wondering, and I completely, I mean that, that's a given. There's no question about that. 

[00:05:43] Dr.Fuller-Thompson: Absolutely. But, People with A D H D may have harder time managing budgets and, and making sure that the money makes it all the way through to the end of the month. And so that, that's very anxiety producing. So now going from middle class to upper class, that doesn't make a huge difference. But being really close to the line and not having enough to make ends meet is desperately anxiety Produc. Yep. 

[00:06:11] Peter: I believe it. And what's interesting is that I think, you know, especially now in this sort of worldwide financial crisis we're in, you know, that certainly doesn't help. It's, it's tough enough when, when we're all doing moderately well,

[00:06:22] Dr.Fuller-Thompson: Yes. Yeah. So, uh, I, now, my, I should have comment that my research is based on, uh, representative samples, but before the pandemic, right? So everybody got more anxious, more depressed, and more, you know, during the depress the, um, pandemic and being locked at home is. Great for people who like a lot of the stimulation and activities. So I'm guessing that these estimates are perhaps, um, underestimates of the magnitude of the problem in probably, yeah. The pandemic. So I, I, as I said, there'll be a while before we get that kind of information out, but it seems logical to think it's not getting better anyway. 

[00:07:06] Peter: Hmm. Unreal. Unreal. , but you said you had good news.

[00:07:11] Dr.Fuller-Thompson: All right, well let me just finish the other people at risk, cuz those are kind of Okay. More, more bad news. Let's go over that. More bad news. Okay. Um, so the, uh, people who had more close relationships were much less likely to have anxiety. So almost every study I've done in ADHD, social support, having a confidant, having, uh, a spouse on your side. All of those things are really, really protective. So, um, the idea of building and building a so social support network and reaching out to that network and investing in it really helps on all those fronts. Um, . And then the, uh, the other negative news in August in 2021, I published on substance use disorder. And we touched on this briefly, I think two years ago when we talked about it, but some people, uh, uh, we found that people with A D H D were much more likely to have had a substance use disorder at some point in their life. And we're looking at 20 to 39 year olds and. Almost half had a substance use disorder. I don't think that'll be too surprising to you having talked with so many of your guests, but Yeah, not at all. So the issue is, I mean, some people are able to consume in moderation, but people with A D H D are probably many of them. find Moderation a hard piece. It's kind of an all nothing piece. 

[00:08:35] Peter: People are able to, people with ADHD are some are able to consume with, what'd you say?

[00:08:39] Dr.Fuller-Thompson: With moderation? Say, oh, I'll just have a glass. But that's, 

[00:08:42] Peter: why are you, why are you making up words? I've never heard this word. Moderation. What is that? 

[00:08:48] Dr.Fuller-Thompson: So my point is that, um, among people with substance use issues and a D H D and impulse control issues, perhaps abstinence is a good strategy. Not, you know, some people can do it without the abstinence kind of piece, but, um, You know, it, it can get you into, if you have impulse control and drinking and drink, this is all types, uh, it's higher for everything, cannabis, uh, heavy drugs and alcohol. So, um, generally the. The idea is that, uh, A D H D makes it harder to manage, uh, substances in general and makes you more vulnerable to, um, addictions. So that makes perfect sense. Yeah, totally makes sense. So those are the bad news, but can I get to the good news? Can I share with you, 

[00:09:39] Peter: for God's sake? Yes.

[00:09:40] Dr.Fuller-Thompson: After all of this. Okay. So, So, uh, you know, I'm, I'm more than a quarter century into my career, and so I, I have spent the first 20 some years looking at negative things, depression, anxiety, um, uh, suicidality, and, you know, that's a bit of a Debbie Downer. When you go to parties and you say, oh, what do you do? I'm looking at depression, anxiety, thanks, geez. But, and then, but it's a little bit of. Whack-a-Mole Pro, uh, uh, problems, you know, that little kid's game where it's politics of course. Yeah. Very, uh, politically incorrect, where just spit poor moles on the head and yeah, one goes down and the other pops up. So, you know, here I am, I'm like, okay, I'm focusing on say A D H D and anxiety. And so, you know, you think about interventions and many really good interventions and maybe anxiety goes down, but depression pops up or maybe depression goes down and substance abuse pops up. So, um, I, I started thinking, well, I need to really look at it holistically. And if I said to you, how are you doing today? And you said, I'm not suicidal. Well, that's not really where we want you to be. We want you to be flourishing, right? So, um, I started looking around and there's an amazing researcher at Emory University called Corey Keys, and he came up with this concept. Excellent mental health. So when I ask you what does mental health mean to you? Not just it's, it's the absence of mental illness. Sure. But that's not really enough. Just not being suicidal or not being depressed. It's really more than that. So his idea has, Three pillars. The first one is, no mental illness in the past year. No substance dependence, no um, depression, no anxiety, no bipolar, and no serious suicidal thought. So that's a great place that's getting you to, that's pillar one is getting you to neutral, which is great. Um, and certainly if people are, are, are, have any of those issues, getting them out of that is, is your first plan as a clinician or as a family member. But then, then pillar two. How often in the last month have you been happy? And you have to say every day or almost every day. Like if you're just happy twice a week, it doesn't make it. And they also ask how, how often you are satisfied with your life and you have to be daily or almost daily. So you can see that one of you have to be at least one of these. So pillar two is happy or satisfied on an almost daily level. So no mental illness and you're happy and satisfied. And then pillar three is about psychological wellbeing and social wellbeing. I have warm and supportive relationships. Life is getting better for peace pull. Like me, I like most parts of my personality. And in the last month you have to agree to the majority of those six of the 11 questions. at least, uh, daily or almost daily. You have to agree to that. So this is really, really, really high, right? You're not mentally ill. You have no substance dependence, you have no suicidal thoughts. You're happy and or satisfied, and you have warm and you, you have great social or psych and or psychological wellbeing. Like, isn't this what we're hoping for? 

[00:12:54] Peter: Yeah, one would think, 

[00:12:56] Dr.Fuller-Thompson: all right, so among those with ADHD, this is a really, really high bar. More than two and five are flourishing, are absolutely flourishing, are hitting this incredibly high bar. 

[00:13:12] Peter: Interesting, interesting. That's more than two and okay. . I wouldn't, I would not have thought that , 

[00:13:20] Dr.Fuller-Thompson: neither would I. And in fact, when I talk to anybody else, they all say, oh no, it's gotta be 10% or something like that. But, and you know, some of the blame is to us who are researchers, cuz we've just focused on the negatives. Like I started the conversation with, but without looking at, well there are some people who are completely free of mental illness and are flourishing, and why don't we spend more time thinking about who those people are and how they got there and how can we help more people get to that point. 

[00:13:51] Peter: Really, really interesting thoughts. I, you know, it's interesting. I think that a lot of, and I mean, look, I, I'm not the doctor you are, but I think there's, I wonder if a part of the reason that people with A D H D tend to find themselves in positive spaces more often is because, , we're very, very good at changing the subject. In other words, we're in a bad mood for as long as that bad mood can hold our attention. . 

[00:14:16] Dr.Fuller-Thompson: Okay, well, so fine. But, but at least, at least, uh, almost daily in the past month, uh, past week, months, uh, you have to have been happy. So you're saying the, it's the, uh,

[00:14:28] Peter: well, cause you have, you have to be happy 24 7. I mean, no one's happy.

No, no, 

[00:14:32] Dr.Fuller-Thompson: no, no. You have, just have to have happy. Right. Yeah. Or you have, you have happy moments. Oh, well then, now I have to admit that people with a d, ADHD have a much lower rate than people without H adhd. But I, my, what I was focusing on, and I think, I think partly as we said, because we do all this negative research about all the negatives, people feel that they are, they don't have in front of them our potential to flourish. That they, you know, that, that that is not a trajectory for them. And I'm saying, wow, many, many, many people are getting to that incredibly high level of functioning and just, you know, life is good. 

[00:15:12] Peter: Yeah. It's really, you know, it's fascinating. I think that that, you know, we spend a lot of time complaining. Oh, this is this and this. I mean, we got on the phone today, Peter, how you been? Oh my God, these last six months. You know, but, but in retrospect it's not bad. It's, there's day-to-day annoyances in the minutiae, but. , I'm here. I have my health. I'm, I'm, I'm my kid's doing well, you know, all those kinda things. I'm happy and, and I think that I at least look. Again, I'm, I'm looking at a sample of, of one or maybe two here, but I think that A D H D helps you stay happy because there's constantly something exciting. Something shiny just over the next hill. I know it sounds ridiculous.

[00:15:59] Dr.Fuller-Thompson: No, but life is, I mean, let's be honest, it's fun to hang around with people with adhd, life, Ising. Right? 

[00:16:06] Peter: Well, it's fun to hang around with people with adhd as long as those people with ADHD are on the right path or understand their path. I think that that there have been times when I've hung out with people who were probably undiagnosed adhd. You know, I take, I, I, I turn my head for a second. I look back and everyone's railing fat lines of cocaine. So I think that ADHD does have some negatives there in terms of the fun of hanging out with them. But yes, I mean, you know, my, my girlfriend tells me constantly that the reason, one of the reasons she, she, she loves hanging out is she never knows what's gonna happen next. You know, we're, we're sitting in a cafe one day and the next day we're flying somewhere because I read an article about a waterpark or whatever. So I think. You know, you have to, you have to sort of know yourself, but yes, I totally get that. 

[00:16:53] Dr.Fuller-Thompson: Mm-hmm. , so, so again, this was based on a sample, a representative sample of Canadians prior to the pandemic. So I'm pretty confident that the way that data was gathered, it's a really solid national study. So I'm, I'm, I'm confident with those numbers. But I wanted to talk a little bit about what was a hindrance or a help. Apparently I looked at what, what we call the factors associated with A D H D. So what are the characteristics of those, sorry, factors associated with flourishing among those with A D H D. Okay. And so, alright, right, let's just talk about it.

Physical activity. I know this is one of your things. If you were pH physically active, they were four times more likely to be in the state of flourishing four times. 

[00:17:40] Peter: I'm sorry that that's just a, that's just duh. Of course you, you, you, you box for an hour. You go for a run, you're chock full of do you're high as a kite. Of course you're gonna be happier and at the very least you're gonna be happier. Cause, cause it's over, You did it, 

[00:17:54] Dr.Fuller-Thompson: but our, our lifestyle is not conducive to exercise. It's an effort. It's an organi. You have to be organized, you have to get out, you have to do exercise. The, the way you know modern life is it's easier to sit on your couch and it's hard to get that momentum to get up and out, but, Boy, oh boy. Four times the odds. This is, this is a winner. do not pass Go without exercise. Right. 

[00:18:21] Peter: Well, you know what's interesting and that brings up a whole nother series of, of questions. One of the reasons that A D H D you might argue, and again, uh, this could be an argument. One of the reasons a d ADHD has flourished in the past a hundred years, um, is because 300 years ago, 400 years ago, exercise was part of our daily life because we needed to exist. Right. We exercised cause we'd exercise, we wouldn't catch. The, the, the, the, the, the Saber tooth tiger and have dinner. Right? And then we discovered farming, and then we realized we didn't have to walk so much. So the the premise of, you know, having all your food delivered by a messenger, by a, by a, by a GrubHub, um, that's a relatively new concept for our brains. Our brains are, are very, very slow creatures. So that, that's a very, very big part of it. You know, I would be willing to argue that that ADHD or, you know, People were probably a bit happier back then because they had to exercise, they had to work out, or they didn't exist. 

[00:19:09] Dr.Fuller-Thompson: Yeah, absolutely. So now it's an effort you have to put . Structured in your day that you're gonna get to exercise. But this is, you know, I almost never see odds this high, like do this four times. You know, usually something improves it maybe 20%. If you're really, really lucky, it doubles it. But four times. Wow. This is a keeper for sure. You know? Now. Um, the other thing that was really interesting, and I haven't done much research on it, but um, I'd love to do more people who use spirituality to cope with their day to day troubles. Were much more likely to be in complete mental health. 

[00:19:51] Peter: Say it. Say that again, slower. 

[00:19:53] Dr.Fuller-Thompson: So, people who use spirituality or religion, so it may be an organized religion, or it might be spirituality as well. Okay. And if it was very protective. So people who use spirituality were much more likely to be in this happy sat life, satisfied, mentally healthy space.

[00:20:10] Peter: Okay. I believe that if you think there's something bigger than you, regardless of what it is, 

[00:20:15] Dr.Fuller-Thompson: all right, now, the and. And also that you have something to turn to, right? So that you have some right, and it, it's concenter as well. I mean, I don't know exactly why. I just know when you had do these sort of survey research, you don't know the reasons, you just know the association. So, but, um, being married is very protective and I think that's getting back to the confidant, having people on your side, um, and possibly to stabilize you too . 

[00:20:43] Peter: Well, and you know.. There, there are, there, there are outliers of all different studies. Yes. Some not as, some, not as accurate as others, but No, I hear what you're saying. Um, I don't, I don't fit into that. But, um, I would, I would argue the caveat of with the right person., 

[00:20:59] Dr.Fuller-Thompson: right? I would definitely, um, and also, and I mean, being married or being in a, in a committed relationship kind of thing is helpful. Um, if it's, if you're right, if it's with the right person. And the thing is, when you do rep representative samples, usually the ones who aren't with the right person may no longer be with them. So I you don't see them in your analysis. Right. Um, now, Not, again, this is another no-brainer, but people who were in chronic pain were less likely to be in complete mental health. Now that seems completely obvious, but I was surprised how many people, these are relatively young people with ADHD are in chronic pain, perhaps because it risk taking behaviors or i, I don't know why, but, um, that's worth getting treated. You know, you've got your mental health stuff going on, but there's, if there's physical pain, Life is really hard and it's hard to be happy with it. Right. Um, and, uh, again, my poor women with h d they're less likely to be flourishing than men with h d, which is in keeping with all the, the higher prevalence of the negative things that we talked about earlier. Right. Um, so they're less likely to be all, um, completely flourishing. , you know, still many women were, but it's just, um, women with ADHD seem to be struggling more. Um, but there's a couple reasons for that. It's because, so remember I, this study was done almost 10 years ago, so women with a d d were not diagnosed very often. So I have a feeling that the women in my study who were diagnosed with adhd, they were probably fairly far along the spectrum with ADHD to actually get the diagnosis. So they may be. They may be, um, worse off than the av the average woman who would be worse off than the average man just because the people with milder symptoms would, uh, women can often, uh, mask the symptoms better than men because, especially girls, and so they were less likely to be diagnosed. So I have a feeling the women that we have, We're, we're pretty far along, and maybe that's why they're doing poorly. But it may be, it's just there may be less acceptance for women with ADHD related symptoms in society too. Um, we're still working on why women are vulnerable and trying to get a picture of that. But, uh, when more and more women are getting, um, diagnosed, I think there'll be, um, There'll be more understanding and more interventions. And then the other thing I just wanted to talk about, and I, I plugged this ev every time I talk to, uh, uh, you know, people with, uh, ADHD and any mental health CRI crisis. So even though though two 42% were doing really well that means that, you know, a little bit more than half had at least one of these other problems that that wasn't flourishing to the extent that they would like to, or we would all like them to. So, um, I just wanted to suggest that cognitive behavioral therapy, it's also called CBT is relatively short, relatively in inexpensive. It's a, it's a form of talk therapy. You can have it in a group session, eight weeks to 16 weeks, and it's been shown with people with A D H D and people with depression and people with anxiety and people with substance dependence. It's really, really helpful and what it does is it helps you capture your dysfunctional thoughts. So if you're telling yourself negative messages, which you may have heard in childhood, oh, you can't do this. You know, you're never gonna achieve. You tell yourself these types of messages many times an hour, that is gonna pull your, your mood down, your ability to function. So it helps you grab these thoughts and look at them objectively and reevaluate. And it can, it's, it really is kind of almost like you're reprogramming your own brain with more positive messaging, and that is helpful for, for almost every negative mental health outcome and certainly promotes better mental health. 

[00:25:02] Peter: No question about it. What a phenomenal interview. We're well passed our time but that was totally worth it. Thank you, Esme it's wonderful to have you back. As always,

[00:25:11] Dr.Fuller-Thompson: my pleasure. 

[00:25:11] Peter: You're welcome here anytime you want. Really, really good stuff. Thank you again for taking the time. It's, it's great to talk to you again

[00:25:18] Dr.Fuller-Thompson: And thank you Peter for what you do for the whole community of people with ADHD. We all appreciate it. 

[00:25:24] Peter: That means a lot. Thank you. Okay guys. Fast than normal is for you. And I got some good news actually. So it turns out that Faster Than Normal, the book, which most of you know about and have read and probably brought you here, um, is still printing. It's, it's gone into like it's fourth or something, printing, and I've written five books and all five books I've gotten advances on, right? Uh, progressively more and more money. And then this Faster Than Normal I get a really nice advance and I thought, wow, there's a really nice advance. There's no way I'll ever make it back because I've never made an advance back in any of my previous. I beat my advance for Faster Than Normal. So, so finally, like five years later, I am actually earning royalties and, and I owe that to everyone who has ever listened to everyone who has ever bought a copy of Fast Than Normal. Thank you. It means the world to me. 

We will see you again next week. We actually probably won't because next week is a holiday. We're probably gonna take a couple weeks off and we'll be back in the new year. We have, uh, sponsors coming up. We have new sponsors for the for the podcast. Lot of cool stuff. New guests, amazing guests, amazing repeat guests like Esme. Lots of people coming on the podcast, so, so stay tuned. As always, Faster Than Normal is for you. A D H D. All sorts of neurodiversity can be gifts as long as you know how to use them. Have a safe and wonderful holiday guys. We will see you soon.

Credits: You've been listening to the Faster Than Normal podcast. We're available on iTunes, Stitcher and Google play and of course at www.FasterThanNormal.com I'm your host, Peter Shankman and you can find me at shankman.com and @petershankman on all of the socials. If you like what you've heard, why not head over to your favorite podcast platform of choice and leave us a review, come more people who leave positive reviews, the more the podcast has shown, and the more people we can help understand that ADHD is a gift, not a curse. Opening and closing themes were composed and produced by Steven Byrom who also produces this podcast, and the opening introduction was recorded by Bernie Wagenblast. Thank you so much for listening. We'll see you in January- Happy Holidays!! 

Nov 23, 2022

Melissa Finkelstein is a New Jersey- based author, lawyer, and proud mom of three. Melissa has been writing and rhyming since she could form words. After graduating from Fordham Law, she began her career as a litigator in Manhattan. Because rhyming has always been her passion, she created a custom poetry business, Designer Rhymes so she could maintain that creative outlet. Once she had her son (7), and twin daughters (4), each with unique personalities and needs, the stars aligned for Melissa to publish her first children's book. Picky the Panda and the Tickly Tail is the first book in a series of three to come from author Melissa Finkelstein. Picky the Panda is a heartwarming story about a highly sensitive panda, which shares lessons of embracing sensory differences, practicing empathy, and recharging when overwhelmed. Picky the Panda was inspired by Melissa's daughter Skylar who has sensory processing disorder. Picky the Panda is now available on Amazon and in select children's bookstores. Enjoy! 

In this episode Peter and Melissa discuss:  

01:20 - Thank you so much for listening and for subscribing!

01:39 - Intro and welcome Melissa Finkelstein!

02:48 - So from Law to Children’s books; tell us your story!

05:40 - Isn’t it amazing what kids teach us. Are you finding that people are familiar with the topics in your book?

06:57 - What led to getting your daughter diagnosed?

09:30 - How old is she now and have all of your children read the book?

10:15 - Do you think that she’s beginning to, (or will), benefit some from advances in awareness, research, etc?

11:18 - What’s been the reaction and feedback to your book outside of the family?

12:00 - Is the book being used to explain to your daughter's classmates about Sensory Processing Disorder?

13:30 - On possessing supercharged senses

14:25 - How can people find more about you? Web: Everywhere fine books are sold

Socials:  @melissafinkelsteinbooks on INSTA

14:45 - Thank you Melissa!

15:02 - Guys, as always thanks so much for subscribing! Faster Than Normal is for YOU! We want to know what you’d like to hear! Do you have a cool friend with a great story? We’d love to learn about, and from them. I'm www.petershankman.com and you can reach out anytime via email at peter@shankman.com or @petershankman on all of the socials. You can also find us at @FasterNormal on all of the socials. It really helps when you drop us a review on iTunes and of course, subscribe to the podcast if you haven’t already! As you know, the more reviews we get, the more people we can reach. Help us to show the world that ADHD is a gift, not a curse! 

15:41 - Faster Than Normal Podcast info & credits.

TRANSCRIPT via Descript and then corrected.. somewhat:

[00:00:34] Peter: Hey everyone, how's it going? My name is Peter Shankman and this is Faster Than Normal. I wanted to see if you expected me to say it, try to shake things up a little bit. Okay. It is a Thursday here in a very cold New York City. We have to say a fond farewell to fall, which lasted about. Two and a half days, and we are most certainly into winter. It's about 34 degrees outside right now, sunny, but cold as hell. So I am inside with a sleeping dog and with Melissa Finkelstein. She's actually in New Jersey, but we are talking today because Melissa is a New Jersey based author, lawyer, and proud mom of three. She's been writing and rhyming since she could form words. Her words, not mine. After graduating from Fordham Law, she began her career as a litigator in Manhattan. She created a custom poetry business called Designer Rhymes. So here she is as a litigator. Did you, I, I gotta ask you later, remind me to ask you if you actually rhymed during court cases. Cause that would've been awesome. Mm-hmm. . But why are we talking to her today? We're talking to her. She has a son who's seven and twin daughters who are four. They each have unique personality and needs. That's where she decided to publish her first book called her first Children's book called Picky the Panda and the Tickly Tale. It's a first book in a series of three and Picky The Panda is a heartwarming story about a highly sensitive panda who shares lessons of embracing sensory diff differences, practicing empathy and recharging when overwhelmed, and I think we can all relate to that Picky The Panda- on Amazon and everywhere you get children's books. Welcome Melissa. Good to have you. 

[00:02:15] Melissa: Good morning. Thank you so much. I'm so happy to be here. Thanks for that intro

[00:02:18] Peter: And just in case you ever think that nothing good comes out of divorce. Melissa came to me through my ex, let me get this right, my ex sister-in-law. 

[00:02:32] Melissa: That's right. 

[00:02:33] Peter: My ex-step sister-in-law. Right.

[00:02:34] Melissa: I think you're stuck with her. I think she's just your sister-in-law still. 

[00:02:37] Peter: Yeah. My sister-in-law, she reached out to me and said, you know, hey, have a guest for you. I'm like, I didn't even know you knew I had a podcast. So good to know . Anyway, it is great to meet you, Melissa. Thank you for taking the time. So from law to children's books, tell us your story! 

[00:02:52] Melissa: Sure. So I've always been a writer and a rhymer, um, as I said, and that's really been my passion and that's kinda how I wound up in law. Um, I thought, you know, I'm really good at writing. I'm good at. Reading and problem solving. My skill sets seem to fit. I'm gonna go be a lawyer. It sounds pretty fancy and you know, I can have all this success and, um, I did have some fun and, you know, some fulfillment doing it, but I really missed like the joy and the whimsy of my childhood, to be honest. Um, so I toyed with the idea. Maybe I would be a preschool teacher. I know that couldn't be more opposite from being a litigator in Manhattan, but I really just wanted to use my creativity. My fun, you know, happy go lucky personality and doing like corporate insecurities litigation really didn't bring me that kind of joy. Um, as you might expect. And, you know, my life was all about disputes and I, I'm all about making peace. I'm like, what am I doing? Why am I fighting for a living? So this, this isn't bringing me joy anymore. Um, so all along, as you mentioned, while I was litigating, I had my little side gig, which just really was. You know, a passion project and bringing me happiness and it was creating custom poems for people for, you know, milestone occasions and that kind of thing. And I loved making others happy through my words. And so once I had my kids, I thought, you know, this is perfect. They're all so different. You know, they're, they learned so much from children's books and I think this would be a great outlet for me to use my words and. You know, I, I'm starting a series of three books, each of which are inspired by my three kids. So they're like my little muses at this point. Um, and in doing so, I'm focusing on what, you know, one of their biggest personality, um, pieces or struggles or challenges are to, you know, try to reach children like them. And in doing so, I wrote and published my first book, Picky The Panda and the Tickly Tale as you mentioned. And it is inspired by my little girl, Skyler, who has sensory processing disorder. And I didn't realize that by sharing her story, um, you know, I actually have become kind of a sensory processing disorder advocate and someone who is working. My butt off at this point to bring awareness to this condition and to what children like Skyler and um, like so many of your listeners might be experiencing. And that has been one of the most beautiful things to come from pivoting into my role as a children's book author. 

[00:05:22] Peter: It's interesting because, you know, I mean, first of all, I had some nursery school teachers who definitely could have been litigators, but, but that's neither here nor there. Um, , it's interesting, you know, you made that switch. Kids do that. They, they, they have this uncanny ability to take whatever you think is your thing and just completely flip it on its head. Um, the concept of sensory processing disorder much like ADD, a ADHD executive function disorder. Not a lot is known. And so bringing, I, I'm assuming one of the reasons you wrote the book was to bring awareness to sensory process. Absolut, what are you finding, um, when you tell people about it, what percentage would you say understand, oh yeah, of course. I've heard of that. Or, or, you know, is it, I mean, are you, are you, is it a constant battle with the teachers? Is it, how, how, how are you finding that to be?

[00:06:14] Melissa: It's becoming a much more wide spread. Um, you know, thing that people are aware of right now, but I think really the book shares this Panda's experience as being a highly sensitive, um, individual and what she goes through. And I think people are really relating to her experience more than they may have known or been aware of a diagnosis or a condition, um, called sensory processing disorder. So that's really been beneficial to me. Um, so yeah, I would say. I, I don't know. It's a smaller percentage than I would like for people to be aware of because it is a very real condition and you know, a very intense experience for those who go through it. 

[00:06:57] Peter: How did you discover that your, how did you get your d daughter diagnosed? What was, what was sort of the key takeaways that, that made you say, Hey, we should look into this? 

[00:07:06] Melissa: So she was in, so she's a twin. I'll start with that. So, um, I was constantly seeing her right next to her twin sister, and, you know, all kids are different obviously. So she was having a very different experience as a baby, a child than her twin sister was. So I think that helped make it more apparent to me that she was going through something and she was in an obvious discomfort and, um, just kind of unsettled a lot of the time. And, you know, I knew there wasn't anything medical going on with her because she, she was doing okay medically, we were bringing her to the pediatrician. Everything was fine, but I could just tell that she was uncomfortable. And my son at the time was in occupational therapy for a different issue that was going on. Um, and so I brought Skylar when she was one years old to this pediatric occupational therapist. Who I've come to know and trust and had her assessor and right away she said, this is something sensory going on. And to be honest, I was a doubter at first. Um, I didn't really know very much about sensory processing disorder or sensory sensitivity or any of that. And, um, I can tell you later that I've come to realize that I actually have a lot of sensory challenges myself, which I've learned through my daughter. So anyway, this pediatric, uh, occupational therapist evaluated her and right away she knew it was something sensory. Um, I watched the evaluation and I was like, you know, I don't know. I'm not really seeing it because she was, um, exposing to her to certain sensory, tactile, um, you know, things like sand and foam and, you know, different manipulatives that she could touch, and I thought she was fine. I'm like, you know, I see her getting her hands messy. But all along there were these little cues that were going on that she was able to pick up on. So just for one example, she showed me that while Skylar was, you know, digging into these Orbis, which are these like liquidy beads that children can play with, she was actually salivating and had like, Drool coming out of her mouth while she was doing it because her sensory system was just so overloaded, um, that while she was willing to do it, her system actually couldn't handle it. So that's just one example of how, you know, we came to be aware of it and then, you know, all the cues and clues just sort of lined up after that. And occupational therapy has been one of our greatest tools for her so far, 

[00:09:22] Peter: I'm sure. How old is she now? 

[00:09:24] Melissa: She's almost five. Okay. 

[00:09:26] Peter: And has she, has she. Do you read the book to her?

[00:09:30] Melissa: Yes. Yes. I, all my children have read the book and they love it. And my other two children wanna know when theirs are coming out and they are in the works. , 

[00:09:39] Peter: One of the things that I've discovered, um, uh, about sort of, ADD & ADHD when you're talking to kids about it, and so I'm assuming the same thing is, is truly is, it's all about how it's framed When I was growing. Um, you know, a ADD didn't exist. What existed was sit down, you disrupt in the class disease. And, and so I, kids our age, um, if they eventually got diagnosed had also had to overcome the stigma of 30, 40 years of being told they're broken. are you seeing with kids your daughter's age because of advances in research? Advances in, uh, awareness? They're not going through the whole concept of you're broken, they're not gonna have to heal from that. They can start looking at what they have as, you know, a difference as opposed to being broken. 

[00:10:36] Melissa: Yeah, I really hope that's the case, and I agree with what you said. Um, and one of the purposes of this book is to frame heighten sensitivity or. Sensory challenges as a gift. And I know that that's something that you like to speak about, um, in terms of adhd and I absolutely agree with that. Um, so in terms of heightened sensitivity, you know, yes, it can present struggles and challenges, but it can also be your greatest gift. It can be, you know, the way you use your imagination and can be creative the way you are compassionate and empathetic and can show love. So it can really be a strength. And that's one of the things that I'm hoping to share with children who may feel like Skylar, um, as term in terms of their sensitivity, 

[00:11:18] Peter: What's been the reaction or the, what's been the feedback to the book or the reaction to the book, um, outside of your family? 

[00:11:25] Melissa: Oh, it's been wonderful. I've been hearing from so many families saying, you know, we have a little picky at home. Um, you know, my daughter like, wants to read it every day. She feels like Pickalina so it, that's been the best part of this. When I set out to become an author, I just wanted to use my words to make children and families happy and, you know, provide them with a good bedtime story. I actually didn't have these higher goals of, you know, bringing such awareness. and acceptance to children with differences, but like that has become the greatest gift. And the thing that I'm most proud of and most excited about in my journey so far.

[00:12:01] Peter: Is the book being used, um, as sort of a way to explain to your daughter's, classmates about the different, because I imagine that much like ad although ADHD manifests in different ways, I imagine that sensory processing disorder must manifest itself in some ways that would make the kids go, what the heck's that all about?

[00:12:20] Melissa: Absolutely. So there's a page in the book where Picky the Panda um, has become so overwhelmed that she's feeling dysregulated and she's hiding under the table in her classroom, and she is rocking and crying because she is so overwhelmed and her body feels such big feelings. And the students. Who are her animal friends gather around her and they yell Picky. It's ok because you know, they're just trying to be kind and they're like, come outta the table, everything's great. But for her, everything's not great at that moment. So that, you know, that doesn't work for Picky and it takes different strategies to get her to be able to recharge and calm her body down. So I think, you know, empathy and understanding and realizing that we are all different is definitely one of the biggest messages. So, yes, to make children, um, and classmates who encounter kids like Skyler or who have other differences to be accepting and empathetic. 

[00:13:12] Peter: I like the concept of supercharged senses in the book because, you know, adhd, I consider it a superpower and I try to frame it as a superpower. So the concept of supercharged senses sort of seems very similar in the respect that you just have to, you know, if, if when I talk about adhd, I talk about the fact that. You know, most people are given Honda Accords for brains and we're given Lamborghini's, and so that's great, but you have to learn how to drive it, or you're gonna crash into a tree. You know, anyone could drive a Honda. You need training to drive a Lamborghini. And so I'm assuming it's the same premise with supercharged senses. I really love that term. 

[00:13:46] Melissa: Yeah, thank you. And absolutely, I agree with that. Something we have to learn to adapt to and adjust to. But like I said, it, and like you always say, um, it can really be seen as one of our biggest gifts. Very cool. So my daughter can, she's, you know, the first one to smell something stinky or she can see something a mile away. She can hear that train coming, you know, 10 stops away. So, you know, she really does have supercharged senses, but it also can lead her to feel very overwhelmed and heightened at certain times.

[00:14:15] Peter: Very cool. How can, so I'm assuming, yeah, it's available on Amazon, it's available everywhere. Um, how can people connect with you? Are you on Instagram? Are you on Facebook? 

[00:14:24] Melissa: Yes. So I am on Instagram at Melissa Finkelstein books. Um, and that is a great place to follow me. I'll have information about Picky the Panda um, sensory processing awareness and about my forthcoming books, um, the next of which will be out in early 2023. 

[00:14:42] Peter: Very, very cool. Melissa, thank you so much for taking time to be on Fast Than Normal today. I really, really appreciate it. 

[00:14:47] Melissa: Thank you so much. It's been wonderful. 

[00:14:49] Peter: Awesome guys. Check out the book. It is a lot of fun. Picky, I love, I love, I love the title Picky, the Panda and the Tickly Tale, talking about sensory processing disorder as supercharged senses. I love it. We back next week with another interview. This is Faster Than Normal. God, talk.. I mean fast- talk about fast, right? The entire year it's, it's almost Thanksgiving here next week in New York, it's gonna be Thanksgiving and I have absolutely no idea how that happened. And it's Christmas and it's New Year's and yeah, it's essentially summer already next year. So I dunno how we got there. But we will see you next week with another interview. Thank you so much for listening. Remember that neurodiversity is a gift, not a curse. And we are all on this train together. Talk to you guys soon. Stay tuned.

Credits: You've been listening to the Faster Than Normal podcast. We're available on iTunes, Stitcher and Google play and of course at www.FasterThanNormal.com I'm your host, Peter Shankman and you can find me at shankman.com and @petershankman on all of the socials. If you like what you've heard, why not head over to your favorite podcast platform of choice and leave us a review, come more people who leave positive reviews, the more the podcast has shown, and the more people we can help understand that ADHD is a gift, not a curse. Opening and closing themes were composed and produced by Steven Byrom who also produces this podcast, and the opening introduction was recorded by Bernie Wagenblast. Thank you so much for listening. We'll see you next week!

Nov 2, 2022

Hey guys! Peter Shankman the host of Faster Than Normal here. I wanna invite you to something! I am hosting a Mastermind with 12 amazing speakers who are gonna be talking about everything from ADHD to mental health, from entrepreneurship, to just living your life better. It's gonna be on November 10th, It's gonna be virtual from anywhere in the world. Incredible, incredible speakers. The leading fitness trainer in Canada for all things. Me! A whole bunch of speakers- Scott Carney, who wrote the book which is to all about how he goes and takes ice showers every day. It's gonna be 12 amazing speakers, the CBS Early Shows’ Jennifer Hartstein, really, really great people. And I'd like you to join us. Check out the link below in the show notes at ShankMinds 2022 and we will see you there. And a matter of fact, look for the discount code in the show notes as well, that'll take a hundred bucks off the cost. We'll see you soon! https://shankman.lpages.co/shankminds-virtual-2022/  DISCOUNT CODE:  SMFriends22

Marc believes that finding your Vision and Purpose are the key to finding success, happiness, and fulfillment. Harvard-educated, he left a lucrative tech career for art school, founded the long-running online gallery Every Day Original, and has been mentoring and coaching creatives for over a decade. He now Coaches a wide variety of clients and helps them access their own creativity to fuel their next steps. He is now getting his Coaching certification and working one-on-one, in groups, and in his free online workshops to help people create a bigger vision for their life and career through Purpose-driven breakthroughs. He shares many of the how’s and why’s with us here today, enjoy! 

—— 

In this episode Peter and Marc discuss:  

01:20 - Thank you so much for listening and for subscribing!

01:39 - Intro and welcome Marc Scheff!

02:40 - Why did you give up a lucrative career in Technology to pursue a career in Art?

03:51 - So where did you study; how did it go?

05:10 - Why do you want to help people and how did you land on “vision and purpose”?

08:06 - Is it really as easy as “find what you love doing and the money will come eventually?”

09:37 - Freedom in work, can feel completely overwhelming

10:20 - How can people find more about you? Web: www.MarcScheffCoaching.com (or via www.CreativeAccelerationCoaching.com) and https://www.marcscheff.com

Socials:  @MarcScheff on Twitter INSTA and LinkedIN 

12:02 - Guys, as always thanks so much for subscribing! Faster Than Normal is for YOU! We want to know what you’d like to hear! Do you have a cool friend with a great story? We’d love to learn about, and from them. I'm www.petershankman.com and you can reach out anytime via email at peter@shankman.com or @petershankman on all of the socials. You can also find us at @FasterNormal on all of the socials. It really helps when you drop us a review on iTunes and of course, subscribe to the podcast if you haven’t already! As you know, the more reviews we get, the more people we can reach. Help us to show the world that ADHD is a gift, not a curse! 

12:16 - Faster Than Normal Podcast info & credits

TRANSCRIPT via Descript and then corrected.. somewhat: 

Hey guys. Peter Shankman the host of Faster Than Normal here. I wanna invite you to something! I am hosting a Mastermind with 12 amazing speakers who are gonna be talking about everything from ADHD to mental health, from entrepreneurship, to just living your life better. It's gonna be on November 10th, It's gonna be virtual from anywhere in the world. Incredible, incredible speakers. The leading fitness trainer in Canada for all things. Me! A whole bunch of speakers- Scott Carney, who wrote the book which is to all about how he goes and takes ice showers every day. It's gonna be 12 amazing speakers, the CBS Early Shows’ Jennifer Hartstein, really, really great people. And I'd like you to join us. Check out the link below in the show notes at ShankMinds 2022 and we will see you there. And a matter of fact, look for the discount code in the show notes as well, that'll take a hundred bucks off the cost. We'll see you soon! https://shankman.lpages.co/shankminds-virtual-2022/

[00:01:26] Peter: Hey everyone. My name is Peter Shankman. This is Faster Than Normal. You knew that though, cuz you're probably subscribed to this podcast and it doesn't really make sense for me to keep saying that, but I do it on every episode cuz maybe there'll be someone new today. Anyway, good to have you back for another week. Uh, we are going to start today's podcast with an interesting guest who believes that vision, finding your vision and finding your purpose are the key to finding success, happiness, and fulfillment. I wouldn't argue with that per se. He was Harvard educated and he left a lucrative tech for art school, unlike other famous people who have gone to art school, though he did not commit to, uh, doing bad things, he found the long running online gallery every day, original, and has been mentoring and coaching creatives for over a decade. I love that he focuses on creatives. He uses creativity to fuel their next steps. He's now getting his coaching certificate and working one-on-one groups and his free online workshops to help people create bigger vision for their lives and career through purpose driven bake, uh, purpose driven ba. Well, my God, what is going on? 

[00:02:24] Marc: You're going faster than normal Peter! 

[00:02:26] Peter: breakthroughs!! Geezus! Okay, that being said, say hi to Mark Scheff! Hi, Marc. Welcome! 

[00:02:31] Marc: Thanks, Peter. Great to be here. 

[00:02:33] Peter: Never interview someone. Friday at 5:00 PM this is what happened ! Nice to talk to you, so. What made you leave for, for Art school of all things. You just had this, this love and this passion for art, and you're like, Screw it. I'm leaving Tech. 

[00:02:49] Marc: Well, I mean, I always loved art. Like, like probably every artist says, but, you know, um, you know, I had a, I I grew up in a sort of, I don't know what you wanna call, is sort of traditional, uh, productive, focused household and, uh, certainly not one that understood to things like ADHD and a, um, you know, so when I went to Harvard, you have to pick your major in your first year. And I thought, well, I'll pick something that'll make me money. Cuz you certainly can't have a career as an artist. That's crazy, right? Um, so I, I studied computer science and I went and I got a job and I, and I said, Okay, I'm gonna take the art classes that I said I was gonna take and I realized, Oh, I, I really like this. This is really great. Um, so I started taking more art classes and more art classes. And my manager at one point, this woman Amy, who I, I sent a thank you note recently, um, took me aside one day and kind of offered me a chance to be, it's funny, offered me a chance to be a part of some secret upcoming layoffs. And I took it and I took a little severance and I put a down payment on my art, uh, my Art degree. 

[00:03:44] Peter: Wow. Wow. That's a, it's, it's always fascinating how those things happen because that's exactly how it always happens, right? It's always something out of the blue and random. Yeah. So where did you study? Where'd you study art?

[00:03:54] Marc: I studied art at the Academy of Art University in San Francisco. That's where I was listening and working in tech. Yep. Um, I had a, I studied illustration there. Um, I got my degree in the early 2000. Um, and you know, from there, and, and, and this is probably not unusual for your guests, I went on to do all kinds of things. I was a staff artist, I was a creative director, uh, you know, almost a founder of a startup. I, you know, I ran teams. I, I was on teams. I did a little bit of everything before moving to New York where I did a lot more, where I sort of discovered freelance and started doing more freelance stuff. And that's when I started really getting into kind of coaching and mentoring Artists. Cuz I was learning so much and I think, I think I read your book, um, which by the way, everyone should absolutely go read this book. It's, it, it, and you didn't pay me to say that. It's, it really was wonderful . I, uh, I got it and I, I actually listened to it and then I bought a copy and gave it to my wife and said, You have to read chapter six if you read nothing else. Um, you know, and, and so I, you know, when I go and I learn things, I, I get very excited about what I've learned and I wanna kind of pass it on. And that's essentially how I got into all this. 

[00:05:00] Peter: Very cool. Tell us about, So a lot of our guests come to me, you know, they say, I can't find my passion. I have no idea what my vision is. I have no idea what my purpose is. What am I supposed to be doing? You know, they're, they're 30, they're 40, and they're like, you know, I've just been cruising along and I don't know if it's the right thing. So you seem to have it down where, you know, if, if you say believe, finding your vision and purpose like you to find success, you must have a way to help people do that.

[00:05:19] Marc: I have a few ways, uh, . That's true. 

[00:05:22] Peter: Well, let's chat about that. Why, why, why vision and success versus anything else? 

[00:05:26] Marc: Um, well, vision and purpose. I, you know, vision and purpose, right? . I've been working, I've been working with this concept of purpose from way back in San Francisco when I started going to a, a weekly men's circle. And the purpose of the men's circle was to support men in living their purpose. Now, this wasn't some sort. You know, secret cabal. This was, this was really us all pushing each other to sort of bring our gifts to the world. And the way that we did that was we, we really worked hard to discover purpose, which we often boiled down to one or two words. What I've found, and in fact, I met with a client today who said, you know, who told me the, the work that we did, the work that we did, on discovering vision and purpose made all those other decisions that she was struggling with easier. Um, and as someone, you know, has someone who also manages, you know, ADHD or works with ADHD, you know, we have all these ideas. We have. We are like you say, faster than normal. Um, and sometimes it's like, it's like too much and it can feel overwhelming. So what vision and purpose does is it gets you down to really like the core of what you're doing on this earth in this lifetime. And when you're looking at, you know, literally what you should have for dinner, it can make that decision easier. Cuz you say, well, I'm the person. So, for example, my purpose currently is to unleash creativity. It's what I do in my coaching, whether they're an artist or a non-artist. I, I work with people to get creative around their, the solutions to, to their life. And so, uh, the, the way that. The way that I, the way that I work with people on that is I use various tools. I use various tools that, that probably a lot of different coaches know, but I focus in on that level of thinking because then when you come to these other decisions, you say, Well, what if my vision is this and my purpose is this? Am I really like a pizza guy or, or a fried chicken guy? I mean, it's not always that easy, but, but it can be

[00:07:11] Peter: Very, very cool. You know, it's interesting, the, the concept of purpose is something I don't think people are taught right there. There's, there's, and I, I've talked to teachers about this because, you know, there's this premise of you go to school and you learn what you're supposed to learn, which is never the right thing. You don't learn how to bounce a checkbook or, you know, how to do taxes, you know, But, but, and they always, they always, there's that one joke where the, the guidance counselor says to you, you know, figure out you'd wanna do for free. And that's what you should do for a. Like what you'd love to do. That's what you should do for, you know, what you, what you wanna do, what you love. And it never seems to work out. I, 

[00:07:41] Marc: I was, I have some, I have some issues with that. 

[00:07:43] Peter: can't tell you how many things I was supposed to be doing. Uh, you know, but I think that, that, that for kids coming outta school, they don't necessarily know. They've seen, especially kids today, they've, they've, they've watched, you know, uh, kids that of nowhere make millions on TikTok and, and, and create, you know, and they're confused. Cause they know, in reality it's, it's very, very difficult to do that, but, Right. You know, they also haven't been told anything else. Right. Right. And they don't know what their purpose is. And I don't necessarily know, you're supposed to know what your purpose is in your twenties, but it, it does become that question of at what point should you say, Here's what I love to do, here's what I wanna do, here's how I wanna change the world.

[00:08:16] Marc: Yeah. I mean, I think it is different for everybody. Um, you know, I have worked with people who have discovered that they actually wanna be doing something else for their work or something else with their free time or, or, or whatever. Um, I do think. And I'm in my mid forties. Um, and I do see a lot of people around this age starting to struggle with this question cuz we're, you know, if, if it's midlife, we're supposedly sort of halfway there and you start to think about, okay, well at some point I'm leaving. What do I want my legacy to be? And that's when I think a lot of people start thinking about purpose. I mean, some people come to it much, much earlier, but I have two, I have two kids, one's seven, one's 12. And you know, they don't , they don't grapple with that, you know, at all. So it's, it's quite. Thing to be dealing with at, I think at that, at that particular age. But at some point, like I said, you know, you, you know, you, you, you go so far and we don't live in a wor like, you know, my dad's generation and my dad included, you know, he, he, he's a doctor. He got a job. Somewhere, and he stayed in that job. You know, he maybe had a couple of jobs over the course of his career and did different things, but he was always focused on that, that sort of purpose, which, whether or not that was his core purpose, that's what he chose and that's what he stuck to. We now live in a world with the internet, with, you know, you can do, you know, you can do anything and be doing TikTok and Instagram and, you know, skydiving, uh, for example, um, as, as a, as a random example. Um, you know, and so we, we have all this freedom, which can be completely overwhelming. And that's where I think a lot of folks, at least in the communities where I work, we were start thinking about, okay, well if we can boil this down to something that is core to ourselves, and this is what I do in my workshops, it's what I do in my one-on-one coaching. It's what I'll be doing in my group coaching because I really, I, I've seen it over and it's not just a belief I've seen. The proof is is there, I've seen people and the people who do the work and, you know, do the writing and, and come and, and come up with something that is their purpose, that is their vision. They come back, you know, just really lit up and they say, I, I, I found focus, I found happiness. I'm like, you know, I'm like, I'm like dancing when I get up in the morning and I'm, you know, I didn't do that for them. They did it, but I, but I provide these, you know, these various frameworks for them to think through these.

[00:10:20] Peter: No, I mean, it makes sense. Tell us, tell people how we can find you. You know how, if they want to, if they, if they like what they're hearing, they say, Hey, this is something I'd like!

[Web: www.MarcScheffCoaching.com (or via www.CreativeAccelerationCoaching.com) and https://www.marcscheff.com  Socials:  @MarcScheff on Twitter INSTA and LinkedIN ]

[00:10:28] Marc: Um, well, you can find me. Uh, I'm, I'm on the internet in most places as my name Marc Scheff . Um, I, I am also an artist, so if you can find, you know, you can find my portfolio at Marc Scheff , but my Marc Scheff coaching is my coaching website. If you can't remember. Spell my name. You can just go to Creative Acceleration Coaching. And that just goes to my website. And there's, um, there's an opportunity there for a free coaching session. I, I like to do these free coaching sessions, um, because it's actually a filter for them and for me, Uh, if someone, first of all doesn't take the step to book the, the, the appointment, then you know, that's probably a good sign that, that they're not gonna, they're not gonna do the work. Uh, but also when we meet, I actually, what I do is I just coach people for. 30 or 45 minutes and give them kind of an overview of some of the different tools that I use. So I've had people walk out of that and say things like, you know, there's, you know, I, I got, I got great value out of that 30 or 40 minutes, and now I wanna know more. If, you know, if they walk away and it sort of fizzles out for them, then, then that's, you know, that's okay too. But it's a great way for people to, you know, I don't, I don't push sales. I don't, you know, at the end of the call I'm not like, Okay, you can commit now and there's a special deal and all this stuff.

[00:11:31] Peter: Right, right, right. 

[00:11:31] Marc: Yeah, I don't do any of that stuff cuz I really, in fact, I've had people say, Send me a PayPal. I say, actually I want you to, if you, if you want, if you write me an email in a week and still want it, then I'll do it. Exactly. Cause I want you to really like see if this lasts for you. If you're really still making progress on the work that you did in that 30 minutes, then we should totally, we should totally keep going. Cause there, cuz you're, I love that. Yeah. There's a connection. 

[00:11:53] Peter: I love that. Yeah. Very cool. Marc, thank you so much for taking the time. I really appreciate it, that it's really kind of you. 

[00:11:58] Marc: Thanks for having me. Big fan of your work and just really glad to be here. Thank you. 

[00:12:02] Peter: Awesome. We'll definitely have you back. Guys as always Faster Than Normal is for YOU! We wanna know what you wanna hear. Shoot us an email. If you have any guests you think would work for us, peter@shankman.com, let me know. We'd love to get 'em on the podcasts. We'll see you next week. ADHD is a gift, not a curse. Stay safe.

Credits: You've been listening to the Faster Than Normal podcast. We're available on iTunes, Stitcher and Google play and of course at www.FasterThanNormal.com I'm your host, Peter Shankman and you can find me at shankman.com and @petershankman on all of the socials. If you like what you've heard, why not head over to your favorite podcast platform of choice and leave us a review, come more people who leave positive reviews, the more the podcast has shown, and the more people we can help understand that ADHD is a gift, not a curse. Opening and closing themes were composed and produced by Steven Byrom who also produces this podcast, and the opening introduction was recorded by Bernie Wagenblast. Thank you so much for listening. We'll see you next week!

Oct 26, 2022

Hey guys! Peter Shankman the host of Faster Than Normal here. I wanna invite you to something! I am hosting a Mastermind with 12 amazing speakers who are gonna be talking about everything from ADHD to mental health, from entrepreneurship, to just living your life better. It's gonna be on November 10th, It's gonna be virtual from anywhere in the world. Incredible, incredible speakers. The leading fitness trainer in Canada for all things. Me! A whole bunch of speakers- Scott Carney, who wrote the book which is to all about how he goes and takes ice showers every day. It's gonna be 12 amazing speakers, the CBS Early Shows’ Jennifer Hartstein, really, really great people. And I'd like you to join us. Check out the link below in the show notes at ShankMinds 2022 and we will see you there. And a matter of fact, look for the discount code in the show notes as well, that'll take a hundred bucks off the cost. We'll see you soon! https://shankman.lpages.co/shankminds-virtual-2022/  DISCOUNT CODE:  SMFriends22

We’re visiting again today with Aron Croft who’s made some changes since our last visit on Episode 240, “The Un-Squeaky Wheel: How Inattentive ADHD Goes Under the Radar w/ Aron Croft” including developing a new way to help the community; enjoy! In his own words: Aron Croft has always been obsessed with one question: “Why can’t we get ourselves to do tasks that we WANT to do”?  That question was on his mind as he dropped out of college twice, failed out of his first 7 jobs and ended up broke, divorced, and earning minimum wage at 33. After an adult diagnosis of Inattentive ADHD and an M.S. in Coaching Psychology, he decided to abandon neurotypical productivity, and his life changed. He built a successful Fortune 500 career followed by a six-figure coaching business with over 125,000 followers. In his coaching business, he teaches ADHD’ers his contrarian 8% Productivity Habit, which helps them complete their top tasks in 2 hours a day and  never feel behind again. His work has been featured by  ADDitude Magazine, the Attention Deficit Disorder Association, and dozens of top ADHD outlets. To watch a 30 minute training on the 8% Productivity Habit, visit freeadhdtraining.com. 

In this episode Peter and Aron discuss:  

01:20 - Thank you so much for listening and for subscribing!

01:29 - Intro and welcome back Aron Croft!!

02:40 - Tell us what you've been doing since the last time you were on the show? Ref: 8percent Productivity Habit Method

03:20 - What is living in the country like for someone with a faster brain?

04:12 - Is spending time daily in the out-of-doors helping?

05:25 - How have you grown in this environment within the last couple of years?

07:01 - On embracing ‘measured’ change

08:11 - Aron explains his 8percent Productivity Habit

08:47 - “motivation, willpower, and discipline” These may only be neurotypical confines!

09:23 - There are other ways to win!!

09:53 - How do professional Boxers become so fast?

11:16 - On willpower and habits. Skateboarding can strengthen you!

14:13 - How can people find more about you? Web: hiddenADHD.com ALSO  freeadhdtraining.com

Socials: @aroncroft on Twitter  @HiddenADHD on Facebook  INSTA  YouTube and hidden_adhd on TikTok

15:07 - Guys, as always thanks so much for subscribing! Do you have a cool friend with a great story? We’d love to hear. I'm www.petershankman.com and you can reach out anytime via email at peter@shankman.com or @petershankman on all of the socials. You can also find us at @FasterNormal on all of the socials. It really helps when you drop us a review on iTunes and of course, subscribe to the podcast if you haven’t already! As you know, the more reviews we get, the more people we can reach. Help us to show the world that ADHD is a gift, not a curse! 

15:30 - Faster Than Normal Podcast info & credits

TRANSCRIPT via Descript and then corrected.. somewhat: 

Hey guys. Peter Shankman the host of Faster Than Normal here. I wanna invite you to something! I am hosting a Mastermind with 12 amazing speakers who are gonna be talking about everything from ADHD to mental health, from entrepreneurship, to just living your life better. It's gonna be on November 10th, It's gonna be virtual from anywhere in the world. Incredible, incredible speakers. The leading fitness trainer in Canada for all things. Me! A whole bunch of speakers- Scott Carney, who wrote the book which is to all about how he goes and takes ice showers every day. It's gonna be 12 amazing speakers, the CBS Early Shows’ Jennifer Hartstein, really, really great people. And I'd like you to join us. Check out the link below in the show notes at ShankMinds 2022 and we will see you there. And a matter of fact, look for the discount code in the show notes as well, that'll take a hundred bucks off the cost. We'll see you soon! https://shankman.lpages.co/shankminds-virtual-2022/

 

[00:01:23] Peter: Hey everyone. Peter Shankman, another episode of Faster Than Normal. Thrilled to have you here. Welcome aboard. We gotta repeat guest today Aron Croft was here by a year or so ago, and since then he told me that after he, he heard hisself on this episode, he's had to upend his entire life and he moved to a farm. And like, I don't know, I've got 10 acres of land and a chainsaw or something. I'll let him tell you more about that. But Aron Croft has is he was a great guest last time we have him back, and he's always been obsessed with one question, which says, Why can't we get ourselves to do the tasks we wanna do? He dropped outta college twice. He failed his first seven jobs. He ended up broke divorce earning minimum wage, days 33. Then he got diagnosed and then he got an MS in coaching psychology, and he took his neurotypical productivity. His life changed. He built a Fortune 500 career, followed by a six figure coaching business. He teaches ADHD 'ers his contrarian. 8% productivity hat. We'll talk about that. He's at free ADHD training.com and welcome back Aron good to have you, man.

[00:02:21] Aron: Thank you, Peter. This is, this podcast is always the most challenging one for me to be a guest on because it's like, it's so hard to be efficient and, and get everything done that you and I want to talk about in your episode. Cap. 

[00:02:37] Peter: All right, so let's let you start it. Tell us about yourself. Tell us what you've been doing since the last time you had you on. 

[00:02:42] Aron: Yeah, I mean, pretty much just buying 10 acres in a chainsaw. Uh, that's, that's pretty much it, that's taken up most of the last 12 months. Um, what have I been up to really, uh, formalizing, Um, my 8% productivity habit method. Which is really just about how do we get our top task done in just two hours a day. Like, we're not gonna suddenly become sort of full of motivation, willpower, and discipline. Like we've been trying that our whole lives and how do we do that so that we can just stop feeling behind? And, um, that's really what I've been focused on and working with hundreds of ADHDers and, um, now we're just, you know, expanding it out to more.

[00:03:20] Peter: Very, very cool. And tell me that I wanna, I wanna talk about living in the middle of nowhere or on 10 acres or whatever. What's that like for someone with a faster brain?

[00:03:28] Aron: Uh, it's so delightful because, you know, I can just, my brain is going a mile a minute all the time. It's so exhausting. I would love freedom and a break from it sometimes, but like when I go out, like we've got trails on the property and it's just, we're surrounded by just trees and nature and when I just, when I get outside, Um, it just quiets everything down, um, in nature. And so, yeah. So it's just been, it's been absolutely delightful. Um, and there's also like some mindless tasks like cutting, you know, cutting down branches with a chainsaw on the weekend. Like, I don't need to think. And it's very nice for me to not give myself like, cognitive tasks every once in a while.

[00:04:10] Peter: Yep. Are you enjoying, So is there, is there, would you say you're getting more outdoor time than you used? And and is that helping?

[00:04:20] Aron: I, you know, honestly I'd say that I'm getting about, I'm getting a little bit more outdoor time, Not a ton more, but the outdoor time absolutely helps. Like I, I mean, part of the reason we made the move is cause I was living in downtown Chicago and all I would do to leave the apartment was just go and walk in nature. And there was this cool nature path near us. So I'd say that I'm, I'm only getting a little more time in nature, but the other thing I really like is, um, space. Uh, so like you can't see it cuz it's off camera, but like, I literally commandeered the entire big, like what room would be a family room in our basement. I put up a 16 foot long whiteboard of just wallpaper, that's whiteboard wallpaper. Um, I mean, I've got like a studio set up with camera and lights and a nice microphone, and I've just got my shit everywhere. Like on the pasted it on the walls, the post it notes galore! I just love the ability to spread out and try to untangle this like super messy brain.

[00:05:21] Peter: Very cool. And what would you tell people that you've learned? How have you grown in the past couple years?

[00:05:27] Aron: I'd say, I'd say two things. So, um, one is just this idea of like, stop, like, like I, I, I've given up trying to be neurotypical. Um, and you know, that might sound obvious, but I work with a lot of ADHDers and they're still trying to be like what their parents and their peers and their teachers told them to be. And so one is just the freedom to give that up, um, and all the like self-compassion and acceptance that comes with it. And then on the flip side of that, right, and you know this in business, right? Is once I gave that up, um, And I was like, You know what? I'm not gonna be like, So you and I are a little bit different. Like I, I just have the inattentive ADHD symptoms. I wish I had some of the hyperactivity energy stuff, but like, like, I'm like a delicate flower. I burn out after like a few hours of like, I. Of like thinking work. And so I was like, Okay, instead of just saying that, that's like a weakness. How can I just build a productivity system around, around that? And um, so just doing those things and kind of embracing my limitations, quote unquote, has like, turned me into way more powerful than I've ever been. 

[00:06:43] Peter: It sounds like it might have. Um, It's interesting. I, I know a lot of people with adhd, they, they change is difficult; , Right? They get into a routine, they get into a habit, and then change becomes sort of a, a, a fear, right? You embrace it. 

[00:07:01] Aron: Um, I embrace, I embrace measured change. Okay. Um, because Right. It's, that's important. That's an important distinction. It is. Right. But like, but it, it's like so many things we don't realize that we're actually trying to. For two variables. And we're really looking for balance, right? We want, we want no change, but we also want lots of novelty and variety, right? And so we're, we're kind of, we kind of need to find that right balance. You know, I find so many people with their, uh, Productivity. They're like, I wanna get all my top tasks done. But I also don't wanna be forced into like Right. Having to do it. And I wanna like feel like doing them. Like I don't want it to be painful. And it's sort of like, okay, like if we can make explicit those like trade offs that we're trying to make, we can find a solution. That's the, that sounded theoretical. I feel like I'm just dabbling. Sorry, Peter. 

[00:07:53] Peter: No, no, it makes sense. So with that, tell me about the, uh, the 8% productivity habit. 

[00:07:58] Aron: Yeah, I know cuz clearly I'm obsessed with it. But , uh, I'm excited to have somebody to talk to about it that isn't my wife. Well, she's excited that I have someone you know today to talk to about it. Um, yeah, I mean, so it was really just, This concept. So the 8% is simply that like 8% of a 24 hour day is two hours. And I was like, All right. If I could just build a productivity habit, that meant that I could get away basically with just doing hard tasks for two hours a day, and then the rest of the day I can kind of just slack off and like wing it. Um, like if I could build something that would be effective, man, that would just give me so much freedom. And, um, so I tried to build it, and then the first phase of it is abandon neurotypical productivity. So all of us have been raised on this like diet of motivation, willpower, and discipline. And like you, Whoever wins is the one who wants it the most. And that's fine if your motivation pathways and willpower pathways work, you know, neurotypically. But for us, or at least for the inattentive, ADHD symptoms that I tend to work with with my students, um, it doesn't translate to action. And so we're left with, we're left with this really unfair conundrum. We either don't take action. Or we have a secret sauce, which helps us take action, which is we just flood ourselves with adrenaline, stress and anxiety, and suddenly we can do a bunch of hard tasks. Right? But it's like so mentally and physically and emotionally training,

[00:09:33] Peter: I believe that. It's interesting because it puts us back into that premise of imposters, right? If we're trying to do things in sort of like that one way that's supposed to be done right? You know, like what you said about, about going out and, and, and you know, the person who wins, the person wants the most, there are other ways to win . 

[00:09:55] Aron: Amen. My brother. Thank you. 

[00:09:56] Peter: You know, I, I, I find that, Well, even this morning I was, I was in a boxing class and I was training. It was one trainer who was training two of us, and we'd each do drills, uh, alternate on drills. And I was watching him, you know, so like 30 seconds on, 30 seconds off. And on my 30 seconds off, I'm supposed to be shadow boxing. And of course I wound up watching this guy. This guy is about. 10 years more experienced boxing than I do. And his punches were so fast, like, so fast, and, and it was like a blur. And I'm just staring at him. And of course the trainer's like, Yo, you wanna actually do something or you wanna just watch? I'm like, Okay, yeah, sorry, but I need to figure out how he got that fast. And he goes, he's trained, He's constantly repeating the motion and doing it over and over again and building those muscles and growing and. You know, so I, I hear what you're saying. It's, it's in that, in that regard. I'm sure he does want it, but I'm sure he is also lost a ton of fights. He doesn't want it the most, he's just doing it every day because it's something that makes him happy and excites him, and he is also getting better at it by default.

[00:10:55] Aron: I love, I love that you said that because, um, so like, because I. And just, I'm, I'm just like on like, honestly, like, I'm literally like the most like unproductive person at my core. Um, and I just have like almost no motivational, willpower discipline. So the work around though is kind of, is what you were saying though, that I discovered. It was like, if I just build something in a habit, then it kind of happens without really any motivational will power discipline. Right. And so, It's been this like side door to like sneak into like productivity, uh, without kind of the traditional things is it sounds like you've got some, uh, interest in habits as well.

[00:11:42] Peter: Well, I've always found that, you know, I always, because for ADHD I would always gravitate back in school. I always gravitated toward the things I doing because I enjoyed doing them and I. Specifically, One time I got off, I, I was up, I would always ride my bike, and then one time, one year I get into skateboarding, right? And I, I would skateboard, skateboard, skateboard for like a year and a half, two years, everywhere. I went to skateboard. Skateboard. And then one day case got back on my bike. And I was shocked at how much stronger my legs were. It wasn't that I'd been working out my legs, it's that I'd been skateboarding, I was working out my legs, but it didn't occur to me as that, Right. The things that you love to do are the things you naturally get better at because you're doing 'em so much because you love them. The the downside for ADHD is sometimes you have to do things you don't love and you still have to do them. 

[00:12:27] Aron: Well, and so the, the upside, so I agree with you and the upside is, um, so look, I believe, and, and again, all with the caveat that a lot of the things I'm talking about are limited to people that have the inattentive symptoms or combined adhd, Right? Um, but. You know, the cool part is that I believe so many people, and this is entrepreneurs, this is working professionals I've talked to, like, we're looking for something that would have like the biggest bang for our buck. Um, kind of like on the entrepreneur where they're like, I don't want to just trade dollars for hours. Like, Right, or hours for dollars. Like, I want something that's scalable and like, I want, I want like leverage effectively is what? You know, working professionals and stuff are saying. And um, the cool part is that I found is. A lot of productivity stuff focuses on like overhauling your life, right? Like you're gonna write down all your to-do lists and write down goals in every area, and then you're gonna time box your schedule and you know you're gonna do all these things. You're gonna make this color coded thing. And the reality is that there's a lead domino in there, which is if you just push this one piece, all these other productivity things fit, which is the piece that you just mentioned, which is. We don't suck at all productivity. We're great at like fire alarm tasks.

Exactly. We're even decent at like busy tasks. And the reason we're decent at them is because the area that we suck and that if we improve is the lead domino that knocks all the other dominoes down is in doing tough tasks. And if we can get, build a habit of doing tough tasks every day, suddenly they don't feel tough and our comfort zone expands. 

[00:14:13] Peter: Yep, a hundred percent. Tell us how we could find you. 

[00:14:17] Aron: Well, you could just drive out to Michigan and look for a house. 

[00:14:22] Peter: Quit being a smart ass Aron, how can we find you? .  [14:13 - How can people find more about you? Web: hiddenADHD.com ALSO  freeadhdtraining.com

Socials: @aroncroft on Twitter  @HiddenADHD on Facebook  INSTA  YouTube and hidden_adhd on TikTok

]

[00:14:24] Aron: All right. Alright. Um, I would say, I would say just go to free adhd training.com. I literally was like, How could I come up with the easiest to remember URL in the history of URLs? Not that help a reporter out.com isn't also memorable . But anyway, free adhd training.com and uh, I go into like a full training. It's free on the 8% productivity habit, what it is, how you can do it, um, and really break it all down with like pretty graphics and all the, my pretty bald head and all these fun things.

[00:14:57] Peter: Always love having you, Aron bald head and all. It was a pleasure. Enjoy your home, enjoy your 10 acres and your, your chainsaw. We'll have you back again. 

[00:15:06] Aron: All right, brother. Appreciate it!

[00:15:07] Peter: Guys, as always, we wanna know what you're hearing and we wanna know what you're seeing. If you have a guest that you think might be great, shoot us a note. Peter@shankman.com. Let us know, Tweet us, post us, Facebook us, whatever. If you like what you heard, leave us review. Thanks to Steven Byrom @stevenbyrom our awesome producer. We'll back next week, another episode. Stay healthy, stay strait on keep going on the path that is yours, and yours alone, and we'll talk to you. Bye 

Credits: You've been listening to the Faster Than Normal podcast. We're available on iTunes, Stitcher and Google play and of course at www.FasterThanNormal.com I'm your host, Peter Shankman and you can find me at shankman.com and @petershankman on all of the socials. If you like what you've heard, why not head over to your favorite podcast platform of choice and leave us a review, come more people who leave positive reviews, the more the podcast has shown, and the more people we can help understand that ADHD is a gift, not a curse. Opening and closing themes were composed and produced by Steven Byrom who also produces this podcast, and the opening introduction was recorded by Bernie Wagenblast. Thank you so much for listening. We'll see you next week!

Oct 19, 2022

Hey guys! Peter Shankman the host of Faster Than Normal here. I wanna invite you to something! I am hosting a Mastermind with 12 amazing speakers who are gonna be talking about everything from ADHD to mental health, from entrepreneurship, to just living your life better. It's gonna be on November 10th, It's gonna be virtual from anywhere in the world. Incredible, incredible speakers. The leading fitness trainer in Canada for all things. Me! A whole bunch of speakers- Scott Carney, who wrote the book which is to all about how he goes and takes ice showers every day. It's gonna be 12 amazing speakers, the CBS Early Shows’ Jennifer Hartstein, really, really great people. And I'd like you to join us. Check out the link below in the show notes at ShankMinds 2022 and we will see you there. And a matter of fact, look for the discount code in the show notes as well, that'll take a hundred bucks off the cost. We'll see you soon! https://shankman.lpages.co/shankminds-virtual-2022/ DISCOUNT CODE: SMFriends22

Currently pursuing a Doctor of Pharmacy degree at Virginia Commonwealth University in Richmond, Camille completed dual Bachelor of Science degrees in Biochemistry and Systems Biology with honors at Virginia Tech in 2018. Breaking from tradition, Camille blew up the onstage talent competition with a highly engaging and entertaining version of the “catalytic decomposition of hydrogen peroxide,” winning Miss Virginia in June of 2019 and then Miss America in December 2019 live on NBC. While competing for the job, Camille Schrier wanted it known that “Miss America can be a scientist and a scientist can be Miss America.” Through her time as Miss America and beyond, Camille has focused on advocating for her social initiative “Mind Your Meds: Drug Safety and Abuse Prevention from Pediatrics to Geriatrics” with a major focus on the opioid epidemic, as well as for exciting youth in the areas of STEM. In 2021 Camille launched her own science educational brand, “Her Royal Scientist,” which furthers her goal to inspire and educate youth and normalize females in science roles. She also works to raise awareness around Ehlers Danlos Syndrome, a genetic condition that impacts her life each day. Today’s episode is important to literally anyone who has ever been given a prescription. Enjoy!

In this episode Peter and Camille discuss:  

01:26 - Thank you so much for listening and for subscribing!

02:14 - Intro and welcome Camille Schrier!

03:30 - Ref: Margaret Hamilton’s Apollo code

03:54 - Women in STEM [Science Technology Engineering Math/Medicine]

04:56 - On Imposter Syndrome and growing up in public education without many neurodiverse role models

05:47 - On a non “A+B+C= ‘this or that’” approach to goal-setting and systemic education

06:40 - There is no one ‘right way’ for everyone to do something. We are unique.

07:00 - How did you wind-up winning Miss America, was it a goal? A note on risk taking

09:17 - How did your initiative “Mind Your Meds” come about and get started?

11:00 - Eyes open about medication use in the collegiate community Ref:  Safe-RX

13:53 - So much about prescription drugs has become perception, not actual awareness of what they may, and may not do! 

15:40 - Adderall and co-morbidities

16:00 - Talk to your peers and kids, not everyone reacts the same!

18:00 - In the neurodiverse community we are even more at risk of addiction, if not misuse.

19:04 - How can people find more about you? Web: www.CamilleSchrier.com

Socials:  @CamilleSchrier everywhere.  Twitter  INSTA  FB  YouTube  LinkedIN

19:20 - Guys, as always thanks so much for subscribing! Do you have a cool friend with a great story? We’d love to hear. I'm www.petershankman.com and you can reach out anytime via email at peter@shankman.com or @petershankman on all of the socials. You can also find us at @FasterNormal on all of the socials. It really helps when you drop us a review on iTunes and of course, subscribe to the podcast if you haven’t already! As you know, the more reviews we get, the more people we can reach. Help us to show the world that ADHD is a gift, not a curse! 

19:40 - Faster Than Normal Podcast info & credits

TRANSCRIPT via Descript and then corrected.. somewhat: 

Hey guys. Peter Shankman the host of Faster Than Normal here. I wanna invite you to something! I am hosting a Mastermind with 12 amazing speakers who are gonna be talking about everything from ADHD to mental health, from entrepreneurship, to just living your life better. It's gonna be on November 10th, It's gonna be virtual from anywhere in the world. Incredible, incredible speakers. The leading fitness trainer in Canada for all things. Me! A whole bunch of speakers- Scott Carney, who wrote the book which is to all about how he goes and takes ice showers every day. It's gonna be 12 amazing speakers, the CBS Early Shows’ Jennifer Hartstein, really, really great people. And I'd like you to join us. Check out the link below in the show notes at ShankMinds 2022 and we will see you there. And a matter of fact, look for the discount code in the show notes as well, that'll take a hundred bucks off the cost. We'll see you soon! https://shankman.lpages.co/shankminds-virtual-2022/

[00:01:26] Peter: Hey guys. Peter Shankman here. Welcome to another episode of Faster Than Normal, it is a thrill to have you as always. It is another Monday when I do all my FTN interviews for the month. We are talking to Camille Schrier today, and I will tell you a little bit about her in a second. Uh, as you heard from the ad, there is a conference coming up on November 11th. I would love to see you there. Um, there should be a discount code in the uh, show notes, use it. You'll get a hundred bucks off and hear from 12 amazing speakers and me, so if you haven't had enough, there's even me. So that'll be fun. November 11th, virtually wherever you are in the world. All right, cool.  It is Monday. It is gray and yucky outside, but that's cool cause we're talking to a ray of, of sunshine and light today. Camille Schrier is currently pursuing a doctor of pharmacy degree at Virginia Commonwealth University in Richmond. She completed a dual Bachelor of Science degrees in Biochemistry and Systems biology with Honors of Virginia Tech in 2018. Oh, and she was Miss America in December, 2019. Uh, so yeah, there's that. She won Miss Virginia and June, 2019. Miss America, in December of 2019. You've probably seen her on YouTube where her, on stage talent competition was an entertaining version of the catalytic decomposition of hydrogen peroxide. Very, very cool stuff. I actually had seen that on YouTube before she came to my attention. Uh, it is wonderful to have you here, Camille. Thanks for so much for taking the time today. 

[00:02:52] Camille: Oh my gosh. Thank you so much for having me and making me sound way cooler than I really am in real life. 

[00:02:58] Peter: So, you know, you sort of broke the mold in that regard. You, you, you came up and, and you said, Okay, I'm gonna show the world that girls can be scientists, right? That, that women can do these things and it doesn't, You can mix and match. It doesn't have to be one or the other. I always look back at. Amazing photo from NASA where I was, when I was serving on the NASA Civilian Advisory Council. They sent me this, they showed me this photo. They have framed, it's the woman who wrote the majority of the code for, uh, the Apollo 11 landing. And, um, she's standing on a, uh, next to a stack of code that's literally like taller than her, right? And, and it was just, You know, you never Yeah. A woman did that. And, and I love as a, as a father of a nine year old daughter, I love that, you know, I'm talking to you and I'm gonna have my daughter, Jessa listen to this podcast because you're showing girls, um, my daughter's age and beyond that there is so much they can do. There's nothing they can't do, and, and you're doing it a lot better than me, as her dad ever could. . 

[00:03:54] Camille: Well, thank you. And I think even more than that, I mean, we know that women can be scientists. There's probably more women than ever Yeah. In STEM careers. But I think one of the things that I have realized as I've progressed through my own career is that it's not always normal to see a very feminine woman, exactly. In the sciences, and maybe women feel like they have to conform to kind of be like their male counterparts or maybe are afraid to express their femininity in a lot of those fields. And so bringing the science into something that is traditionally a feminine role like Miss America was a really interesting way to break that mold open even more, and show people that you can do whatever you want. And I think that's something that even defies gender is just embracing who you are and doing it on purpose and being fearless in every single thing that you do. And so hopefully it inspired, um, young girls, young men and beyond. 

[00:04:54] Peter: Well, it's interesting you bring that up because one of the things about ADHD is imposter syndrome and, and this concept that, You know, you are consistently broken and no matter what you've done, it's all been luck and you don't really have the skill to do anything. And I grew up with that, um, uh, through no fault of anyone but my own. I mean, you know, my parents were, were constantly supportive. But, you know, I grew up in an environment, in a school system, uh, public school system, which was, you know, you're different. And so you're being, you're being, uh, uh, uh, you're disobeying and, and you're, you're breaking the rules and you gotta be like everyone else. And it took me probably till. You know, late thirties, uh, to, to sort of get over that. And I think that, that, um, the more role models we have who can show that there is no one way to do anything right, I think is, is better for the world as a whole. And I see that, I see that, uh, you know, with, with what you've done. I see that more and more today, which gives me a little bit of hope. 

[00:05:47] Camille: I think we do need that because we're, we're taught to follow directions. Yeah. Right. And that's what we're seeing at, That's how we are shown success is, is you do these certain things and you get success. If you go through a certain amount of education, if you do these leadership activities and get extracurriculars and get a certain gpa, then you get X, Y, or z. And I think that often as young people working on this formula, that's not necessarily allowing us to embrace what makes us unique. Sometimes we can do that in that situation, but it's often really hard. And I've struggled because I want to do things the right way, but there is no right way to do things. I've always been really focused on doing things, um, at the most, at the highest level of achievement and success and getting to a certain level. Um, but I've forgotten a lot about what I want in that, and I think imposter syndrome is so real in what I have experienced. My becoming Miss America wasn't a longtime goal. I literally signed up for a competition that was two weeks away that went to Miss Virginia. And I was like, This will be fun. Let's do it. . And I won. And then eight weeks later I won Miss Virginia and six months later I won Miss America. And I was like, how did I end up here? Right? And did I deserve this? How? How did I. How did I successfully make my way through this in doing something that was totally different than anyone else had done before, but actually winning Miss America by doing something vastly different than anyone else had done was the best reward in taking a risk and doing something different than I had ever had in my life. Yeah, because I was always afraid to take a risk because what if it goes wrong? Right. But ultimately, if it went wrong, I would just come home as not Miss America. Exactly. So, The odds were pretty good to have a good experience, and it rewarded my creativity and my ability to try something new that then set me on a path to wanna do that more in my professional life.

[00:07:48] Peter: Well, that's one of the things that I try to explain to, uh, people, you know, especially the kids. And, and you know, when they, when they read my book and then, and they, they reach out is, you know, the concept that, that, that being the, the, the worst, the biggest risk it said is not taking one. Right. And, and the concept. you can do something and fail or you cannot do it, and you'll be in the same place if you failed. Yeah. So the only option you have that breaks you out of that is to try it, you know? And I, I love, I love that. Cause I think that that, you know, again, I didn't have that mentality. It was funny. I didn't have the mentality as a kid yet. I was always different. So it was like I was, I was fighting, I was swimming upstream, I was fighting against that. And once I embraced it, You know, the whole world opened up and so I sort of think you're doing that as well.

Um, so Miss America can be a scientist and a scientist can be Miss America. I love that. Tell me about, um, mind your meds. So, you know, when I was growing up and we talked about the offline, when I was growing up, the, uh, the concept of medication for ADHD or anything like that, really. Kids didn't really take meds. Um, they took medication if they were sick, I get, get penicillin, right? Whatever, you know, or Sudafed and I, but it wasn't, I, I grew up, I guess in an earlier time in the eighties we didn't have that. We had cigarettes and um, you know, I once I, and they were healthy back then, so it's fine. But, um, you know, I look at, I look at. Today I have, I have, I have friends who have kids in college and, and they're like, Yeah, the, the kids, the kids pass around, uh, Adderall, like it's candy. And, you know, that's not necessarily a good thing. Um, so talk about Mind Your Meds. Where did it come from, the concept? Uh, how, how'd you get to where it is? 

[00:09:16] Camille: Sure there's such a huge problem related to pharmaceuticals and medications in the country. And as a doctor of pharmacy student, I wanted to choose a cause that I would represent as Miss Virginia and Miss America that was something I was passionate about, but also something that I felt like would affect every person that I came across, that would be relevant to every individual in some way. And I feel. All of us have either taken a medication or have known someone who's taken a medication in their lives. We all have kind of lived that or taken even just a over the counter medication at some point. And when I went through my pharmacy education, I started to realize how easy it is to make mistakes, to take things improperly, the dangers of medications that are even over the counter. Let alone things that are prescription or controlled substances, the risks that can come along with those things, and how we can really do things that are very easy to prevent, um, harm and misuse and things that damage our communities essentially. So I wanted to focus on medication safety as one big piece of what I do. But then on the other side, there's also an issue with substance use disorders in this country. With stimulants, with opioids and many other substances, um, both prescription and illicit. And I saw more and more of that as time went on. Now I spend a lot of time talking about the opioid epidemic, which is one that has just drastically increased over the past 20 years for a lot of different reasons, but is really running rampant, uh, in our communities and is, is killing people at a level that I've, I never would've anticipated, but is really sad. So, Looking back at kind of all of the things that I have gotten to do. You mentioned stimulants and when I was growing up, I can't really even remember a lot of my peers taking stimulants for, for diagnoses like adhd. Now I went to school, like elementary school, middle school, in the early two thousands. So a little bit after, but still not that long ago I do feel like as time has gone on, it's become more popular. Right? Um, and. I will say when I got into college was the first time where I really saw medications being misused in my, with my own eyes. And it was always stimulant medications. And I think as someone who's looking at ways, uh, That people can be proactive with medication safety. I feel like if you have a prescription medication, especially controlled substance like a stimulant, you have to be a responsible steward of that sub of that substance. It is your responsibility to take control of that and prevent others from potentially being harmed by that. And so I've actually teamed up with a company called Safe- RX who produces locking pill viles. Mm. And that's just like an easy tool that I can recommend to families to kind of secure these medications, either at home or or students taking them to college. I talk a lot about children accidentally taking medications because they don't know what they are. They think that they're candy, making sure that you are locking up medications, keeping them up and away from children, being a safe steward of medications. These are all things that can not only keep people safe, but prevent misuse, prevent substance use disorders from coming up in our communities. It's all a cycle, and I think that it needs to be talked about more. It's not really an educational topic that I heard a lot about when I was in school and that I still don't really hear a lot about. And so I think, you know, as a pharmacy student, pharmacists have such a unique perspective and role in being a medication safety expert, and that's why I'm excited to be a pharmacist as well.

[00:13:06] Peter: That's a wonderful answer. I remember in the eighties, uh, you'd come home from school at like 3:00 PM and you'd watch like cartoons or whatever, and there was always a really, really bad. Like cringy commercial called pills aren't candy. And I don't know if you, I don't know if you had that in the 2000's by the way. I, I, I died a little bit when you said, you know, I, Yeah, I went to school in the two early two thousands. I just, I'm sorry. Died a little bit . Um, I had, I had someone I was watching, uh, TikTocs with my daughter and, uh, There was one where a woman goes, uh, you know, the, the older generation on TikTok, you know, the ones like born in the late nineties. I'm like, You, we, you're, 

[00:13:39] Camille: I've seen that it even made me cringe 

[00:13:41] Peter: everyone's app, right? Yeah. I'm deleting off everyone's phone right now, . But um, but yeah, no, I remember the we are not candy thing and, and it's, and it's true. I mean, as a, you know, I had the conversation with my daughter years ago, you know, this is anything in a bottle that looks like this or whatever. You don't, you don't take anything you don't know. You don't take anything. I haven't. Yeah. And, and, um, the interesting, interesting thing about the lock. You know, I wonder if it's, if it's also a peer pressure thing in the respect that, oh, you know, dude, can I, can I score that off you, can I tell, you know, score real, And it's a, kids that I've talked to don't necessarily look at it as medication. They look at it as a, as finals help. You know, there's a difference in, in, in how you look at it. 

[00:14:20] Camille: I think that you're absolutely right and that's how I saw it used in students that were trying to stay up all night Yes. And study, and that it was really a commodity instead of a prescription medication that genuinely helps people Yeah. That have disorders like ADHD and is extremely effective in that. Um, I do feel like what you're saying is very true and, and potentially even putting something in a container like a locking pill vile could mentally even make that seem like less of a commodity and something that should be protected. Um, and obviously I don't think there's studies along what that impact might be for students, but I think just looking anecdotally, that would be something that I'm sure that my peers probably would think differently about when I was in college. Uh, instead of just this, Oh, can I get one of these off of you? Which really surprised me, even though I'm a little bit straight edge to begin with. But seeing students talking about in group messages of like, Oh, does anyone have an Adderall? I have an exam tomorrow. Um, Really bothered me to my core because I just felt like it was so wrong. Um, and so risky from a medical perspective as well, because patients and students that have comorbidities who maybe they don't even know that they have yeah, an issue, maybe they have an undiagnosed cardiovascular problem that they don't know about, and taking a medication could, could really be detrimental for them. There's so many things that go into making sure that a medication is right for a patient. But if that, that's why these medications are prescription, because there's a prescriber that's evaluating all these different things. And I really wanna stress if there's parents listening, to have those candid conversations with your students about what the, what the ultimate risks of this medication could be for them and for other people around them and the importance of keeping that to yourself. And the also the importance of not taking anyone else's medications. Especially I have to, to emphasize in the time of fentanyl. Yeah. When we are not sure what is in any pill that we take, we aren't sure that a pill that someone gives us is actually from whatever they say that it's from. It could be a pill that was produced, uh, not in a pharmaceutical manufacturing facility that could be cut with fentanyl and could lead to an overdose. There are so many risks taking any type of medication or any substance from anyone I believe. Playing Russian roulette right now. And so that's a continued conversation outside of just protecting your own prescription, but emphasizing to everyone, students, children, adults, and beyond that we have a huge problem in this country with opioids and with fentanyl that is now coming into other pieces of, of the, um, kind of drug scene maybe in the stimulant sector with, um, methamphetamines and beyond, which is a deadly, a deadly consequence that could happen. And I, I hate to be dramatic and I know that sometimes I sound like a broken record in that, but it's a one decision that you could potentially make that you cannot correct. Right. And that is something that I really emphasize to everyone that I meet because it's, it really. It goes beyond just, Oh, I made a mistake and I'm gonna apologize. And it's unfortunate. So, uh, I do think that it's so important for us to not only be safe stewards, but have those conversations, have candid conversations with people, um, because these medications are also really difficult to get, specifically when we're talking about stimulants, right? And part of those reasons that they're difficult to get is because people misuse them. And so, uh, not contributing to that and making it more difficult for people that need those medications to access them, um, that's not gonna help us. 

[00:18:05] Peter: Well, what's interesting about that is, you know, especially, um, when you are neurodiverse, when you're a d d, when you're adhd, studies have shown you have much higher, uh, addiction prevalence, right? And, and so putting yourself deliberately, putting yourself into harm's way in that regard is something kids don't think about in their, you know, late teens, early twenties, and, You know, look down the road 10, 20, 30 years, where do you wanna be? So, there's no question about it. It's really, really cool. Camille, I, I gotta, we gotta cut it off for time, but I would love to have you back at some point. This is wonderful. 

[00:18:36] Camille: Oh my gosh. I would love to come back and talk about this. Thank you so much for having, uh, a great conversation about, uh, these issues. And they're so, they're so prevalent and I, it really upsets me that we, we see this growing rather than getting better. But I think having conversations like these are the way that we end.

[00:18:52] Peter: How can we, uh, how can people find you? 

[00:18:54] Camille: So you can find me on any social media platform at Camille Schrier my first and last name. Uh, you can also find mr at www.camilleschrier.com.  [ www.CamilleSchrier.com @CamilleSchrier everywhere: Twitter  INSTA  FB  YouTube  LinkedIN]

[00:19:04] Peter: Awesome. Camille Schrier, thank you so very much for taking the time.

[00:19:07] Camille: Thank you!

[00:19:08] Peter: Guys as always. We'll back next week with another amazing interview. Our thanks to our guest, Camille Schrier our thanks to Steven Byrom who produces this end every episode, and is just an awesome all around human being and I hope you have a wonderful week. We will see you guys soon. Take care.

Credits: You've been listening to the Faster Than Normal podcast. We're available on iTunes, Stitcher and Google play and of course at www.FasterThanNormal.com I'm your host, Peter Shankman and you can find me at shankman.com and @petershankman on all of the socials. If you like what you've heard, why not head over to your favorite podcast platform of choice and leave us a review, come more people who leave positive reviews, the more the podcast has shown, and the more people we can help understand that ADHD is a gift, not a curse. Opening and closing themes were composed and produced by Steven Byrom who also produces this podcast, and the opening introduction was recorded by Bernie Wagenblast. Thank you so much for listening. We'll see you next week!

Oct 12, 2022

Hey guys. Peter Shankman the host of Faster Than Normal here. I wanna invite you to something! I am hosting a Mastermind with 12 amazing speakers who are gonna be talking about everything from ADHD to mental health, from entrepreneurship, to just living your life better. It's gonna be on November 10th, It's gonna be virtual from anywhere in the world. Incredible, incredible speakers. The leading fitness trainer in Canada for all things. Me! A whole bunch of speakers- Scott Carney, who wrote the book which is to all about how he goes and takes ice showers every day. It's gonna be 12 amazing speakers, the CBS Early Shows’ Jennifer Hartstein, really, really great people. And I'd like you to join us. Check out the link below in the show notes at ShankMinds 2022 and we will see you there. And a matter of fact, look for the discount code in the show notes as well, that'll take a hundred bucks off the cost. We'll see you soon! https://shankman.lpages.co/shankminds-virtual-2022/DISCOUNT CODE: SMFriends22

Cool interview today with a content creator and health care provider who is recently diagnosed with ADHD, yet survived school without knowing what was going on with her brain! She turned to the internet to let people know that they are not alone, and to be helpful to others! A little more about our guest today in her own words:  Karrisa Cardenas is a mental health content creator, Singer songwriter, entrepreneur and the host of her very own podcast called “Finding Your Mind” and of course shares her life through the lens on her YouTube channel. She has faced many challenges in her life along side her ADHD such as depression, anxiety, daddy issues, abuse and so much more.  She has used all she has been through as inspiration to keep creating, creating for those who don't have anyone to go to and are facing these challenges alone. She shares her dark times to bring awareness. Letting those who listen know that its okay not to be okay and there is a light at the end of the tunnel, its just going to take a while to get there. Little back story on my life. I grew up very fast at a young age, had to take care of my mother most of my life and my father was never in the picture. Throughout my younger years I was faced with traumas that shape who i am today, which is why i create content around mental health and ADHD, i never had anyone to tell me what was going on with me so i had to figure it out all by myself. I didn’t have the luxury of doctors to help me. I was simply on my own with my mind. How scary, but also so freaking beautiful. Those were some tough years to go through but man on man am i such a wonderful human because of it. I have had my fair share of jobs such as coaching cheerleading, installing stoves and pools, Retail, Fast food, Waitressing, Barista, Nursing Assistant, Assistant manager of a non profit, and no i didn’t get fired from these jobs i quit because my ADHD was bored after learning everything in those positions. A few fun facts about our guest:  Never reads the last chapter in a book. Chocolate milk + popcorn always. Sits criss cross apple sauce in chairs. From a small town called Kelso. Left handed -which is a super power too. Enjoy! 

—— 

In this episode Peter and Karrisa discuss:  

01:26 - Thank you so much for listening and for subscribing!

01:45 - A note about the Boxing command: “duck!!”

02:22 - Intro and welcome Karrisa Cardenas!

04:51 - What made you want to share your stories with the public?

06:20 - On what happened after she first shared

07:00 - Haters gonna hate. How did you press forward?

08:52 - Karrisa, wise beyond her years and dealing with bad words people say

10:20 - On wishing healing

10:48 - How do you come up with your ideas for content?

11:53 - How often to you post? You grew up “social”, but how much of your life do you actually share. How do you set up boundaries?

14:00 - You’ve had all sorts of jobs. How do you make a living, or how did you starting out?

16:00 - On having a back-up plan/safety chute

16:46 - Are you a night owl and why do you have to chase popcorn with chocolate milk?

17:49 - We are kind of unique in that we both are doing this to help others. Where does this come from in you? Why do you do this?

20:04 - How can people find more about you? Web: LinkTree  Finding Your Mind Podcast

Socials:  @karrisamarieofficial on INSTA  Facebook and YouTube

20:27 - Guys, as always thanks so much for subscribing! Do you have a cool friend with a great story? We’d love to hear. I'm www.petershankman.com and you can reach out anytime via email at peter@shankman.com or @petershankman on all of the socials. You can also find us at @FasterNormal on all of the socials. It really helps when you drop us a review on iTunes and of course, subscribe to the podcast if you haven’t already! As you know, the more reviews we get, the more people we can reach. Help us to show the world that ADHD is a gift, not a curse! 

20:55 - Faster Than Normal Podcast info & credits 

TRANSCRIPT via Descript and then corrected.. somewhat: 

Hey guys. Peter Shankman the host of Faster Than Normal here. I wanna invite you to something! I am hosting a Mastermind with 12 amazing speakers who are gonna be talking about everything from ADHD to mental health, from entrepreneurship, to just living your life better. It's gonna be on November 10th, It's gonna be virtual from anywhere in the world. Incredible, incredible speakers. The leading fitness trainer in Canada for all things. Me! A whole bunch of speakers- Scott Carney, who wrote the book which is to all about how he goes and takes ice showers every day. It's gonna be 12 amazing speakers, the CBS Early Shows’ Jennifer Hartstein, really, really great people. And I'd like you to join us. Check out the link below in the show notes at ShankMinds 2022 and we will see you there. And a matter of fact, look for the discount code in the show notes as well, that'll take a hundred bucks off the cost. We'll see you soon! https://shankman.lpages.co/shankminds-virtual-2022/

Welcome to another episode of Faster Than Normal. My name is Peter Shankman. I am thrilled to be joining you today. I am a little more hyper than normal. I just took, literally just came back from a boxing class over at Victory Boxing, Victory Boxing on 37th Street off of 10th Avenue and holy. Um, it's normally, I, you know, you get one of the coaches one of the day. No, this was the owner who's a pit, or, Hey, let's, let's spar for a bit. Kicked my ass. Into next week. So I am high as a kite on dopamine an adrenaline right now, but oh my God, in three hours, I'm not going to be able to move. He's like, you know, it's funny when you're, when you're, when you're boxing and you're thinking about that next punch, whatever you all you hear are like the punch calls. And he's like, you know, he's like, um, jab cross, left hook, right hook upper cut, left upper cut right. And then he throws duck. And you're staying like an idiot who goes, Oh, is there a duck somewhere? And you could hit in the side of the head. So it has been, it was a fun hour, but oh my God, I'm gonna be hurting in a few. So anyway, with that said, thrilled that you're here and I want you to meet Karrisa Cardenas, so I might be on Instagram. As you know, as a matter of fact, both my mother and my daughter's mother, I'm pretty sure called Child Protective Services on me this morning because I videoed with a 360 Insta Cam I video. I put it on top of my helmet and videotaped or, or, or recorded, uh, the 2.7 mile scooter ride that I take every morning when I take my daughter to school and. You didn't realize how scary that ride is until you look at it on a 360 video and you're like, Wow, that truck nearly killed me. That other truck nearly killed me. Oh, that's 17 trucks. Oh, there's a school bus nearly, and a city bus nearly killed me. So, yeah, I'm pretty sure that that Child Protect service is gonna bust in any minute and, and take my daughter away from you. But either way, it was totally worth it and great video. So I'm on Instagram a lot. I love creating content, and of course I love absorbing content, and Instagram knows this and they treat me, uh, incredibly well because of it. In other words, they, they cater to my wants and my needs because it means I stay on longer like a good little boy, which is exactly what they need for their advertising. Well, that being said, I came across Carissa Cardenas. She's a mental health content creator. Okay? She's a singer songwriter, entrepreneur. Hosted a very own podcast called Finding Your Mind, and she shares her life through the lens, through the lens on her YouTube channel. She's faced a ton of challenges in her life. She has depression, anxiety, and this is her words, Daddy issues, abuse, and so much more. And she's used all of this as an inspiration to keep creating, to create for those who don't have anywhere to go and don't have anyone to talk to and are facing those challenges alone. I love this. She shares her dark times to bring awareness, letting those who listen know that it's okay not to be okay. And even though it might take a long time to get there, there is a light at the end of the tunnel, she tells me, I'll talk to you about her backstory. I'll ask her about it and I'll let her speak in a second but she, she has a really interesting backstory, um, that has shaped who she is. And, and I think it's wonderful. And she, she put fun, I love when people do this in her bio, she put a bunch of fun facts. So we're gonna read the, the last five minutes, we're gonna two minutes. We're gonna read those out and have her define those. Karrisa, welcome to Faster Than Normal!

[00:04:24] Karrisa: Hello.

[00:04:26] Peter: I am thrilled that you're here. I love the videos you create. They're so honest, they're so straightforward, and I, I first found you because I'm, I look another ADHD creator and I'm like, Goddammit, another ADHD creator who's getting like 20 times as many likes as me, and this is pissing me the hell off. So obviously we'll talk about how you're, you know, what your, what your system is because you're, you're creating incredible content. But what originally drew you to say, Hey, I'm gonna tell my story in public and, and, and love it or hate it here it is? 

[00:04:54] Karrisa: Uh, well, to be honest, uh, in 2015 is kind of where it all started and, uh, I started making video content on Facebook actually. And, uh, I started that because I was very alone growing up. And I faced all these traumas and these issues throughout my life that I just felt so alone and I didn't go to therapy and I didn't know what was wrong with me. Everyone told me that I like, had issues and I was so, you know, angry and all these things. So I just felt very alone and very scared. So I decided one day to pick up the camera and, well, it's actually my phone. It was my, I think it was with my flip phone to be honest, and I started recording on it. And I was like, You know what, I'm just gonna share like a diary. So I sat there and I shared all of my, uh, daddy issues and my anxiety and all that stuff in like different video forms. And this was when I was like, what, 18, 19. So I was like going through it and I, I recorded everything in my vehicle and and I sat there and I was like, you know, I'm gonna do this for other people because I never had help and I never, you know, got anyone. Relate to, and so I just decided one day I was like, I'm, I'm gonna do it. I'm gonna sit here and I'm gonna scarily share everything that I've been through, even though it might be tmi. I just need someone else to hear it. 

[00:06:18] Peter: And it sort of blew up from there. 

[00:06:20] Karrisa: Yeah, so it went from that and then of course, you know, doubts and insecurities got into into my bloodstream and it decided to, uh, make me not post for a while. And then I decided, okay, this is really what I wanna do with my life. So I decided to start a podcast instead cuz it was just so much easier than having to edit video and I always have to look nice on video, so I just decided to do it, podcast, and then it started to slowly take off and then it did randomly and I was like, Holy moly, this is it. Uh, I really gotta, I really gotta do this now. You know? So it was really awesome. 

[00:06:55] Peter: You know, it's interesting, let talk for a second about you stopped creating content when you started getting like, what haters and things like that.

[00:07:01] Karrisa: Yeah, I, I stopped as people would just tell they were ugly. They were so ugly.

[00:07:07] Peter: Now here's the thing, I mean, that's not, that's never changed. I mean, I, I posted that video this morning of the ride to school, and then I went and into my boxing class and I came out and they're like, About 20 comments and at least four of them were like, Oh, I'm never coming to New York. Fuck New York. There's a, you know, it's full of Democrats. Okay, well, you know, you're obviously meet people like that. And then you get the, Oh wow, you know, we gonna put your kid in the harm's way in the middle of the time, square traffic. I'm like, Okay, I'm much better scooter than you, whatever. But, you know, I, I feel, I feel like I'm 50, right? I, I've had 20 years of giving corporate keynote speeches in front of 20,000 people where I. I'm still kind of, I'm mostly over the haters, but you never truly get over them. You're a lot younger than me. Tell the audience what you did to get past it. Because that the haters and the, and the, and the, the, the, um, trolls, they kill about 95% of the, of the people who wanna create content and they just stop. And they don't wanna do that. And they, they, they leave a lot of stuff, beautiful stuff on the table, never wind up doing. 

[00:08:04] Karrisa: Well, uh, yeah. I also was doing YouTube too, so I got all those like, hate comments. You should die. You sh you're ugly. You know, all of those beautiful things at a young age. So, um, I just kind of sat with myself and I really focused on what I wanted to do as a person and who wanted to be, and I had to realize that no one else's fucking opinion, excuse my language really mattered. And I had really had. Hone into myself and really believe in myself and really just not care at all about what anyone else has to say and just hyper focus on that and not even, I didn't look for comments like probably the first two years I got back into it because I was like, I don't need their opinions, whether it be good or not. I never replied to anyone's comments. I just focused on what I wanted to do. 

[00:08:52] Peter: Let me ask you a question if you don't mind sharing how old are you?

[00:08:54] Karrisa: I'm 28. 

[00:08:56] Peter: That is, I gotta give you such props for that because I remember I started my first company at 27, 26. Mm-hmm. and I sold it, it was a PR firm. I sold it at 29 to a larger agency. And I remember even at 29 thinking like the news went out that it was sold and there were all, you know, Oh, he probably couldn't, he probably just sold it for like, for nothing cuz you know, he couldn't, couldn't keep it up. And his parents probably like, you know, gave him money to start it and it. I remember, I remember like it was yesterday, reading that comment and being like, Wow, I must be nothing. You know? And, and this took years. It took years. I probably, I'm 50 now. Maybe, maybe a couple years ago I really stopped caring as much as I can. But you're still gonna care a little bit. I mean, it's really, I give you a lot of credit for that. It's really impressive. At your age to be able to get past that.

[00:09:42] Karrisa: Yeah. It's, it's a difficult thing though. And I mean, there it is always gonna be here. Like, it's even gonna get worse the bigger you get. Like it's just the way the world works. Yeah. But since I kinda, I grew up in, in social media, to be honest, uh, I started just to see, you know, these empty comments I like to say, because, you know, those people are going through stuff on their own and they're just using, you know, their hate towards you for comfort in a way. And it's just, it's an ugly thing. But I've, I put my. I mean, I put myself in their shoes to make sure like, Hey, listen, you, you know, they're probably suffering from anxiety, traumas, like all of these things. And you know, they're just hating. They shouldn't, but they're just hating. Cause that's all they know.

[00:10:20] Peter: Right. Don't, don't wish anger on them. Wish, wish, wish, healing. 

[00:10:24] Karrisa: Yeah. That's, that's just what I do. 

[00:10:26] Peter: That's impressive. Again, that's really impressive. I still, I mean, I wish healing on them, but I still go to the boxing gym and beat the show to some bags every you, every day. Of course. Gotta do that. 

[00:10:33]Karrisa: Of course.

[00:10:34] Peter: So, let's talk about the kind of content you create when you, when you're posting mental health. I mean, there are a ton of mental health, you know, content creators out there and not, not the majority of them are not getting anywhere near as well as you. Um, So do you listen to your audience? Do you take advice from your audience? Do you, do you, do you listen to their feedback and incorporate that into future posts? How do you come up with your ideas? 

[00:10:54] Karissa: Uh, I honestly haven't done that. Like I get a lot of, uh, messages about saying, you know, like all the things that I've posted that have helped them or, you know, opened their eyes or something like that, which is so amazing. But I kind of just focus on what I feel at the time. So I'll be sitting, let's just say I'm at, sitting at my desk and I just have this urge to talk about a specific topic. I'll just do it. At random. Like, I haven't got to the point where I, like, I take feedback yet just because I want to, I want to stay with this momentum that I've got, and usually feedback with my ADHD and everything makes my brain go freaking nuts. Uhhuh. Like, I just, I can't focus. So then I'm like, Oh crap. Did I say the right thing? Did I do the right thing for these people? Or they, you know, So I just hyperfocus on like what I need to say first, and then of course I, I listen to you know, comments later down the road and kind of incorporated into the next content I do create. But I mean, just hyper focus on, you know, how I'm feeling that day, to be honest. 

[00:11:53] Peter: How often are you posting, uh, daily? So that brings up another interesting question. You, you said yourself, you're a child of social media. You grew up in this era. Um, you know, know, I, I thank God every day that camera phones and things of that nature didn't exist when I was in high school, I'd probably see somebody in jail and, you know, for you. You're, I guess it is perfectly normal that everything you do mm-hmm. is public. Yeah. Now, but here's a question. It looks like everything of what you do is public to what percent of things that you do are public? Like, you know, I'm sure you still have a private life that you don't necessarily share.

[00:12:27] Karrisa:Yeah. Uh, I would say I only share about 10%. 

[00:12:31] Peter: And how do you, do you set up boundaries for yourself so that you don't overshare or that you don't, You know, I, I remember probably 15 years ago writing a multi tweet Twitter rant, and this is before you could like, collect, connect, the tweets was much harder. And it was basically me bitching about something that I, I really didn't need to be bitching about, and I sent it and learned a valuable lesson that night. Right. You don't necessarily need to share every damn thing. Yeah. So how are you, how are you aware of that? What are you doing to make sure that you're, you know, okay, this is something that might be interesting, but I'm not gonna sit here and bitch for the next three hours about whatever.

[00:13:04] Karrisa: Uh, to be honest, I . I wish I had more of a filter. Uh, but I don't, And so the only thing that I really set boundaries towards is talking about politics, to be honest, because, you know, it's just one of those things that I just don't wanna get into on, you know, the internet because I would just get wrecked to be honest. So I just kinda set boundaries with that and I just, Almost everything. I am very open. I'm an open book, and if people hate it, they hate it because there's, there's people out there that are suffering through things that, you know, if they don't have the connection with other people that they can talk to. So it's like, I'm gonna share all the ugly parts and this is more so when I. Was younger. So I'm sharing all of those issues, the abuse and stuff so that it could connect to the right people so that they can live a another day, to be honest. But, um, other than that, the boundaries I set are just political .That's it. 

[00:14:02] Peter: Tell me about, so you've had several jobs. Yes. Right. And then I love this coaching, cheerleading, installing stoves and pools, retail, fast food, waitressing, barista, nursing assistant, assistant manager of a nonprofit. And no, and you make it clear, No, I didn't get fired from these jobs. I quit them all because my ADHD was bored after learning everything in those positions. So, yeah. And I get that. I had one job in my life and I'm like, No. But, um, you know, after, after the sort of magic wears off, right? At some point you gotta make a living. Yep. So what then? 

[00:14:33] Karrisa: Uh, well, I, I guess I don't really share this, but I will. Um, so I do a lot of content creation, and I do get paid from all of that stuff, but, uh, I, I do have a core job, which is taking care of my mom, so I. Right now I take care of my mom and so I'm a certified nursing assistant. Okay. And that has been the, you know, the bill paying money, the I'm gonna be okay and I can step back and work on all of these things and Gotcha. You know, it, it's, it's a blessing to be honest, cuz not everyone gets to do this. Oh, totally. Or does a lot of people have to take care of their mom at a young age. So, I mean, like, that's kind of, you know, where, where I'm at, like, I don't work, other jobs anymore. I just create and it's so beautiful and I'm so blessed about it.

[00:15:19] Peter: You know, it's interesting. I, um, I, I, I look at my, I I look at a lot of kids who are, who are, you know, influencers, whatever, whatever they wanna call themselves. I hate that term. And, um, you know, they're, they're, they're creating all this kind of thousands and tens and thousand likes and thousand likes. And occasionally they, they, they do a partnership with someone or whatever. And I know the, I know the industry. I know damn well. Yes. They're not making enough for a Starbucks once a day. No. Right. With that. And yet you'll never see that, You know, you'll never, you'll never, uh, hear about the fact that, you know, they're, they're also working, uh, you know, 8:00 PM to 4:00 AM as a security guard or doing whatever just to pay the rent. Yep. Right. It's like the, um, Uh, the real versus Instagram, whether, you know, the, the, the Instagram is like everything is beautiful and then the camera pans over to the other side of the room where it's just like a mess. Yep. Right? And so it, it's interesting because you have a lot of people who are out there trying to create content and I would never tell anyone not to do it and give it a shot, kick ass on it. But I would say have a backup plan. Yeah, I, And it seems, it seems like you managed to pull that off. You do have a backup plan.

[00:16:17] Karrisa: Yes, I always do. I think it's just a security thing for me because, uh, growing up I didn't come from money, so having a backup plan has always been a thing. Like, I've been to college twice. I've been, you know, just thinking, Okay, what am I gonna do if this doesn't pan out? What if I'm, you know, like, but I have to also believe in it a hundred percent, or I'm not gonna give it my all. And I. So it's kind of like that fine line where you're like, Yes, I need to pay my bills, so I will work a nine to five, but I need to bust my ass doing the rest of this. 

[00:16:46] Peter: Right. Are you a, um, are you a night owl? Yes. . I noticed that I, I saw the email came in around 2:00 AM so I figured, um, 

[00:16:58] Karrisa: Yeah, Sorry about that, heh.

[00:16:58] Peter: Why do you have to eat? And this, this goes to the, your last paragraph. Why do you have to have chocolate milk when you eat popcorn? That's a weird combination? 

[00:17:04] Karrisa: Oh, . Well, okay, see, Um, I don't know where it came from. I've always been a, a child of weird combinations and, uh, I just, I can't have popcorn without it because I don't know. I need to wash it down with something sweet and chocolate like so amazing. And when you pair the two, it it hands down the best. No one would try it. No one ever tried it. They're like, 

[00:17:26] Peter: I'm gonna try. I'm totally gonna try it tonight actually. I have some of my kids chalk the milk. I'm totally gonna try it.

[00:17:30] Karrisa: There you go. I love that. Lemme know. 

[00:17:32] Peter: And by the way, you're lefthanded as am I, as our most amazing people, so 

[00:17:36] Karrisa: for real ?That's awesome actually.

[00:17:38] Peter: I love that. I love it. Always drives my boxing coach crazy cuz he always says he, he takes his original position and I go left. God damn it. He has to switch around. Yep. So, so I guess I'll, I'll, I'll close it with this. I wanna be respectful of your time when you, you know, you're creating content and putting stuff out there in a world, especially in social, that isn't always that nice if ever, Right? Mm-hmm. and looking at the stuff that you're talking about, which is mental health, you know, from the beginning, um, tells people that yeah, you've had your share of hits in, in your life. You've taken some hits, you've had some issues, you've had some problems. Yet your goal in all of this, it's still to help people who, who are never able to get help for this on their own. Yeah. And that's really kinda altruistic. Right. Most people are kind of like, No, fuck you, man. I'm gonna get mine. And, and, and you know, I'm gonna get it. I mean, we live in a world right now where, where 15 governors are trying to stop, um, uh, student loan debt cancellation because everyone should pay their own share. I'm like, Well, that's a dick move, right? Yeah. So, so you're sitting here going, No, I wanna help people out. And that's the exact same reason I, I wrote Faster Than Normal and do this podcast, but there aren't a lot of us. So at the end of the day, Your value system is, is pretty unique, right? You're sitting there going, No, I wanna help people. And and does that come from anyone? Did that come from what, what, You know, based on, on the history that you told me about yourself that you shared, um, it doesn't sound like you were helped a lot. So where'd that come from? 

[00:19:05] Karrisa: Uh, that's exactly why is because I wasn't helped a lot. I wasn't guided and I wasn't told that what I was going through was normal or you know, cuz my ADHD was, I, I did, I just got diagnosed with it in 2020. So like I didn't have help realizing that, oh my God. Like I went through school and stuff thinking I was so stupid because I learned a different way than other people, but I never knew that, so no one told me. And like I just had to go through the motions of doing things alone. So when I got a little older to understand what I was actually facing. And I started doing research on my own. I was like, there are so many other Me's out there that need help that don't have the finances for it. And I was like, maybe I can just share some of my stories and it could help. And it's just helped me too because it helps me get out of my head and it creates this community of amazing people that need help. And I'm just here and I'm just like, wanna give everybody a hug? And I just want people to be better mentally and understand that it's okay not to be okay. 

[00:20:04] Peter: Yeah. I love that. I love that. Very, very cool. Very, very cool. How can people to find you?

[00:20:10] Karrisa: Uh, they can find me on Instagram at Karissa Marie Official. You can find me also on YouTube as Karissa Marie and also my podcast, Finding Your Mind. 

[00:20:21] Peter: Very cool. Leave all those in the show notes. Thank you so much for taking the time. I really appreciate it today.

[00:20:25] Karissa: Thank you so much for having me. You're awesome dude. 

[00:20:28] Peter: Guys, Faster Than Normal wants to hear what you think. Let us leave us a note, shoot me an email. We've gotten a lot of guests because you guys have written in and said, Hey, talk to this person. So if you have any people, we should talk to peter@shakman.com. You know how to find me. We will see you next week. ADHD as Karissa has blatantly showed us today, is a gift, not a curse. And I will say that until the day I die. Stay tuned, keep in touch. We'll see you guys next week. Stay safe.

Credits: You've been listening to the Faster Than Normal podcast. We're available on iTunes, Stitcher and Google play and of course at www.FasterThanNormal.com I'm your host, Peter Shankman and you can find me at shankman.com and @petershankman on all of the socials. If you like what you've heard, why not head over to your favorite podcast platform of choice and leave us a review, come more people who leave positive reviews, the more the podcast has shown, and the more people we can help understand that ADHD is a gift, not a curse. Opening and closing themes were composed and produced by Steven Byrom who also produces this podcast, and the opening introduction was recorded by Bernie Wagenblast. Thank you so much for listening. We'll see you next week!

Oct 5, 2022

Hey guys. Peter Shankman the host of Faster Than Normal here. I wanna invite you to something! I am hosting a Mastermind with 12 amazing speakers who are gonna be talking about everything from ADHD to mental health, from entrepreneurship, to just living your life better. It's gonna be on November 10th, It's gonna be virtual from anywhere in the world. Incredible, incredible speakers. The leading fitness trainer in Canada for all things. Me! A whole bunch of speakers- Scott Carney, who wrote the book which is to all about how he goes and takes ice showers every day. It's gonna be 12 amazing speakers, the CBS Early Shows’ Jennifer Hartstein, really, really great people. And I'd like you to join us. Check out the link below in the show notes at ShankMinds 2022 and we will see you there. And a matter of fact, look for the discount code in the show notes as well, that'll take a hundred bucks off the cost. We'll see you soon! https://shankman.lpages.co/shankminds-virtual-2022/  DISCOUNT CODE:  SMFriends22

--

Southern California-born and bred Maitland Ward has quickly become one of the biggest stars in adult entertainment, after an-already successful career as an American model, actress and cosplay personality. After finding fame in the ‘90s on CBS soap The Bold and the Beautiful and smash ABC sitcom Boy Meets World, as well as a plum role in 2004’s cult classic White Chicks, Ward decided to shake things up with racy social media content, sexy cosplay and appearing at fan conventions before making the leap into the adult film industry in 2019. The statuesque (5’10”) all-natural redhead is unique in that not only is she beautiful and built for the adult biz, Ward’s talent as an actress means she can also carry dramatic and comedic scenes with ease. Her playful energy, professionalism and open sexuality earned her an exclusive performance contract with Vixen Media Group and the famous face of the brand’s blockbuster studio, Deeper.

In 2020, Ward won three AVN Awards for Best Supporting Actress, Best Three-Way Sex Scene-G/G/B for her work in Deeper feature Drive and Favorite Camming Cosplayer. She also won three XBIZ Awards for Crossover Star of the Year, Best Actress-Feature Movie and Best Sex Scene-Feature Movie, also for Drive.  In 2021 she scored two AVN Awards as well: Best Leading Actress for Deeper’s Muse, as well as Best Boy/Girl Sex Scene for Higher Power, plus two XBIZ Awards for Best Acting-Lead and Best Sex Scene-Feature for Muse, and in 2022 she took home two XBIZ trophies for Best Acting-Lead for Muse 2 and Performer of the Year.

 Ward’s recent mainstream endeavors include starring and co-producing a TV series, The Big Time, taking on a lead role in psychological thriller Just for You and releasing an eye-popping no-holds-barred memoir about her wild life in the entertainment biz, Rated X: How Porn Liberated Me from Hollywood

 

—— 

 

In this episode Peter and Maitland discuss:  

 

00:40 - Thank you so much for listening and for subscribing!

01:00 - Intro and welcome Maitland Ward!  IMDB bio

01:38 - So you’re here in NYC promoting Rated X; let’s talk about that!

02:00 - Despite all of your success at such a young age, you were not happy. Why?

04:00 - A lot of positive things have happened in the culture of Hollywood and beyond

04:45 - On hiding who you are, and why. A note on fear.

05:25 - When did you first realize, then decide you needed a change?

06:15 - About getting married an moving to NYC

06:50 - On figuring out that you’re different

07:18 - Peter on how he explained to his father how he was quitting his day job

08:08 - When did you decide to make the switch from ‘mainstream to ‘adult’ film? How did your peers react?

09:15 - About double standards

09:45 - Peter on breaking stereotypes for New Frontier Media at The Wall Street Journal

10:55 - How did it go when you started dipping your feet more into rated R, rated X Art?

12:28 - On building a fanbase in real time

14:00 - About her first full length feature and how that evolved 

15:00 - How do you deal with the haters, how do you not focus on the bad reviews, trolls, etc?

15:55 - A tip about fan mail of any sort

16:55 - What’s next for you?

17:35 - My how things have changed in twenty years, or even thirty!

18:52 - What do you do to get out of your head, to clear and re-center?

19:54 - Do you have any rituals or habits that must happen every day or else?

20:21 - How can people find more about you? Web: https://onlyfans.com/maitlandward

Socials:  @MaitlandWard on Twitter  INSTA  FB  and @Maitlandtoks on TikTok

Shout out to Brian at BSG Public Relations! @bsgpr on Twitter

20:57 - Guys, as always thanks so much for subscribing! Do you have a cool friend with a great story? We’d love to hear. I'm www.petershankman.com and you can reach out anytime via email at peter@shankman.com or @petershankman on all of the socials. You can also find us at @FasterNormal on all of the socials. It really helps when you drop us a review on iTunes and of course, subscribe to the podcast if you haven’t already! As you know, the more reviews we get, the more people we can reach. Help us to show the world that ADHD is a gift, not a curse! 

21:21 - Faster Than Normal Podcast info & credits 

TRANSCRIPT via Descript and then corrected.. somewhat: 

[00:00:41] Peter: So Maitland, thank you for taking the time. I know you're on a busy schedule with your book tour in New York here.

[00:00:46] Maitland: Yes. Thank you so much for having me.

[00:00:47] Peter: How is New York, uh, treating you so far? 

[00:00:49] Maitland: It's, it's been great. It's been a whirlwind, like, meeting with everybody and like, you know, just doing all of the, the. publicity, I guess you would say. It's, it's kind of like a machine. So I, I'm really having good time, but it's been very busy.
I hope to have a little more like downtime to, to little freedom to go explore. More freedom.

[00:01:03] Peter: Yeah. We're, we're a good city. We're coming back. You know, Covid was a bit here, but I did not, I could have least how many people are here now. 

[00:01:11] Maitland: Yeah. It's definitely came back. Cause I had come, uh, to film something like a, I guess it was a little over a year ago, and, It was pretty bad. Yeah. Things were shut down. 

[00:01:20] Peter: Still in, I'm at the point my daughter's, my daughter's class, like half the kids and their parents like went to their second and third homes and all that. Right now they're all back. I'm like, I'm like you. I kind of feel like you should pay an extra 50% tax on everything because you went down, left your most right.
You left us right. But yeah, we're coming back. It's nice to see the city getting, getting back into form. We're, we're a good place. Um, so you're, you're here promoting burning rated X. Yes. Let's, so let's talk about that. So you have. The majority of people in Delta Entertainment, you have backstory, you have a history.
You came, um, in mainstream media, right? Yes. You started Boy Me World. Yes. And, and of course White. It's one of my favorites because my friend Marlon's in it. That's so cool. And, and you know, you, but you weren't happy. 

[00:01:59] Maitland: Yeah, it was an interesting thing because I started acting very young, uh, like 16 years old. I was on a soap opera and, uh, it was, it was a whirlwind experience at the time, but I really felt like I had to be a certain way all the time in Hollywood. Like I had to be a good girl. I had to, you know, be straighten narrow, like really, you know, be nice. That was a big thing. Be nice, and it, I think that was a dangerous thing for a Woman to be taught, like make them like you be nice. So, um, so I was, but I felt like I was always denying certain parts of myself to. You know, accommodate other people and, and Hollywood, you know, I got very lucky early on that I got a lot of jobs and, and high profile jobs. Uh, especially like when I got Boy Meets World and I was, I really wanted to like please everybody at Disney and the producers and everything. And I, um, but it was weird because on the show I was this sort of, not a sex object, but she was very, The U undertones were sexual, I guess. Right. And she was always the one dancing around in lingerie.  

[00:03:08] Peter: And like you spoke about that, teasing the boys,you mentioned that in the, both the concept and your articles, the concept that, you know, Yeah. Here's Disney. Right. You know, pure, pure bread, Disney. Yeah. Um, the, the, the likes of which we all all know who comes from Disney. Everyone. Everyone. Wonderful and happy. And then, Yet they were putting you in situations that today, I think if we looked at them under the eye of 2022, right. We 

[00:03:24] Maitland: question. Oh, absolutely. Like, like I say in the book, how I had to go up to the producer's office to try on lingerie for my lingerie scenes. So, and like not just once. I mean, there was 20 people in there, whatever, a big group. Mostly men. Uh, pretty much all men except for maybe one or, um, and then I would have to try on all of it and like, and I thought that this was my job to do this, and I never, at the time, I didn't even 0cConceptualize that it was a weird thing or it was ski or it was anything wrong with it. But then today you look at that, if that happened today and it went on the internet or anything, people would be fired for it Yeah. 

[00:04:00] Peter: . Yeah. And I think that, you know, in a lot of ways, everyone, everyone complains about cancel culture and complains that, that were too high strung.
But a lot of things, positive changes have, have resulted from not only people like you speaking out, but you know, all the way back to the Weinstein and, and things like that. Yeah. But at, at the time that you were doing it again, you were under. Let's just be a good girl. Let's just do the nice thing. Yeah. I didn't wanna, like, was it, was there a fear there that if you, if you acted the way you wanted to or if you acted the way you were, the way you thought you were supposed to, you'd be gone? 

[00:04:29] Maitland: Yes, definitely. Oh yeah, always. I had very much anxiety about that kind of stuff, like very much anxiety that I wouldn't do the right thing, I wouldn't be the right way, or I wasn't good enough for the situation and I.  You know imposter syndrome. Yeah. May, Yeah, maybe. Yeah. . Yeah, I guess. But it was like, yeah, cuz I had to like kind of be this persona that I can't see all the time. I was not who I was like there, but in certain parts of myself, especially my sexuality and everything. And I had to hide like, Things that, you know, how I wanted to be exact cause I thought it was wrong or bad, or, you know, weird or, or they would judge me and come down on me.

[00:05:07] Peter: Fear is a great motivator. Not necessarily in a good way, but fear is a, you know, I don't wanna lose my job, I'm gonna conform despite what it's doing to your mental health. Yeah. Right, right. So as you moved on and as you had different roles and, and at, at some. Was there a, I guess was there a moment where you just said, F this? 

[00:05:28] Maitland: I mean, was it, was it, did it come all at once or how did it, And it's  interesting. Back at the time, I didn't think that it was having an effect on me in my mental health. Like I didn't conceptualize that. I thought it was just like there's something wrong with me that I. Wasn't doing things the right way, but, and looking back, writing the book, I really saw that in certain situations. Yeah. Um, so yeah, it was a long time, a long journey like finding myself, and it's interesting because of all, you know, pitfalls and disappointments that I had after I had a lot of success, like after white chicks and all that, when I was really typecast and things dried up and Hollywood would, they still wanted to keep me in the box that they had put me as a, like this good girl character, this, but they didn't wanna cast me cuz I was already a typecast character. Right. So, but they still wanted me there for like, whenever they needed a certain purpose for me, like a little episodic work or something like that. Um, so that became frustrating. So then I, I actually, that's when I moved to New York for a while. I got married and moved to New York. Okay. And it was kind of like a, it was a breath of fresh air to kind of get away from the Hollywood machine. I've heard that. Yeah. Because it was like, cuz when you're there you're just so caught up. Like, Oh, what, Who's going to this party? Right? What's this audition? Did you get that one? Like, did you book this one? And, uh, so, so getting away, I really like started to really discover myself and I started writing a lot and erotic writing. And I started really discovering my sexuality and stuff of, I guess not discovering it all the way Admitting it Okay. Is more of a thing because I think I knew all along that I, I, I just thought I was different and I thought I, like I say, I, I was a bad girl maybe inside , but, but I realized, you know, I'm not bad. It's kind of funny. My husband helped me realize that really. and he was very encouraging of me to explore this path that I really wanted to explore. 

[00:07:17] Peter: I imagine so. I mean, I remember, and I, I guess I can't really equate much to it, but I've always imagined the, the day that I told my parents, I, I, I had one job in my life. I worked for, for America Online back in the nineties when, when a was the internet, right? Yeah. And I came back to New York and realized, They let us work anyway we wanted, which is why I did so well. My ADHD flourished cuz I was able to do, Oh, you wanna work at two in the morning? Great. As long as you get it done.
Yeah. Yeah. Then I come back to New York and start working for a magazine and, and we have 8:00 AM meetings and 9:30 AM meetings and 10:00 AM editorial boards. And I'm like, What? This is Russia? And it, I, I quit within two. Yeah. And I remember telling my Dad, um, I'm gonna start my own PR firm and if it fails, and I actually said when it fails, when it fails, oh I'll get another. Cause I was so, who the hell am I to do anything, you know, entrepreneurial. And that was like 24 years ago. And I remember that was the scariest conversation I ever had have because I said, You know, I might need you to help pay my rent for a month or I might need what I didn't thank God, but you know, I got lucky and, and things were in. But tell us about the mindset when you decided you're gonna make this switch. You're gonna go from mainstream to adult, which to be, let's be fair, adult is kind of at this point, 2022, putting mainstream. Anyway,

[00:08:20] Maitland: that's why it's so weird to say both things and I know we have to differentiate kind of, but, But it is weird that we have to differentiate.
  

[00:08:25] Peter: Right? So tell me about, Because you, you wrote a really interesting piece that I really enjoyed about your interaction with Elizabeth Berkeley. Oh, yes, I was Right. So tell us about that.

[00:08:33] Maitland:  First, It was a very quick interaction. Yeah, but it was an interesting one. I, it was right after like the news broke that I was, Doing this big porn film and stuff. And I was in the industry and everything and I was, you know, walking out of the Whole Foods. And I saw her off to the side and she looks at me like, you know, our white eyes and they got wider. And I was like, and she had, I, I don't know, I think it was her husband at the time. I don't know if there's still, I don't know the situation.
It was a man with her. Right. Um, and she, she just looks at and she turns to him and like whispers something like this and he looks, and it was such a weird like, situation to have them be like, Look at me like some sort of a, you know, beast down in the wild.

[00:09:11] Peter: I'm sorry. And let's just, let's just be clear, this is Nomi Malone looking at you , right? This is the girl who, who went from Saved by the Bell, then Showgirls. So I'm, I'm not sure what she's actually looking at, where she comes off looking at you, everybody. So that really kinda pissed me off when I read that. The hell is she looking at you?

[00:09:25] Maitland:  But it's a weird thing because once you go- when it's deemed adult, Right. It's different, right? Like in Hollywood films like now on like streaming shows and stuff, they go so close to it, of course.  

[00:09:39] Peter: But, but they didn't go all the way. In 2003, um, I, I represented a company called New Frontier Media and, uh, New out of Denver, Ca, Boulder, Colorado, and New Frontier was the, this back in for porn was free, right?
Yeah. Right. And, and, and they were the largest distributor of adult paperview on cable. Mm-hmm. . And I would go, I had my, I worked for them for four years and I took their stock price from like 99 to $10 because I forced my way into the Wall Street Journal and Forbes and Fortune. Mm-hmm. explaining, you know, I have a company who I'm repping, who is kicking the ass, their biggest competitor with Playboy.
Yeah. By a factor of 10 x. Like, Oh, we great. They're adult. Oh, we can't touch that. I'm like, Why the hell not, not? It's so explaining when, and I got through and, and I remember getting New Frontier Media on the cover of Forbes was like, like the highlight. If that's my epi half right now. Yeah. The first porn company on Forbes. But, you know, but it was, it was the concept of, look, you, you, you're, it's one of those things that you're. Um, secretly. Yeah. Right. You're not gonna admit to it, but meanwhile, look at how much money is being driven. Yes. You know, let's, let's, let's look at something like Euphoria. Um, great show, but not really about the acting per se. Yeah. You know, there's, there's things we're looking at on that show that we know exactly what we're looking. Go onto Reddit. You're not gonna find, uh, uh, um, uh, reviews of the acting. You're gonna find one thing on your, you know, about your for. And so, so that being said though, it's a lot easier to say that then is to sort of tell us about, like, tell us about the day or whatever.

[00:10:56] Maitland: It was, the moment where, All right, I'm doing this and, and  here we go. You know what, it wasn't like one certain moment. I mean it uh, it was cuz I started like exploring stuff on my social media sexy pictures and stuff. And this was along the time, by the time Girl Meet's World has spin enough appointments coming around, right? So there was a lot of attention and social media was really starting to really boom, like Instagram, especially in like Snapchat. And uh, so I started getting followers for like doing my sexy cosplay that I loved doing and doing bikini shots and all that stuff. Uh, but then I'd eventually. They started like taking down photos.
Right. Actually, cuz a lot of people would complain for no reason to like these like fundamentalist types that watch, of course that are obsessed with like boy meets world being wholesome and wholesome and good and stuff. And uh, actually a lot of porn girls though suffer from people just,

[00:11:46] Peter: Oh, of course for that question.

[00:11:49] Maitland: Just taking their, I mean, look at the Visa MasterCard scenario. They had match  ridiculous. Um, so I kind of, my, my fans were like, Well, why don't you just sell content? And I didn't know what content was really at the time. I mean, I kind of heard of it, so I, but I said, Well, maybe, And I said, I'll start, I'll start a Patreon account, right? It's, you know, they patrons of your art. And I was gonna do like Playboy-esque type photos. I, I started the page and I, I didn't even like, Um, announced it. I just like did it one night and I said, ah, close it. Then the next morning there was like 20 people in there and then so I announced it and by the end of the week there was like 2,800 people. I was like, What? They're gonna buy my nudes, a create content. 

[00:12:23] Peter: Holy shit!

[00:12:24] Maitland: I know. And it was just like, then it kind of evolved from there. Cause I, I had been exploring like my sexuality and my writing and everything like that, so I was like, Oh, maybe I'll do. Girl, girl stuff then, and let's do this. And my fans responded and it was kinda like they were watch, they really were watching my journey along the way. Yeah. Like in real time. Um, and so then I, then I was like, What? You know, my husband and I had a big moment about when we said we're gonna have me do something with guys. So I, but I was so lucky. I found two guys in the porn industry who've been there so long, they were so professional. And they really like taught me along the way, like how would to do, this was a year and like almost a year and a half period before I got like a call from Vixon to do. Right. The black scene that went crazy viral. I might, might have been of, been , but it, but then I didn't even announce that to the press. It was all kind of just a internet moment. 

[00:13:21] Peter: Oh, well by that moment you'd built, you'd built the audience. 

[00:13:22] Maitland: Yes, but when I did. That's why everybody thinks I made this announcement. I just was saying I'm going to porn right now when I did the film drive for deeper.com. Mm-hmm. , which is Vic, one of Vic's brands. Um, but it was because I, the black team just blew up that, on that same day, Caden Cross, who, who is amazing performer and director in, in her own right, but she had started the brand deeper, right?
Not very long before she had just, they just acquired the brand like four months or launched four months before, but she was doing her first feature. For it and, um, she lost her co-star on. The day my black scene came out. Oh wow. So, but she thought she'd have to quit the movie cuz you know, there's not a lot of people who can handle a lot of dialogue fast. And so, um, she went to Vixen and said, I think we're done with, we're not able to do it this year. And then they said, talk to Maitland. She just blew up and she can act. And then, so that really was, we did that and I decided, you know what, I'm really proud of this. I'm proud of the trailer, I'm proud of the whole thing of the feature, cuz full length features complete, you know, dialogue story. It was, um, so I did announce it to the press. That's went insane. And that's when everybody thought, Oh, she just made the switch all of of a sudden. It's always a backstory. Yeah. It's kind of like when people say, Oh my God, like they have a starring rule in something suddenly and they're like, You just showed up my imdb, but it's 

[00:14:44] Peter: 30 years.

[00:14:45] Maitland: I know I've been here forever. 

[00:14:47] Peter: The everyone's like, You last company, you started this, sold it three years. It was 17 years of crap. 

[00:14:51] Maitland: Yeah, no, that's what I mean. 

[00:14:53] Peter: There's so much prep involved and so much time. Let me ask you this. One of the things that we touched on, and this is what I think my listeners can really relate to mm-hmm. um, being as out there as you. Right. Whether, whether it's it's on, uh, in Hollywood or, or in adult, there is a, how do you edit that out? How do you deal with the haters? How do you deal with the bad reviews? A lot of, when you're ADHD or ADHD or any sort of neurodiverse, yeah, be imposter syndrome is huge, but also, The premise that, I mean, I'll give a keynote to 10,000 people. Mm-hmm. , right? 9,999 of them will love it. There's one guy who didn't stand up for the standing ovation. That's all that I'm gonna think about for the next two weeks. 

[00:15:27] Maitland:  I know. You know, what do you do? I used to be a lot more like that. Um, like I would get very, like, especially when I started doing sexier photos, like on Instagram stuff, I'd get those, like fundamentalist haters and stuff. I got very perked by it. I guess , that's the word. Um, but now I kind of. I don't embrace it. There's always like one or two trolls that just wants to attack you. Right? But I was actually told something early on when I was on the soap opera that the fan mail that we get, and I remembered this, like I really came to play with the trolls. No matter if it's good or bad, you're making an impact. If they didn't care, they wouldn't even be there. So it's, if you're not getting any attention or any feedback from people, that's cuz think about to be a troll, you have to be pretty investing. 

[00:16:14] Peter: Exactly. 

[00:16:15] Maitland: You watch people getting fired up about something, you're, you're making this connection.

[00:16:18] Peter: Sounds like all the people who, who, when Nike came out to support Gay Rights, uh, everyone burned their Nike clothing. Okay. So yeah, just spend the a hundred bucks on sneakers and burn. Okay, cool. Cause you know, it's not like Maggie didn't make any money from that. That's true. That's true. But no, I, I, I've always said, if, if you don't have haters, you're not doing enough to change the status quo.

[00:16:33] Maitland: That's, that's exactly good. That's, that's a perfect statement really.

[00:16:37] Peter: So you just sort of put it outta your head. You're like, They're there, but 

[00:16:40] Maitland: I try to, it means that I'm doing something. I mean, you know what always is kind of like, of course sounds the back. It's, Yeah, I don't like it, but, you know, but I try to, Yeah. Put it out my. And I do have some wonderful fans who will attack them, like nice backers. I don't even do all the work. 

[00:16:52] Peter: There you go. Yeah. So 

[00:16:54] Maitland: what's. You know what? I don't know. And, you know, well I really would like to sell the book rights and stuff cuz I, I think there's really potential there and we're working on that. And it's funny because ever since I have been in the Adult industry, I've actually had more opportunities, like people in mainstream coming to me and stuff. Like I shot a sitcom pilot last year. I'm like, yeah. So, uh, 

[00:17:15] Peter: It's, it's, well, I think it's good timing for you also. I think that those barriers have definitely back from when I was repping in 2003, like it's definitely changed.

[00:17:21] Maitland:  It's so changed and I really think it's because people have grown up with it on the internet. Yeah. Not grown up, but you know, when they get in there maybe. 

[00:17:28] Peter: So, yeah, I remember. No, I, Believe me, I remember there was a bodega, um, on the corner where, where near, I grew up in the corner, I think it was 91st and Amsterdam with an owner who did not care what you bought or what you looked at, whether it was- that's funny- Beer or nudie mags. And I, you know, like the majority of kids in my, in my grade, like 86 to 90 in high school, 85 or whatever. I think we pretty much all found it through that mess, through that pod. 

[00:17:50] Maitland: That's true. Yes. I know. I think kids today, they go online.

[00:17:53] Peter: You don't have no idea how hard it was.

[00:17:55] Maitland:  They just go online and that's so funny. But seriously, people in their twenties and thirties now, they're like, They're so open to it. And especially women. I am so surprised by the women that come up to me and they're like, This is so cool. I'm so glad you're doing this and making this change. And I, I think they feel like they can talk to me cuz I'm, I'm in, I was in their living rooms. Yeah. And I feel a little like a bridge or something between like, they can ask me questions. And people can feel a little safer talking to me about things they're curious about in the adult industry and stuff. But they all, Everybody watches it ?  

[00:18:26] Peter: No. No question about it. But they, Yeah, I could tell you, I mean, I remember when I was wrapping the company had access to all their data and I could tell you what states and what cities and what towns in those states. Yeah. Um, spent the most money. Oh really? Uh, it was, yes. You know, little spoiler. It was always a red state. Yeah. Always. A And it was like the hardest portion of course. And then the hardest core stuff. Another the one- oh, this is terrible! Right. Then they go right home. They spend a hundred bucks. Exactly. Um, that's, So tell us what you do Last, last couple questions to keep this brief. Tell us what you do to get out of your head. So do you exercise? Do you, what is your thing when you, when you're like, Oh my God, I gotta, I'm, I'm, I'm gone. See an hour, see in two hours. See you here. What do you.. 

[00:19:03] Maitland: I actually trained to be a yoga teacher. Oh wow. I'd never taught, but I did it for myself. And that was actually after I came back from New York and I was really, that helped me discover a lot for myself too, to really like, get like out my head and really like, you know, meditate, I guess, and like do the practice. So I do do that. I really like to do that. I like to play with my dogs and stuff; most, the most innocent fun. I think that they just don't care. They just, they like, no matter what is going on in the world, they're just happy to be with you. And I think that's, Yeah. So I think I do, I like to do that, but um, and I like to, I like to read a lot and I like to, um, you know, I listen to music and watch them try to like, and not distract myself, but like, just to calm and relax. Yeah. Because yeah, sometimes I get stressed out with everything going on and stuff, so I really need to like, Just mellow down.

[00:19:53] Peter:  Do you have any rituals or, um, habits that absolutely must happen every single day? 

[00:19:59] Maitland: No, I don't think so. Not every single day. I mean, does coffee count ? 

[00:20:04] Peter: Yeah, coffee counts.  

[00:20:05] Maitland: Okay. Coffee's right up there with exercise. Sure. Why not? Yeah. And like exercise. Yes and no. I don't always get to do that, but I, but I do. But, um, yeah, I think coffee, coffee's my ritual. . 

[00:20:17] Peter: I think coffee is a perfect way to end anything. So, So definitely this interview, Maitland Ward. Thank you so much. Um, tell us how people can find you?

Web: https://onlyfans.com/maitlandward

Socials:  @MaitlandWard on Twitter  INSTA  FB  and @Maitlandtoks on TikTok

[00:20:23] Maitland:  Oh, on all of the social media is Maitland Ward, except I do have a TikTok now which I just started, 

[00:20:29] Peter: listen, it’s, I’m like the only person that, that Asia's not following their, you know, stealing their, oh my gosh, stealing their files.

[00:20:34] Maitland: I, I'm so good at it yet, but we're It's MaitlandTok, because somebody had my name, 

[00:20:40] Peter: Ah, someone took your name, you. You can probably fight and get that back if you want.

[00:20:41] Maitland:  Yeah, I actually am working on that, but Awesome. Um, but yeah, it's funny. So yeah. But everywhere else is my name. 

 

[00:20:52] Peter: Folks, the book is called. “Rated X: How Porn Liberated Me from Hollywood”. This is a wonderful, wonderful interview.
Thank you so much, Maitland Ward for taking the time!

Guys, as always, thanks for listening. We appreciate you being here. This one went a little longer. Normally we cap at 20 minutes because you know, #ADHD but we went a few minutes longer and I think that's awesome. And wanna give big shout out to Maitland Ward and to, Brian Scott Gross putting us together. Brian runs the amazing PR firm, uh, BSG Public Relations He's pretty awesome. He lives out in California. A really short guy though, but really nice guy, . And anyway, , thrilled that you took the time, and really, really grateful guys. We'll see you again next week. Thank you for listening. Talk to you soon.

Credits: You've been listening to the Faster Than Normal podcast. We're available on iTunes, Stitcher and Google play and of course at www.FasterThanNormal.com I'm your host, Peter Shankman and you can find me at shankman.com and @petershankman on all of the socials. If you like what you've heard, why not head over to your favorite podcast platform of choice and leave us a review, come more people who leave positive reviews, the more the podcast has shown, and the more people we can help understand that ADHD is a gift, not a curse. Opening and closing themes were composed and produced by Steven Byrom who also produces this podcast, and the opening introduction was recorded by Bernie Wagenblast. Thank you so much for listening. We'll see you next week!

Sep 28, 2022

Katie's motto is "stop being a weenie", which speaks perfectly to her belief that anything can be accomplished with a little bravery. Katie had a lucrative - but unsatisfying career - in Sales and Marketing for years. Until one day she walked out to build the life and career she really wanted. She went on to get her training in Executive Coaching and Leadership Development at the Co-Active Training Institute in San Rafael, California. Now, she's a Certified Professional Co-Active Coach and an Associate Certified Coach with the International Coaching Federation. Katie built her successful business helping mission-driven entrepreneurs get out of overwhelm and into six-figure incomes - all while doing meaningful work that they love. Now Katie spends her time between Philadelphia and Cape Cod. She loves travel, her goofy dog Luna, and celebrating her clients' wins with good champagne. Katie shares her advice on how to find a good coach, tips and tricks she uses that you may never have heard about, and the importance of time management, among other goodness, enjoy!

In this episode Peter and Katie discuss:  

00:40 - Thank you so much for listening and for subscribing!

01:22 - Intro and welcome Katie McManus

3:05 - You’ve been through it. What do you do for clients who come to you saying they are just a complete screw-up?

03:53 - Upon hearing a new client’s story…

04:48 - Treasuring the benefits

05:04 - the ADHD brain is always working

06:15 - On not using neurotypical advice

06:40 - We with ADHD do not have a built-in electric water heater; we have to pump-up the good hot water for ourselves. [Which explains getting up at 4AM today].

08:01: How listing every single activity can in itself bring a sense of accomplishment/a dopamine hit  Ref: Canva App 

08:40 - What are some of the other tips and tricks you’ve learned over the years?

08:43 - How to do time management when you’ve got something at 2pm and it’s already noon

10:24 - What about scheduling weekend blocks of time?

11:33 - Neon colored index cards and an elliptical machine anyone?

12:15 - What would you say to someone who wants to work with a coach, but doesn't necessarily know that it's it's right for them?

13:44 - How can people find more about you? Web:  https://www.katiemcmanus.com/ 

Socials: @katie.the.coach on INSTA @katie.mcmanus.leadership on Facebook and @katiemcmanusleadership on LinkedIN 

14:00 - Guys, as always thanks so much for subscribing! Do you have a cool friend with a great story? We’d love to hear. I'm www.petershankman.com and you can reach out anytime via email at peter@shankman.com or @petershankman on all of the socials. You can also find us at @FasterNormal on all of the socials. It really helps when you drop us a review on iTunes and of course, subscribe to the podcast if you haven’t already! As you know, the more reviews we get, the more people we can reach. Help us to show the world that ADHD is a gift, not a curse! 

14:37 - Faster Than Normal Podcast info & credits 

TRANSCRIPT via Descript and then corrected.. somewhat: 

[00:00:37] Peter: Yo yo everybody what's going on. My name is Peter Shankman. This is Faster Than Normal. I'm gonna save you guys. I’m going to save you the usual spiel I give every day because today or every episode because today, my daughter went back to school and, and my daughter who sleeps in till noon, if I let her every day was up at 4:15 in the morning. Oh. Which is even before I get up this morning. And so I had my entire bike ride and everything else about an hour earlier than normal while talking to her and explaining to her that it doesn't matter that she doesn't know who's gonna be in her class because I'm sure she'll make tons of friends. And I was rewarded by bringing her to school and saying, so are you all set and realizing that she had already left to join her a bunch of friends. So feeling really loved this morning. It's. Good. Good place to be. So with that being said, meet Katie McManus. She's going to provide me the love that my daughter didn't give me. Um, Katie is a business strategist and coach, um, with a great motto or motto is stop being a weenie, which I love that. I, I say it, uh, I say it stop being a dumb ass, but it's sort of the same premise. It's like stop, stop worrying so much. Show a little bravery and get the hell out there. Jump out the plane already. She used to work in sales and marketing. Hated it. And she went on to get her training, executive coaching and leadership development and coactive training Institute in San California. She's a professional, proactive coach and associate certified coach, the international coaching Federation, all these things I didn't notice. OK. She built her successful business, helping mission driven entrepreneurs, get outta overwhelm and into six figure incomes while doing meaningful work that they love, she spends her time between Philadelphia and Cape Cod, which is just weird. Uh, she loves travel, which is cool. She has a goofy dog named Luna, which is cool, and she likes celebrating client wins with good champagne. So I'll take those and that's, that's a good enough reason to have you on Katie. Welcome. 

[00:02:18] Katie: Thank you so much for having me. I'm so excited to be here. Although the bar to be here to show you enough, love to make up for your daughter. That's pretty high. 

[00:02:26] Peter: I was gonna say you got your work cut out for you. So let's get started. um, I fully expect to be loved the next, next, uh, next few months. So next few minutes. So, I mean, I, I, you know, this is a podcast for people with ADHD and then, and sort of sort of neurodiversity and things like. And so they've spent the majority of their lives. Most of our listeners spent the majority of our lives at least I have, um, you know, hearing that we're broken. Right. And hearing that, that, that it doesn't matter what we're gonna do, cause chances are gonna screw it up. Cause that's just what we are. And so, you know, you, you, you come from, you have that background, you understand sort of where that comes from. Um, you know, what do you, what are you doing? What, how are you working with clients who come to you and say, yeah, I'm just complete screw-up? 

[00:03:05] Katie: Yeah. Um, well, it's interesting cuz I think there's a difference of when you are you're diagnosed. Cuz I was diagnosed when I was a kid. Right. And I lived in California and um, my parents actually sent me to a, a special school. They sent me to a Waldorf, um, which I don't know if you're familiar with Waldorf. It's kinda like summer camp all year long. Um, and they like neglect to teach you things like math. Uh, so I didn't learn like math until I was about six years old, but I don't know. I, I was able to integrate it into my workflow from a really early stage. Um, I actually didn't realize that. If, when you get diagnosed later, you have this stigma attached to you because you've spent so much of your life feeling like a fuck up and not knowing why. And I'm sorry. I, I hope we're allowed to swear here, 

[00:03:52] Peter: here. Go for it by all means. 

[00:03:53] Katie: Okay, great. So, um, when I'm working with my clients, it's, it's really interesting. Um, You know, they are coming to me freaking out about, oh, I fucked this up again. I screwed this up again. I'm getting this done late again. And on one side, it's like, okay, well, let's kind of deconstruct that story that you have, that you're screwing everything up all the time and that things are supposed to be done by a certain point. right. And then on the other side, like, you know, , you know, why not just make that part of your process? Why not just design that with your clients from the get, go that, Hey, I have ADHD and sometimes, uh, I'll send you emails the last minute. And if you need something from me before then just ping me for it.

[00:04:38] Peter: And I think that, that framing the disabilities as a benefit. Yeah. Right. Is something that, that not enough people do. And again, not enough people do it because they've been told all their lives. It's not a benefit. It's a curse. Right. You know, you are broken. And so I think that that's a, it's a good answer. I think though it takes, it takes a lot of work to get there. Um, it's, it's hard to believe. that you have something good. Um, when, when you come from this world where it's not, yeah. 

[00:05:03] Katie: You know, I have, I have this one lawyer, um, client and he's brilliant, absolutely brilliant. He has ADHD. And I can't tell you how many times he tells me that he came up with this incredible idea to win a case in the final hour because he procrastinated. 

[00:05:20] Peter: You know, like no, a lot of us do that

[00:05:21] Katie: . Right. But procrastination, when we think of procrastination, like, yes, we're not writing the paper. Yes. We're not doing the project. Yes. We're not doing the thing. It doesn't mean we're not working on it though. I don't know about how your process is, but I know when I'm procrastinating, I'm cleaning my house. I'm sewing a costume for Halloween in three months, I'm taking my dog for a walk. My brain is churning on that project. Right? It's it's trying things out. It's creating arguments for this. It's getting organized. I I'm not physically actually working on it. You wouldn't, I wouldn't be able to hand you anything that I've done on it, but I've already done the work in my head by the time I go and put pen to paper, if I'm writing.

[00:06:03] Peter: Right. I mean, I think a lot of that also is the fact that, you know, because we work differently, right. We do that in such a way where, you know, it might look like we're doing absolutely nothing. We're surfing the web, we're doing whatever, but there's, there's a, a candle that's lit back there and it is burning.

[00:06:15] Katie: Right. Right. I think also we, we make the mistake of trying to take neurotypical advice on productivity and that's something that actually hurts us more than it helps us. You know, I don't know if you're familiar with that saying like eat the frog first thing in the morning. No, of course. Yeah. I'm sorry. I don't have enough dopamine, first thing in the morning to get self water. Right. I have to. Well, and that's right. 

[00:06:37] Peter: Yeah. It's funny. It's funny because that, the whole premise behind that, you know, when people think of praise being up as early as I do, uh, to exercise it's because of exactly that, that is my version of. Yep. Right. I'm getting, I don't, I, you know, everyone, like, you know, do you think I really wanna get on the goddamn bike at four 30 in the morning and ride for an hour? No, wanna sleep. How's wrong with you. Yeah. Right. But you don't, you don't do that. Yeah. Because you know, what has to happen, 

[00:06:59] Katie: right. Right. It's like, it's kind of funny, you know, we think of neurotypical people, it's almost like they have an electric water heater right next to their shower, you know? And when, when someone with ADHD or who is neurodiverse, it's like the water heaters down in the basement, were on the third floor. Right. Like we just gonna have to prime the pump. We have to like get all the cold water out before we can really tackle that big thing. 

[00:07:20] Peter: Wow. That's a great way of looking at it. Right. That's I love that. I'm I'm blatantly gonna steal that. That's a great way of looking at that. No, it's, it's really true. That, that concept of priming the pump- you. Uh, people wake up, you know, I remember that I always thought for years that I was in high school, that I was awesome. Um, at first period, no matter what first period was, and it turns out first period was always English. Yeah. Or social studies, the two things I always loved. Yeah. Right. The senior year it was math. Well, I'm screwed. you know, all of a sudden my, my first period class, not a good thing. Mm-hmm right. So it's that it's that, you know, that premise of it? No, it comes down to the fact that, that I was getting my dopamine for the rest of the day from the first grade class that I enjoyed, right? 

[00:08:00] Katie: No, a hundred percent for, for me. I actually went into Canva and I created a list of all the things I usually like to get done in the morning from drinking my coffee, to take my dog for a walk, to exercising, to meditating, to showering, to brushing my teeth. And I find the days where I actually cross those things off as I do them, not in any particular order, um, are days that I am far more productive later. Because I've given myself credit for all the little things that I've done and I'm able to feel a little more productive and it really does get that, that dopamine dripping, which helps me get more stuff done.

[00:08:36] Peter: Yeah, no question about it. So tell me some of, some, some of the other secrets and tricks that you've learned over the years.

[00:08:41] Katie: Oh, man. Um, I mean, time management is a big thing for me. Um, I had a really hard time with a coach I had a while ago who I, I stopped working with pretty quickly, um, The neurotypical way of organizing a day is like do 30 minutes of this and then do 30 minutes of that. I'm sorry, that just doesn't work for me. Um, if I'm going to start working on something, I know I'm gonna get into hyperfocus and I need like a good chunk of time to be in hyperfocus because there have been too many instances where I've gotten really sucked in on a project I'm really into it. And then I missed three appointments. Right. Right. So I get this time anxiety. I can't even get into hyperfocus these days if I have something two hours from now. Right. Because I know like I'm just gonna constantly check the clock and like, I'm worried about the interruption. 

[00:09:33] Peter: So, what do you, so, so, so, 

[00:09:35] Katie: so what I do is I honestly, like, I, I tell my, my business manager and my, my assistant, like, you're not allowed to, like, these are my blocks for creative time and they're five hour blocks. And the amount of work that I can get done in a good five hour block is unheard of . Yeah. But I wouldn't be able to do that if I were just plugging in an hour a day, right. The same amount of time, but the way it's organized, just my brain just can't get into it in just an hour. 

[00:10:01] Peter: Oh, because the end of the day, you need to give yourself, you know, cause if you're okay, I have a meeting at two. Well now it's 11. All I gotta remember. And 12 o'clock and start thinking of one. O'clock exactly. And so, so you're not giving it the full capacity? No, I, I do the same thing. I block off, I block off creative days, right? Uh, no, one's allowed to schedule stuff with me on certain days of the week and that's just, that's just me to have, have a good time and create my, whatever I'm creating.

[00:10:17] Katie: Yeah, totally. Um, I also , I don't know, like weekends are really hard for. Weekends. I, I don't know. I have this expectation that I'm productive all week and on the weekends, I have to be productive in my personal life. Like I have to clean and I have to do all these things. Um, for the longest time I would just sit in terror of like, I'm a failure, I'm screwing this up. Like I'm not getting everything done for hours on Saturday morning until I actually started prescribing a Disney movie to myself every, every weekend morning mm-hmm . And it's like, there's a point at which. I don't know, there's this, this active resting thing that happens when you're, when you're watching something, that's not a lot of work to watch. Right. Where you get kinda not bored, but you're like, I'm done with this now. I've had my rest. Now I get to go do something. Right. But for, for me, like I have to be for me to turn my brain off it. There has to be a story going on. 

[00:11:13] Peter: Right. No makes perfect sense. And I think that's really interesting cause you know, a lot of growing up for me, at least it was, um, my I'd always wanted, I always wanted to be listening to music when I was studying. My parents would always say, no, it can't do that. Can't do that. Can't focus when you're doin gthat. Well, it turns out obviously, you know, now that, that would've actually been perfect. Right. That would've incredibly, incredibly beneficial. 

[00:11:32] Katie: Yeah. Did you ever use like neon colored, uh, index cards for studying? Oh yeah. Yeah. Oh. Any trip, love that stuff. I actually got like a little mini elliptical and I'd be with, up with my geography book in front of me. I'd have a map, I'd have my index cards and I'd just be like pumping away on this little mini elliptical. 

[00:11:52] Peter: That's funny. That's funny, but no, it is, you know, again, it's what works and we didn't know .God, when I was a kid, I probably would've, I would've benefited so much from having like a, you know, a treadmill desk or anything, any of those things, they just didn't, they just weren't there. Right. I have no question about it. 

[00:12:04] Katie: Or like talk to text, you know, you walk and talk and you're just like figuring out your paper. And even if it's messy, you get to go back and edit it later, but you get all the thoughts out. 

[00:12:13] Peter: Yep. What would you say? Um, at the end of the day to someone who's who's, you know, wants to work with a coach, but doesn't necessarily know that it's it's right for them or, you know, they, they feel things like that.

[00:12:24] Katie: I mean, honestly, there are so many coaches out there that aren't gonna be a good fit for you. I would say, just go and contact a bunch of them and have, have a discovery call. Just see if they're, if you even like the person, right. Because that's half the battle, cuz you're gonna be spending a lot of time with this person. You have to trust them. You have to know that they're on your side. Um, Like the only way to figure, figure out if you wanna do something or not is to explore it and get the information that you need. Um, and that's what I, I always invite people. Like, if you're curious about working with me, just book up call, I'm not a high pressure sales person at all. I come from sales. It doesn't mean that I utilize all the gross tricks that they teach there. Um, but it's really ..Know what it is that you wanna accomplish through coaching. Really really important, cuz otherwise it's, it's really hard for a coach to support you when you're not even sure what you wanna get out of it.

[00:13:17] Peter: Um, no, I understand.

[00:13:18] Katie: And, and yeah, like find someone who, you know, you're gonna be able to be honest with, so not someone that you're trying to impress all the time, because you think they're cool. Um, and someone who you, you enjoy actually talking things through with. 

[00:13:37] Peter: That makes perfect sense. Yeah. I love it. I love it. Very cool. Well, I appreciate you guys taking the time. This was, this was a lot of fun. Katie McManus business transcripts. How can people find you? 

[00:13:46] Katie: Uh, they can find me at my website at www dot Katie. K a T I E. McManis cm, a ns.com. Um, and on Instagram at Katie dot the dot coach. 

[00:14:00] Peter: Very cool. I will have people reach out. We'll put in in with the show notes. Thank you so much for taking the time. We appreciate it. 

[00:14:05] Katie: Thank you so much for having me. This is so much fun and I, I hope you feel so much love. I'm sending it to you right now. You're channeling it through your daughter and all that. 

[00:14:14] Peter: That was great. I'm trying my best. Gonna go pick her up, you know, hopefully she's a good first day and, and things go well. So all good.
Guys. Thanks for listening to Faster Than Normal. We'll be here again next week with another episode, if you liked, you heard leave us a review uh, stick around fun stuff coming every single week this entire year. It's a new year. It's a new Dawn. It's a new day. The summer's over. Welcome back. We'll see you guys soon. 

 

Credits: You've been listening to the Faster Than Normal podcast. We're available on iTunes, Stitcher and Google play and of course at www.FasterThanNormal.com I'm your host, Peter Shankman and you can find me at shankman.com and @petershankman on all of the socials. If you like what you've heard, why not head over to your favorite podcast platform of choice and leave us a review, come more people who leave positive reviews, the more the podcast has shown, and the more people we can help understand that ADHD is a gift, not a curse. Opening and closing themes were composed and produced by Steven Byrom who also produces this podcast, and the opening introduction was recorded by Bernie Wagenblast. Thank you so much for listening. We'll see you next week!

Sep 21, 2022

A few fun facts about our guest today, Shawn Malloy:

48yr old Father of 2, a little trouble being ‘present’ sometimes.Married 17yrs to a very tolerant and patient wife Meghan.Undergraduate degree in Biochemistry (after starting as a music major) from California State University, Long Beach (study abroad semester in Nottingham, England). 21 years at current employer, Biogen, 12 roles in 8 groups over 21 years. Hobbies: parkour (6 stitches), rock climbing (sprained knee), mountain biking (sprained ankle, lots of scars), and trail running, Yoga, meditation, swimming, racing midlife crisis Camaro, guitar building from scratch. “Poor student” all the way from kindergarten through high school – a few flashes of brilliance caught by the odd teacher throughout. Dangerous teenager and mid-20s kid. 25 jobs by the age of 27 and only fired once. Still struggles with honing in on 1 passion. In his own words:  “I’ve always preferred breadth to depth but I know that if I gave my full attention to one of my passions, I’d conquer the world. As with most ADD folks, I tend to be my own worst enemy in that regard. But anytime I’ve given something full attention I’ve had wild success – the guitar is one of my favorite examples. I had a desire to build a guitar for a while, a passion for artistic endeavors, creating things, and woodworking, and a goal of finishing it before Christmas as a gift for my dad. The end result was a beautiful piece of functional art, and it was the first time I ever saw my father cry”. Today we’re talking mostly about Neurodiversity in the workplace. 

—— 

In this episode Peter and Shawn discuss:  

00:40 - Thank you so much for listening and for subscribing!

01:01 - Intro and welcome Shawn Malloy

03:36 - You had 25 jobs by the age of 27. Let’s talk about how you’re not bored now, finally.

04:25 - "An ADD brain is like having a Ferrari engine with bicycle brakes"

04:55 - ADD can really be a blessing if you're in the right environment or you've put yourself in the right environment

05:55 - Growing at work under good, or ideal managing

06:55 - What happens when you get a dud for a manager at work?

08:05 - About Human Resources

09:40 - About recognizing talent and knowing how to utilize it in it’s best possible ways

10:22 - Trust = Commitment

10:54 - On Managers and management

13:19 - On how purposeful planning is so important

15:00 - What do you tell the up and coming manager about how to manage folks with neurodiverse brains?

15:47 - “You don’t manage to the role. You manage to the person”.

17:47 - On the power of diversity

18:42 - What is the one thing you’ve learned about your brain, that you wish you would’ve learned earlier in life?

19:12 - This bit right HERE on Imposter Syndrome and permitting your neurodiversity to work

20:00 - How can people find more about you? LinkedIN profile page is here: linkedin.com/in/shawn-malloy-3636696

20:22 - Guys, as always thanks so much for subscribing! Do you have a cool friend with a great story? We’d love to hear. I'm www.petershankman.com and you can reach out anytime via email at peter@shankman.com or @petershankman on all of the socials. You can also find us at @FasterNormal on all of the socials. It really helps when you drop us a review on iTunes and of course, subscribe to the podcast if you haven’t already! As you know, the more reviews we get, the more people we can reach. Help us to show the world that ADHD is a gift, not a curse! 

Faster Than Normal Podcast info & credits 

TRANSCRIPT via Descript and then corrected.. somewhat: 

[00:00:37] Peter: Hello, everyone. Welcome to another episode of Faster Than Normal my name is Peter Shankman. I am thrilled to have you here today. It’s great to be here. Its a gorgeous day outside its approaching the end of August as we're recording this. Couple more weeks to labor day, I am about to get outta here and take my daughter out for a week to Tenerife. If you don't know where that is, all need to know it's off the coast of Spain and it is the largest has the largest water park in the world. So you could make the argument I'm going to the largest water park in the world and taking my daughter with me. So it doesn't seem weird. Anyway, thrilled to have you for another episode!

 

We have a guy named Shawn Malloy on the podcast. Shawn is different than some of our guests, but also very much the same as all of our guests. 48 year old father to 12 year old boy Killion, 10 year old girl, Anna. He loves his kids to death has trouble being present sometimes .Sounds familiar, born and raised settled north of Boston, Massachusetts married 17 years to a lovely tolerant and patient wife named Megan. Here's the cool part undergraduate degree biochem okay, so abroad in England, 21 years, the past 21 years, he has worked at a company called Biogen, which is how I met him when I gave a keynote to Biogen about a month or so ago, 12 roles in eight groups over 21 years, loves adrenaline sports .Sounds, familiar, parkour, rock climbing, mountain biking. I love that he puts all this stuff in his bio and includes the number of stitches and injuries he got with each one, which I think is just so ADHD for all of us. He races a car. He has a midlife crisis Camaro on track. He built a guitar from scratch. Don't we all with that? Anyway, his story is like all of ours. He was a poor student. He was a dangerous teen, he, hit his stride stride in college. Let's talk to Shawn and figure out what turned him into what he's doing today. Shawn, welcome to Faster Than Normal man. 

[00:02:37] Shawn: Thank you very much, Peter. Um, your talk at Biogen was definitely it hit home. Um, I was an adult diagnosed #ADHD or #ADD um, survivor, I guess you could say. Uh, and my teen years is definitely a survival story to some extent, um, But, yeah. Thanks for, thanks for having me on this is, uh, I'm looking forward to a fun conversation.

[00:03:00] Peter: At the end of the day, we make it through, we survive it. Somehow we move on, you know, we become adults. I joke that, um, you know, I turned 50 a couple of weeks ago, but didn't really hit me until yesterday. When I had a wall unit delivered. I now own a wall unit in my living room, which is. What kind of bullshit is that right? That's how, you know, you're getting all that, a goddamn wall unit. You know, I used to just hang my TV on the wall, right? No, not I have a wall unit cause you know, I need storage. What is that? Right. Welcome to middle age. 

[00:03:30] Shawn: Adulting. Um, it's horrible.

[00:03:32] Peter: Yeah. So let's talk about ADHD. You had 25 jobs by the age of 27. You were only fired once you got bored, super fast, right? Biogen, you found a place that never let you get bored. Yes. Um, okay, so let's talk about that. Cause not everyone has the fortune to not always, you know, not everyone has a job where they don't always get bored.

[00:03:56] Shawn: It it's been, honestly, it's been pretty amazing. Um, I think Biogen's been a place that. If you're performing reasonably well, you don't even have to be a top performer, but you're performing reasonably well. They'll let you try different stuff out. And I've moved from jobs that were somewhat adjacencies to jobs where I, I didn't know what I was doing. Um, And much to my surprise, each time I would be at 80% of my peers within a couple of months. And I attribute that to that ADD brain. Right. You've got this #Ferrari engine with bicycle brakes. Um, I. I was always able to assimilate information really quickly, put the pieces together, learn really fast, and it started to be intrinsically rewarded, rewarding. You talk about that dopamine hit, but the success profile that Biogen let me build over the years, just continued to add confidence to me as a person. Um, but also to the power of ADD. Like once I found out that I had ADD it started to click that this really can be a blessing if you're in the right environment or you've put yourself in the right environment.

[00:05:02] Peter: Well, and that's sort of one of the, sort of the unexpected gifts of, or ADHD that we, we figure out, right? No one can tell you that, right? No one can say, oh, trust me. It's gonna be, you know, you don't believe it. It has to happen. And it has to show up naturally, but once it does. It's sort of that way of call, like, wow, I'm in a position. I, I, I have this job where I have ability to not only do my job great, but then I can create things within my job that give me that dopamine hit that, let me work harder and let work more and let do better. So it's almost like selfing, prophecy. 

[00:05:33] Shawn: Yeah. Yeah. And in my time here, right, I've had 21 years. You can imagine I've had a lot of managers in that time. I've really only had two duds. And those were the times where there was such rigidity placed on me. And what I was allowed to do that I really did actually flounder. I, I was not good at the job, or I just couldn't get engaged with the job. And those were really hard and it got me to a point. You know, rather than looking for the ideal job, I look for the ideal manager and just make sure that the work's gonna be interesting.

[00:06:04] Peter: That's an interesting point. Instead of finding the, the, looking for the ideal job, you look for the ideal manager. And I think a lot of that actually resonates because I remember, you know, the few jobs I've had, right? I, I, I, I worked for America online, back in the nineties. That was the last job I ever had. The only job I ever had. And I had a great manager who let me, who understood, like do your job, you know, do it whichever way works for you, but get it done. And, and that. I think for me, you know, for my first job, having that as a first job was a bit of a, a problem because, uh, I just assumed every job was like that right. I went to my second job and, and, and it totally was not. And, you know, there were 8:00 AM meetings. There were check-ins and like, you know, I quit in two weeks. So having that ability to find that, or to have a boss or to have a, a manager. Who understands how you work and let you, lets you go the way you want I think it's key. You sort of honed in on that and you said it, you only had two sort of duds. What happens when you get a dud though? How do you, how do you sort of handle yourself? Because it's not, you know, if you can't be yourself, if you're not allowed to do the things you want, be the way you want. It's difficult.

[00:07:06] Shawn: It's very difficult and it, the problem that was just, it continued to get worse is I didn't stop being myself. I don't think that that's in the, a add profile is the ability to not be impulsive and not be yourself. Right. Um, that's so one of the things that defines us, so the relationship just deteriorated from not good to really bad. But what I did have was this long history of performance with a lot of people, I had a big network, so I was able to work through my network to find the next opportunity. Um, and really that was the only way out. I was not working my way out of this, this problem with the manager that was the dud or the managers that were duds, it just wasn't gonna work. Uh, one of the managers was removed, so they were a dud for everybody, not just me. The other one was the manager who was highly regarded and really was a brilliant man, but it was not a good personality match between how I needed to be functioning and how he wanted me to be functioning. And that one, the one where I network. 

[00:08:04] Peter: That's interesting point. That's interesting point because you know, it's not all the time that, you know, remember there are a lot of times where you you're sitting there and you're going okay. It's not that the, the boss, isn't a good boss. He's not a good boss for me. Yes. Right. And how do you, how do you sort of explain that, you know, to, to the powers that be when they don't understand what he, not a good boss for you, he's a boss, you know, you deal with it. Well, it doesn't work that way all the time.

[00:08:31] Shawn: No, it really doesn't. And you're very right. HR is almost always gonna side with the boss and they did, um, they didn't fully get it, but I wasn't in a unique position. This was, you know, maybe 15 years deep into my career here. I had built this legacy of everywhere I went, I did excellent. So it wasn't like, they just thought all of a sudden I'm not doing my job, but it was not a pleasant experience trying to, to escape if you will. I, there were a lot of things up against me, but I don't, I think there are gonna be a lot of people that don't have that benefit. 

[00:09:00] Peter: Well, that's the thing that brings up a really interesting point is that, is that every, you know, for as long as you're in a job, whether it's 15 years or 15 days, you know, your goal is to create a, a sort of, uh, security blanket around yourself where people look at you and go, yeah, he's a really good worker, or he's a really, you know, smart employee or whatever and so if something's not working. Right. Let's not be that quick to blame him. Let's see what the issue and, and that doesn't necessarily happen all the time because companies aren't trained to think that way. 

[00:09:35] Shawn: Not very often. No, I've what I got to know when I became a supervisor, is that there are very few people who don't want to do a good job. I would say it's bordering on none. Nobody wants to come in and be known as the crappy employee. Um, there's usually a barrier in their way, and it's whether it's a barrier in how the job is functioning or the training, or in my case, if you having a person with a ADD or some other, um, I don't wanna call it a disability, a different ability, a different brain, right. Um, you've gotta find ways to get them to be their best, cuz if you can find that for them; man, will they run through brick walls? Like if you're the person who discovers what that person's talent is after they've been, um, pushed down their whole life, what a connection seriously. Um, and had many of those over my career.

[00:10:22] Peter: That's really a key point also, because if you are a manager and you're able to bring that out, Your in your employee. Right. And, and, you know, not only bring that out, but, but appreciate it as opposed to try and push it back down, you know, these employees will go to the end of the Earth for you. And I don't think enough managers- don'ts that, that. They don't realize the level of commitment that someone with a different brain will give you. If you give them that level of trust. 

[00:10:54] Shawn: Oh, you I've seen it too many times to not believe it's true. Peter. You're, you're dead right. And. The not only that, right? The work side of things, but that personal connection that you get that personal, just watching somebody light up because they've been discovered for what they bring to the table. The, the trouble with managers is very few of them receive good formal training. It's kinda like when you're parenting, right. You become a parent. And then all of a sudden you've gotta figure out how to raise a human being. Um, when you're a manager, most of them are thrown to the, the, the job because they were good at a job, but not necessarily good at managing right. The good ones over time, come to realize that you manage the individual, you don't manage to manage your role. You manage to the people that you have in front of you. And, and that does get to you're managing to every individual difference. You're bringing out the bright spots and trying to minimize the deficits and it's not easy. It really isn't. So I don't, I don't fault always the managers who aren't good at it because it, it does take a, a really dedicated person to be able to do that. And you also have to have the bandwidth to do it. A lot of managers are given a day job as well as a manager role. So there's gotta be some patience for the manager as well. 

[00:12:04] Peter: Isn't that, um, what you said earlier that, that, you know, most managers aren't born into, into the concept of managing they're they're they're become, they become managers cause they were given a job which isn't necessarily a manager job. Isn't that the Peter principle, the Peter principle is, is the object that basically states that every worker will rise to his or her highest level of incompetence. Yes right in that, in that you, you, you, you hire someone and they're good at their job, so you promote them and they're good at the next job, so you promote them again and they're good at the following job. So you promote them again. Then they're not good. If finally reach a point where they're not good. Well, you don't demote. But you don't promote them again. Right. So they sit there. Right. And they, it that's how bureaucracy happens. 

[00:12:43] Shawn: yes. Yeah. It, it plays itself out over and over again in corporate America. For sure. I, I don't really have a good solution for it. Right. But I, I think, I don't know if there is one there really, 

[00:12:55] Peter: I think we can make a lot, you and I can make a lot of money, but you figure one out. 

[00:12:58] Shawn: No question. Yeah. I would agree. Um, I took a few notes as I was thinking about this podcast and, and the things I wanted to be able to convey. And we've talked about a, a great one, right? I think understanding how to navigate your career with ADD is important. But one of the things that I've I've learned throughout the years is, um, purposeful planning. As a person with ADD and activation energy. And I think they do relate to how I've navigated my career over time at Biogen. It wasn't just that I bounced around from job to job because I'm a ADD; I did all along have plans. Um, and for me, it's similar to the guitar that I built. Right. I had a, I finally had something that I could leverage my artistic capability, my engineering capability. I had a goal around it. Timing. And step by step of how to approach it. And I've, I've approached my career much the same way. And when I first started supervising people, I was in the manufacturing element of Biogen, very small little world. Okay. Very small little world. Right. But you feel like it's all there is because you're in the science, you're actually making the drug. But as I was developing people, all, I really knew how to develop them for were manufacturing roles. So I wanted to get out and see the broader thing that is biotech. I wanted to hop into some individual contributor roles, learn what different roles did so that as I came back to a management role, I'd understand how to develop people. Like when I saw somebody's passion to speak to what we were getting to before, when I noticed somebody's niche, I didn't necessarily know what to do with it other than maybe a small part in manufacturing, but now that I've come full circle with all this knowledge of all these roles, when I see somebody who's got a particular passion, I know where that fits in the organization. I know how to put them in a role that's gonna get them into that flow state. And that's good for people with a ADD that's good for people in life in general, but it all came because I had a plan that as a manager, I wanted to be able to develop people better, to be able to do that. I had to understand 

[00:14:53] Peter: that brings up a great point. What do you tell, you know, if you had to. Sort of hammer that down in 10 words. What do you tell the up and coming manager about, I mean, managing in general, but obviously managing people with neuro diverse brains, right. Because you know, , you certainly do not learn this in school. 

[00:15:11] Shawn: No, I think it's the first question I ask my people, um, when I meet them is- what is your passion? Where does time disappear for you? And then I'm gonna do my best to find the aspects of the current role that you're in and whatever future roles you wanna point yourself towards where that passion can come to bear as often as possible. Every job is gonna have crap you don't wanna do, sorry. It's work. Yeah. But the more that you can leverage those points of passion. The more you're gonna enjoy your work. The more you're gonna succeed. And the more you're just gonna really shine. And that's, that's what I would tell managers is you don't manage to the role you manage to the person.

[00:15:51] Peter: Ooh, I like that. 

[00:15:52] Shawn: If you wanna get the most out of the people that are around you, find out what drives them. Where does time disappear for them? You'll be surprised, right? You may hate analytics. You may hate looking at data, but I've had people under me who that is their passion. Mm-hmm they love working in a spreadsheet. They love seeing the story that comes out. When you start looking at the data and the numbers. If you have somebody who hates that, don't put them in a role that that's their main function. Find the person that that is their passion and oh, you're. Get such better work outta them, and you're gonna get better dedication, better loyalty. And you'll have people coming to you for jobs because they wanna work for you because you get it. You get how to place them in success.

[00:16:35] Peter: You bring an interesting point because I think a lot of people, whether you're manager or not, you know, we tend to gravitate towards the stuff that we're good at the stuff we like. Right. I mean, you know, let's. As we're as we're growing up and we're in school when we're undiagnosed with a neurodiverse brain, um, it's no surprise that we gravitate towards the stuff we're really good at, right. For me it was, it was English or it was, you know, it was social studies or whatever it wasn't math. Right. And so math would be horrible. So I would avoid math as much as possible. I think as adults, when we're in job roles, we sort of keep that uh, in the back of our heads and we don't really let that go away. So that, so that, that, you know, we tend to gravitate sorts of stuff we like to do and try to avoid the stuff we don't. And so, because of that, I think, you know, we look at our, our, our sort of employees when we're in a managerial role and we put them in the same boat, but what we have to sort of understand is that, that we might have employees who love the very stuff that we hate, like love. Yes. The very stuff that we hate. And we have to sort of, I guess, embrace that. For them. Right. And let them under, you know, Hey, you, you have that math kick. Great. Go do math. you know, I, I, I look at along lines of, I, my assistant is awesome at the stuff I'm terrible at. She doesn't let me schedule stuff in my calendar because I screw it up, but she's great at it. She loves that stuff. And so it's that, it's that giving over that ability for her to do that.

[00:18:08] Shawn: It's the power of diversity, right? We're talking about neurodiverse brain, but the power of diversity is everywhere in life. It's everywhere in work. And if you can work with people who are different than you, you're gonna be so much better off because everybody can bring a different strength to bear. Yeah. The hard part is a hundred percent. Different personalities that are there. Cause that can be a little weird. We are humans at the end of the day and sometimes we get a little quirky on the personality side. 

[00:18:32] Peter: I think. We could do nine and a half hours on managing personalities. So I'm not even gonna start with that. but I will, I will end it with this. I'll ask you this. What is the one thing you've learned about your brain, whether it's, you know, in a professional setting or personal setting with your wife or your kids that you wish learned earlier? 

[00:18:54] Shawn: That is a great question. I think you had mentioned it it's that the imposter syndrome, um, that it's very real, that it exists, but it really isn't true 90% of the time. The ADD brain, you are so good at so many things, and you can see the big picture better than so many other people. You're gonna be your own harshest critic. Yeah, that does not mean that you are not still better than 80 or 90% of the people who are doing the same thing. It means you're not 80 to 90% as good as you wanna be, or, you know, you could be, but stretching that extra mile may not be worth the effort. Your, your good enough is gonna be better than most people's best. So don't let imposter syndrome beat you down. 

[00:19:46] Peter: I love that.

[00:19:46] Shawn: Don't fall prey to it. Have faith that what you're doing is probably better than the majority of the people around you.

[00:19:53] Peter: That's that's a phenomenal, uh, a phenomenal line. That's that's awesome. I love that. I love that. Awesome. Well, listen, I cannot thank you enough for taking the time, Shawn really appreciate it. I'm so glad we connected, uh, at the Biogen talk.

Guys, Shawn Malloy , uh, how can people find you? How can they, how can they, uh, learn more about you?  LinkedIN profile page is here: linkedin.com/in/shawn-malloy-3636696

[00:20:11] Shawn: Uh, LinkedIN I am on LinkedIn. It's Shawn S H a w N M a L L O Y. Uh, and you'll find me as employed by Biogen. That's probably the cleanest and simplest way to find me. 

[00:20:22] Peter: Awesome guys. We’ve been visiting with Shawn Malloy and you've been listening to Faster Than Normal. My name is Peter Shankman as always. We love that you're here. And if you had a second right now, go and leave us a review. I cannot tell you how those reviews help our uh, podcast growth, the more reviews the more it helps the website and the podcast is seen. It is really incredible, and we're able to help more and more people understand that ADHD is a gift, ADD is a gift, Any form of neurodiversity is a gift, not a curse! We will see you again next week with a brand new interview and a brand new episode. We appreciate you listening, and we appreciate all our guests, including Shawn, thank you so much Shawn for taking the time. Guys, thank you for listening. We will see you next week. My name is Peter Shankman. And remember the ADHD and all forms of neurodiversity is probably the best thing that ever happened to you. We will see you next week. Stay safe. Talk to you soon.

Credits: You've been listening to the Faster Than Normal podcast. We're available on iTunes, Stitcher and Google play and of course at www.FasterThanNormal.com I'm your host, Peter Shankman and you can find me at shankman.com and @petershankman on all of the socials. If you like what you've heard, why not head over to your favorite podcast platform of choice and leave us a review, come more people who leave positive reviews, the more the podcast has shown, and the more people we can help understand that ADHD is a gift, not a curse. Opening and closing themes were composed and produced by Steven Byrom who also produces this podcast, and the opening introduction was recorded by Bernie Wagenblast. Thank you so much for listening. We'll see you next week!

Sep 14, 2022

Skye Rapson is an academic and coach with over seven years of experience working in adult education. Skye has studied in various fields, including Psychology, Sociology, and Public Health, and is now a Doctoral Candidate in Population Health. She was diagnosed with ADHD at the start of her doctorate. Since then, Skye has dedicated her time to researching and disseminating ADHD studies, founding Unconventional Organisation in 2020 to provide ADHD adults and managers with strengths-based, neurodiverse-friendly ADHD coaching and workshops. We’re learning about how and why she began, today. Enjoy!

In this episode Peter and Skye discuss:  

00:40 - Thank you so much for listening and for subscribing!

01:01 - Intro and welcome Skye Rapson!  Ref: Interview with Sally Willbanks, founder of ND Renegade [actually based in Australia]

01:57 - So you were diagnosed at the beginning of your PhD program?

03:00 - What changed and maybe made more sense after your diagnosis?

03:39 - Ref: Interview with Rachel Cotton, another PhD student w/ ADHD

04:00 - How did your priorities shift?

04:27 - What Skye found of from her peer group at university

05:55 - Let’s talk about your “Unconventional Organization” Ref: Her podcast: Unconventional Organisation with Skye Rapson and her coaching service: https://www.unconventionalorganisation.com

06:54 - What kinds of trends did you find when you started conversing with other neurodiverse folks?

07:42 - On changing the way we get things accomplished 

08:40 - What would you now tell your 15-year-old self?

09:03 - How can people find more about you? Web: https://www.unconventionalorganisation.com Socials: @unconventionalorganisation on INSTA and Facebook 

09:24 - Guys, as always thanks so much for subscribing! Do you have a cool friend with a great story? We’d love to hear. I'm www.petershankman.com and you can reach out anytime via email at peter@shankman.com or @petershankman on all of the socials. You can also find us at @FasterNormal on all of the socials. It really helps when you drop us a review on iTunes and of course, subscribe to the podcast if you haven’t already! As you know, the more reviews we get, the more people we can reach. Help us to show the world that ADHD is a gift, not a curse! 

09:58 - Faster Than Normal Podcast info & credits 

TRANSCRIPT via Descript and then corrected.. somewhat: 

[00:00:37] Peter: Hey everyone, Peter. Shankman welcome. The episode of Faster Than Normal today is a PhD. We seem to be doing a lot of doctoral candidates lately. I don't know why doctoral candidates seem to get diagnosed, but maybe cuz they're smart enough to know that something's not, uh, normal, like other people. And they're like, Hey, let's figure that out. But either way we get another one here. Her name is Skye Rapson and Skye's an academic coach with over seven years of experience working at adult education, she has studied in various fields, including psychology, sociology. and public health and is now a doctoral candidate in population health in New Zealand. So we are a long way from home today. She was diagnosed with ADHD at the start of her doctorate. And since then, she's dedicated time to researching and disseminating ADHD studies, founding unconventional organization in 2020 to provide ADHD, adults and managers with strength based neurodiverse friendly ADHD, coaching and workshop. Skye, welcome. 

[00:01:35] Skye: Hi. Yeah. Great to be here. 

[00:01:37] Peter: Good to have you here. So ADHD, you know, it, it's interesting. We had, we have there's someone else from New Zealand who we've had on the podcast. Um, she runs, uh, oh God, what's the name, but neuro neuro it's line of t-shirts neuro… Oh, I'm spacing on it now. I have one of them. It's awesome. Awesome shirt. I'll remember it, but, and we'll put it in the liner notes, but yeah. Um, long way from home. So good to have you, you were diagnosed at the beginning of your PhD, uh, beginning of your doctoral research. Yeah. 

[00:02:04] Skye: Yeah, no, I was diagnosed. I actually thought I had, um, dyslexia. I went in, um, postmasters. Um, so I'd done my masters and. It was good, but it was tough. And, um, right at the end, I thought I should probably go and see if I, if I might have dyslexia. I know it, you know, it's something that my family have talked about potentially having. Um, and I came out, um, several weeks later with an ADHD. Uh, you know, you probably have ADHD and a couple of other things as well. 

[00:02:30] Peter: So you were surprised you were surprised at that. 

[00:02:32] Skye: Yeah, it, it made a lot of sense. I mean, you wrote out, read out all the different things I'd studied, you know, tell me you have ADHD without telling me you have ADHD. I kept getting to the end of a degree and being like, well, you know, this might not be for me. I think I need to switch to a totally different area and learn a totally different subject. Um, and so, um, you know, in hindsight it made a lot of sense and I learned about ADHD, but I hadn't put the pieces together in, in. Fit my life. 

[00:02:58] Peter: Amazing. What, tell me about what it was sort of like sort of the wake up call once you were diagnosed, what sort of started to make sense?

[00:03:05] Skye: Yeah. So in terms of what made sense, I, I really focused on understanding why I was burning out because what I was experiencing was a period, you know, up until that point, I'd done a year generally at a time, you know? And so I would, I would study something really intensely for a year, work on it, stay up all night, you know, do weekends. And then I would burn out and I would need a break. And then I would be like, well, I guess maybe this isn't the subject for me and I'd come back and I would do something else. And that was very much how my ADHD was, was manifesting. 

[00:03:39] Peter: Now I believe that we had a, another PhD on the podcast named Rachel Cotton. She was one of our first interviews and she always talked about how, uh, she thought it was perfectly normal to live on, you know, uh, 14 caffeine tablets away. Yeah. , you know, um, But no I get that. So, so talk about, um, after you got diagnosed and, and things sort of changing, what, how did your priority shift?

[00:04:01] Skye: Yeah, so, so one of the first things I actually did was I, um, I created a community in my university of other people who were postgraduate, um, who were also neuro diverse. I had worked in adult education for a really long time. Um, I'd done a lot of tutoring in universities and I'd sort of told myself when I started the PhD, I'm not gonna do that. Cuz you know, I, I tended to take on too many classes and it was distracting from actually doing the writing. Um, and then when I found out I had ADHD, I was like, oh, but like, you know, one group won't hurt. And so I started I started a group and um, and started connecting with people and learning as much as possible, not just from the research, which. You know, later on writing about, but the very first thing I started to do was to talk to other people. Who'd had those same experiences. 

[00:04:48] Peter: And what did you find out? 

[00:04:49] Skye: I found out that people were kind of frustrated with the university system, um, in terms of, you know, how it fit and how it worked with how they worked. And I think that was really, um, really helpful for me because it meant I didn't spend too long sitting in that space of feeling like it was just me, which so many people with ADHD, I know had that feeling because I immediately was launched into the space of, oh, we're all experiencing these struggles.

[00:05:15] Peter: And it was sort of one of those lessons. I remember sort of the same thing when I finally got diagnosed, everything started to make sense. Part of me was pissed off because, you know, I, I, I I'd spent so much energy. Mm-hmm over the course of my life fighting things that, that, you know, swimming upstream when I didn't really have mm-hmm I'd just gone with the flow. It would've been that much easier.

[00:05:31] Skye: Yeah. Yeah, no, it's definitely, it's definitely, um, a tough thing. And, you know, there was a little bit. Sadness as well. I think to look back on my more was at that point, my twenties, um, and realize that, yeah, it had just been a different, if I'd known a slightly different way of working, it wasn't that it had to be hugely different, but just some adjustments, it could have been so much easier.

[00:05:55] Peter: So let's talk about, uh, unconventional organization. Tell me about it. 

[00:05:58] Skye: Yeah. So, um, I started on unconventional organization in 2020, um, after I'd, you know, worked with the universities, I started working with schools and then when, uh, COVID hit and we all had to go back to our homes. I was looking for an opportunity to keep doing what I really loved to do, which is connect with people and work with people. Um, and I found ADHD coaching. And so I started doing that alongside at that point, um, writing articles. Cause I really wanted to learn more if I was gonna do this kind of space properly, I wanted to learn about the research. And so I, um, started writing articles and challenging myself to put them up every week as a way of, of, you know, keeping myself accountable for that. And, um, those two things sort of ballooned into, into what we have now with, um, you know, people who are training to become coaches with us, um, who also have ADHD. And then also having that, um, that research space as well. 

[00:06:51] Peter: And what did you, so tell me what, one of the interesting things I always, I always ask, what did you find when you started conversing with other people and being like, Hey, we share the same brain. Right? What kind of trends did you, did you find? 

[00:07:02] Skye: I found that people were working a lot harder than people realize people with ADHD. I, I found that a lot of the people that I spoke to would come to me and they'd say, I'm not getting enough done. I need to, you know, and even the people that, you know, the coaches would often come to us as well. And, you know, say I haven't been, I haven't been achieving at the level that I want to, and then I'd ask them what they're doing, because that's part of coaching. We get very specific about what your day looks like and people were spending a lot of time trying to work. And, and in that way they were expending a lot of energy. It just wasn't necessarily, um, giving them the outcome that they were looking for. 

[00:07:40] Peter: Right. And one of the things you learn is that, is that it's sort of a self limiting, uh, prophecy, because you wind up expending all this energy. You're not getting the results. So you try harder and it's still the same thing. Right. So you, so you, you're going down this rabbit hole and you can't win. 

[00:07:53] Skye: Yeah, no, exactly. And then, and then the worst part, you know, at least for us was that people would say, oh, well then I don't deserve to have a break. I don't deserve to have fun. And so we'd end up in this sort of self-fulfilling cycle of just, you know, not getting the dopamine, working hard, feeling like you don't deserve to get a break. So you definitely don't get the Domine and you're continuing to keep trying.

[00:08:13] Peter: Right. And so I guess one of the best lessons there is change the way you try. 

[00:08:18] Skye: Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Yeah. And, and it's about, you know, we think about it in terms of experimentation. We often say, you know, if something doesn't work or it doesn't work for you, we just keep, we just keep adapting it. We just, we just check it out and go. That's interesting, that doesn't work. And then, you know, in, in the case of working with the coach, you come back and you say, Hey, that doesn't work for me. And they go, that's fine. Like we can adjust it. 

[00:08:41] Peter: Right. What would you have told your 15 year old self, if you knew, if you knew that and what you know now? 

[00:08:46] Skye: That's a really good question. I think I would tell my 15 year old self. It's not about finding the perfect career. It's about finding the perfect environment. 

[00:08:56] Peter: Oh good. Oh, I like that a lot. That's a great quote, great quote. Oh, I like, yeah. I really, really love that. Yeah. Um, Skye, how can people find more about you? How can they get, 

[00:09:05] Skye: yeah, you can find us, um, at, [Web: https://www.unconventionalorganisation.com Socials: @unconventionalorganisation on INSTA and Facebook ] um, unconventionalorganization.com, uh, with a Z or with an S depending on which country you're from. Um, we also have, um, a lot of articles about different strategies you can use on the website as well as. And then ADHD coaching as well. 

[00:09:22] Peter: Awesome. Well, I love this sky. Thank you so much for taking the time. I appreciate it all the way from New Zealand. What time is it over there?

[00:09:27] Skye:  Um, it is 5:40 AM . 

[00:09:30] Peter: Okay. So either time to get up, or time to go to bed; I'm gonna assume time to get up.

[00:09:32] Skye: Time to get up!

[00:09:34] Peter: Skye, thanks for taking the time guys. Thanks for listening. You know, the drill, uh, fasternormal.com. Leave a, uh, review anywhere you like iTune, stitcher or Google play, whatever I'm at Peter Shankman, we're faster, normal on Twitter, faster than normal on Instagram, everywhere. And we'll be back next week with another interview of someone just as awesome because of that is what we do.
We will see you soon. Thanks for listening

 

Credits: You've been listening to the Faster Than Normal podcast. We're available on iTunes, Stitcher and Google play and of course at www.FasterThanNormal.com I'm your host, Peter Shankman and you can find me at shankman.com and @petershankman on all of the socials. If you like what you've heard, why not head over to your favorite podcast platform of choice and leave us a review, come more people who leave positive reviews, the more the podcast has shown, and the more people we can help understand that ADHD is a gift, not a curse. Opening and closing themes were composed and produced by Steven Byrom who also produces this podcast, and the opening introduction was recorded by Bernie Wagenblast. Thank you so much for listening. We'll see you next week!

Sep 7, 2022

Gökçen Şahin, M.Sc., who successfully completed her master's degree in Genetics, has just registered for the PhD program to start her education this fall. Technological advances in the field of genetics in the last 20 years have brought with it a large pile of data waiting to be made sense of. Gökçen will do her PhD in bioinformatics in order to learn how to draw meaningful conclusions from these data and to find solutions for this purpose. Gökçen, who loves to learn new things and is curious, developed a machine learning model in her thesis that can predict the muscle heteroplasmy ratio of patients with given demographic features, family history, and clinical table caused by a mitochondrial DNA point mutation causing mitochondrial diseases. She made these by learning everything herself. She reviewed more than 450 publications fastidiously and worked with doctors to generate her data. Gokcen, who wants to improve herself in this field, wants to have a solid foundation. Therefore, she decided to take her education in this field. Gökçen actually qualified to enter another PhD program last year for the same purpose and started her education. During this period, she was diagnosed with ADHD in December and in January, she learned that she is autistic. While the diagnoses were a great shock at first, she shared her diagnoses with her supervisor in order to pass this period in a healthy way. Afterwards, she was exposed to various mobbing by this supervisor. The severity of mobbing had increased over time. And in February, she was fired by him from the PhD program in an e-mail. Not long after, her ex-boyfriend's family, who learned that she is autistic and ADHDer, did not want them to get married, and they broke up after a 2-year relationship, which was a first for Gökçen. She had many reasons to lose hope. But the opposite happened. The diagnoses resulted in her accepting herself. She faced many challenges throughout her life and she saw that the challenges she experienced was the result of not being accepted as she was. Realizing this, she wanted to go on further and apply for a new program, but she also had fears. She explained everything to her new supervisor before application. And she was encouraged by new supervisor to apply for the program. Now she's telling people that “Being autistic and ADHD is part of the diversity in nature and being able to live as ourselves, to be free of masks is what we have a right to do. The only thing that can hinder this view is when we begin to look at ourselves as people who do not accept us as we are. When we come back from this mistake, we start living a healthy life. Because not being able to be what we are, not being accepted is ignoring us and it hurts. Nobody has the right to this. We are a part of nature, just like everything else." This is a great one- enjoy!

 

In this episode Peter and Gökçen discuss:  

00:40 - Thank you so much for listening and for subscribing!

00:50 - Apologies for the near horrid audio- Peter is still in a hotel.

00:56 - Intro and welcome Gökçen Şahin!

02:45 - Your story is incredible; and it’s frustrating professors would still be so ignorant!

03:21 - So you said that you wrote something out that you wanted to share with us, feel free! 

03:35 - On being accepted for PhD programs

04:03 - On the first meeting with her supervisor/professor

04:51 - On the 2nd meeting with her supervisor

05:50 - What happened next?

08:16 - A little while later…

08:45 - Studying about ADHD

10:00 - On being diagnosed by a child psychologist and then given meds

10:19 - Her professor’s reaction

11:05 - Back to the psychologist

11:51 - On being made a study and the discovery of Autism

13:00 - Amazing. A couple of questions…

13:15 - The fallout and heartbreak

14:00 - Did you go back to your former professor?

15:05 - What types of things that you used to think were negatives, do you now understand to be positives?

15:56 - Fun fact: Your subconscious mind controls about 80percent of what you think; be mindful in your self-talk/inner dialogue. 

16:24 - On being happy inside and being kind to yourself!

17:44 - What advice would you give to someone who has been told that they are broken?

17:55 - THIS PART.  RIGHT HERE.

19:56 - What happened with her new supervisor?

21:30 - How can people find more about you? @GKCNSHN on Twitter

21:30 - Guys, as always thanks so much for subscribing! Do you have a cool friend with a great story? We’d love to hear. I'm www.petershankman.com and you can reach out anytime via email at peter@shankman.com or @petershankman on all of the socials. You can also find us at @FasterNormal on all of the socials. It really helps when you drop us a review on iTunes and of course, subscribe to the podcast if you haven’t already! As you know, the more reviews we get, the more people we can reach. Help us to show the world that ADHD is a gift, not a curse! 

21:40 - Faster Than Normal Podcast info & credits 

TRANSCRIPT via Descript and then corrected.. somewhat: 

[00:00:40] Hey guys, Peter, Shankman welcome to another episode of Faster Than Normal. Unfortunately, again, I'm still recording from a hotel. Uh, we should be back in my apartment within a week or so, but oh my God, has it been not fun? Anyway, I do wanna talk about something fun today. I have an amazing story here I was on Twitter and someone tagged me in a post and said, you've gotta read what's going on here. And I was introduced to a one whose name. Uh I'm I'm despite my best efforts, I'm probably gonna screw up and I wanna say it's Gokcen shine and I'm pretty, I'm sure I'm relatively close there, but lemme tell you something about Gokcen was in a. PhD program. And, uh, she was doing her PhD in bioinformatics in order to learn how to draw meaningful conclusions from data and find solutions. She was, she loved new things; she's very curious. She discovered a machine learning model and her thesis that could predict the muscle hetero PLAs ratio of patients with given demographic features basically stuff way beyond my pay grade. Right. She's dealing with Mitocondrial DNA, uh, point mutation. I mean, incredible stuff. So what happens. She gets into another PhD program and gets diagnosed with ADHD in January. She learns that she has ADHD and learns that she's autistic. And while this diagnosis works a great shock to her, she shared a diagnosis with a supervisor, and guess what happened with her supervisor? Her supervisor fired her from her PhD program via email! Okay. That's like breaking up with someone over a text message, not cool! Okay. And then after that, her ex-boyfriend's family or her boyfriend at the time who learned that she was a autistic and ADHD, did not want them to get married and they broke up a over a 2 year relationship. Unbelievable. But despite having many reasons to lose hope the opposite happened and the diagnosis resulted in G accepting herself and saw these challenges for what they were through her life, realizing that she applied for a new program. Got in. And now she tells everyone that being autistic and ADHD is part of the diversity in nature. And being able to live as ourselves to be free of masks is what we have a right to do. I am so excited to talk to you. Thank you so much for being here today Gokcen. 

[00:02:41] Gokcen: Uh, thank you so much for inviting me, Peter, 

[00:02:44] Peter: uh, an amazing, an amazing story. I, I, I, I, I remember reading it on Twitter and just being blown away that, that, that, you know, of, of all things, professors could still be that, uh, closed mind truly, truly just incredible.

[00:02:58] Gokcen: Actually leaving it was very hard, but eventually I just, uh, get something at you get new thing at you then .Right now I'm totally okay. 

[00:03:10] Peter: Yeah. I mean, it sounds like, it sounds like you took this, you know, as, as, as difficult as it was, you saw this as an opportunity and, and, you know, used it to your, to your advantage.

[00:03:20] Gokcen: Sure, sure. 

[00:03:21] Peter: So, so you said that you wrote something out that you wanted to share with us, feel free. 

[00:03:25] Gokcen: Yes. Okay. Uh, you can just, uh, cut me if I exceed the time. 

[00:03:29] Peter: really not a problem. Go ahead. Okay, go ahead.

[00:03:32] Gokcen: Uh, just let me mention about myself a bit. I completed my master on genetics in 2021. I am accepted to PhD program and I will, uh, start my education in the field of bioformatics and system biology in this semester. I was actually accepted to PhD program last year, too. Uh, three acceptance. Actually, I got three acceptance last year from three different universities. In the one that I choose I was fired after six months by my supervisor. Uh, I met with him on 6th of July, 2021. In the meeting I mentioned about my background, about my thesis, about my current knowledge in this field and I, um, What I want to do, et cetera. And he spoke very positively about my answers. Uh, and he said, a few people at your level can answer these questions so well, you know why you did what you did. Um, so I said to him that I didn't get any education on this topic. I. In my thesis, uh, I just did something learning on internet, et cetera, but I didn't get any, um, base education on this topic so I need someone to guide me. I'm looking for, um, my master and he said, okay. 

In the second meeting, uh, he wanted me to prepare a project, uh, based on my performance. I will get a chance to apply. I finished my project and email, but he was kind of person that don't answer emails. Meanwhile, I was accepted by two other universities. I dunno why, but I see him as someone that I can trust, but I was totally wrong. Anyway, uh, I sent so many emails to myself, to him. Eventually he wrote something like this. Uh, you are a person who tries to do a given test properly. Is determined by technically needs to move forward. However, I think it will not cause any problems with study. So then I, I applied, accepted government accepted me, a university accepted me in the interview. Supervisor accepted me. So, um, let's start .

Our courses was removed. Uh, however, I went to Institute for a journal club and was going meet with my friends, uh, my team friends. Uh, we were supposed to meet with each other. I expected that they will introduce themselves. Ask my name, myth[?] With me, ask about my background, et cetera. Just some friendly talking, but it didn't happen. They were really cold people. After journal club I went our teams room supervisor came too. Uh, he started to talk with his students. They got along very well in a kind of manner that I don't have any idea. Supervisor, um, open potato chips package. He offered to everyone in the room. I politely said that I didn't want, um, he asked why; I said that I have a high intolerance to lactose and I cannot eat packaged foods. Then very interestingly, he got very closer to my ear, very closer and started to eat potato chips there. It was not nice at all, but I thought that probably this was how they make jokes. Um, because I can't understand jokes most of the time. And I. even can't understand why they are made. Um, while he was eating chips. I, he wanted me to ask a question to him. I asked, uh, why he put advanced statistics in the first term while introductory statistics in the second term, he started to laugh again and with his students and said, oh, did I really do this? Oh my God. And last lovely. Um, In the period of this course choice he didn't say anything to me. Um, so these two courses actually was his own courses, but he didn't warn me. He accepted my course choices and not surprisingly, I couldn't succeed because I was almost your own statistics. And this course what was advanced, I said to him, I wish you would inform me at the beginning, but I will, uh, I said that I will fail in this course and take first of all the introductory course and take this course again later. He said, OK.

Uh, one day he called me to his room, uh, take a white paper in front of him, asked me, do you know this topic. I said, no, he wrote the paper. Do you know, this topic. I said, no; he wrote the paper. Uh, he wrote so many topics that I didn't know about. And he said, okay, go and study them. You should be ready because you are here to do my job. I will do my job. Uh, you will do my job, then I will be able to look something else. Um, I didn't like this attitude at all. I didn't study, I couldn't study what he gave me because this is not the way that I can study. Uh, But eventually he started to get angry with me. Uh, these times I was wondering so much about ADHD, uh, because my psychologist thought that I have. She was, um, nervous because uh, she also got a diagnosis for a while ago and she told me about the common traits that we share. And then I started to study so deeply on ADHD in a kind of manner that hyperfocus . I was collecting my traits to tell all of them to my psychiatrist. Uh, the hospital that I'm going is a medical hospital of Istanbul for, of medicine of Istanbul university. So doctors are working there with rotation, for education. Each doctor see patients for just one month. Uh, when I went to hospital for ADHD evauation , this was maybe the only chance that I have got in my whole life because doctor was a child psychiatrist She evaluated me. It was the 24th of December 2021 I diagnosed with ADHD . Gave me a drug after this session. She said she wanted to see again, very soon. I thought that she will probably ask me whether the drugs work or not. 

I told, um, my diagnosis to my supervisor, I was waiting some understanding, but instead he said that, um, a man without hands cannot be a Shoemaker and no matter how much he wants. But if he works hard, he can become a marathon runner. Maybe he [you] should try another sector. I. Trying to explain that ADHD is not a kind of attention deficit, actually. It's a problem of regularizing of pay attention wherever we can focus, whatever we do more than neurotypicals. But he didn't seem to understand at all. And maybe didn't listen at all. Um, it was 12th of January. I went to a hospital again, I told my psychiatrist that, um, about this, uh, supervisor's unpleasant behavior. And she told me to relax because she said no one had right to kick me out of the schools. I informed her about the effect of drug. Then she asked me tons of questions I didn't understand because these questions was not related with medicine or ADHD. After this session she just said that she wanted to invite me to their department community meeting with the justification of I was their patient for long and she wanted, uh, her professor also evaluate me. Then I said, okay, but this wasn't seem normal to me after going home. I checked each, each question and still didn't understand and what is them about? I Google check [unintelligible] five, watch videos, one thing, but I got shocked.

Me? Autism? Is that possible? Then the face to face community meeting the professor who is the head of the psychiatric department of the hospital, and almost all psychs of the hospital was there approximately 20, 30 doctors. And this time professor asked me so many questions and all of them evaluated. I shared my bad language too, because I sit to someone, uh, after the meeting, my own psych took me her room and explained that I'm autistic. Uh, it was 26th of January this year. Uh, so, and my age is 29. It's surprising. 

[00:12:55] Peter: So, uh, it it's, let me, let me interrupt just, just for a minute, because I, I, I am, I am grateful to you for telling your story. I have, I have a couple of questions that I, I think my audience would wanna know are on the answer to as well. What, what did you, when you were told by your professor that a Shoemaker cannot make shoes, if he doesn't have hands, how did that make you feel? 

[00:13:15] Gokcen: Terrible because you feel like you don't have an ability to think, have an ability, don't have an ability to do something. Uh, you don't have a brain. You cannot think, you cannot be a scientist. Uh, these are, these are incredibly bad things. And, uh, you know what happens in after he said all this to me, I started to cry very deeply and he just look at me with a cold face and it was really horrible. 

[00:13:54] Peter: When you let's fast forward to when you were accepted into your new program? Um, I'm I was curious, you didn't mention this. Did you at all, at any point, go back to this professor and tell him that you were, that you made into this new program? 

[00:14:08] Gokcen: Uh, no, I didn't. I didn't. 

[00:14:11] Peter: Do you have any desire to do that? 

[00:14:14] Gokcen: Uh, actually, I have a really big desire to tell him, um, in a, in maybe I know government education department or something. I really don't want to see him again anymore.

[00:14:30] Peter: Right. I understand that. It just seems to me that, that I think there's, you know, for what he's done and had the way he did it, uh, there should be some consequences for him. Um, you know, that's a, obviously a bigger story, but I do think that that's something you shouldn't, shouldn't just let go. 

[00:14:45] Gokcen: Um, and I will tell, um, more about what he did. Actually. There is so much bad things too, and it's coming. 

[00:14:55] Peter: Well, let's focus. Let's focus on the positives for a second. So let's fast forward to the point where you were accepted into the new program. Yes. What have you noticed? What have you noticed about yourself since your diagnosis? What types of things that you used to think were negatives are, do you now understand to be positives and things like that?

[00:15:14] Gokcen: Uh, could you repeat the question again, please? 

[00:15:17] Peter: Um, now that you're diagnosed, you know, for instance, I'll give you an example. My, uh, my ability to, to multitask I realize is a, is a positive, but when I was in school, uh, it was framed as not being able to pay attention. And so I thought it was a negative. Yes. Right. Once I was diagnosed with ADHD, I realized that it could be a positive. So I'm, I'm curious as to what sort of things that, that you might have thought of as bad things, um, have you since maybe sort of rethought of as possibly good things now that you understand sort of where your, how your brain works. 

[00:15:53] Gokcen: Um, actually, there are lots of things like that until to the diagnosis I always thought that I am weird because everybody in your environment say that you are weird. And when they say until that age, when everybody say this, eventually you also believe them. Um, but I actually, without thinking them, I was already happy in my inside. I couldn't show it to the people, but I was happy too inside because I was, um, I love, uh, in, in a way that what makes me Gokcen and everything. Every trait of autism or ADHD, give me that they are my traits and this is, these are my parts. And I love myself. Uh, but after diagnosis, I can say it loudly that I love myself. 

[00:16:54] Peter: I think that that in itself is an amazing story right there. The fact that you've been able to; understanding sort of how your brain works has allowed you to be kinder to yourself, right? 

[00:17:04] Gokcen: Sure. Because I able to make this master thesis, which is very, uh, hard actually in that time, I didn't know any knowledge about machine learning and I apply and even I created my own data set. Uh, examining more than, uh, 450 articles. This was a huge job. And needs a really strong attention. So this is why ADHD is my superpower and autism, my superpower. Um, yes. 

[00:17:44] Peter: What would you tell, what would you tell students or people who were in your position who might have been told that they were broken as well? What would you, what advice would you give to them? 

[00:17:55] Gokcen: Um, the thing that really saved my life is, um, just accept yourself as you are, because you are incredible, whatever other people say. Um, And be always kind. This is for everyone. Uh, as Robin Williams said, this, the quote that I love so much: Everyone you meet is fighting a battle you know, nothing about. Be kind, always. Because until the time of the diagnosis, I had so many tons of psychological problems. I even stay one month in mental health hospital, like a prison. I suicide twice, uh, heavy drugs. Therapies, tons of therapies. None of them worked. Everybody thought that you are not normal. You just want, don't want to be alive. But, um, but this is not true. Because if you can discover yourself, this is a gift, not a curse. Yeah. And after diagnosing all of the psychological problems just gone away. And I just right now use just one drug and this is for, to, to make it gradually decrease. Uh, and very soon that I will give up all the medicines I will take none of them. 

[00:19:26] Peter: That is wonderful. What a great, what a great story. I love that, you know, when I saw your original tweet, I was sort of blown away about how anyone could be that sort of close-minded, um, especially in education where you're supposed to have an open mind, you're supposed to, uh, embrace that. But, um, it seems to me Gokcen that you've definitely come out on top of this, that you have, you have come out the winner in this story, and I hope that you keep writing and I hope that you keep tweeting and keep sharing your story with the world because you're an inspiration. 

[00:19:54] Gokcen: Thank you so much. Uh, what happened lastly, I wanna share with you. I told my new supervisor about a bit about my situation, and she said; uh, you have had a bad experience, but, uh, don't be discouraged. I'm sure that, uh, you will be much more happier in here. Uh, there are bad peoples in the world, but fortunately they're good ones too. I am grateful to her. Uh, but when I said that I'm grateful she to accepted me, she said that I didn't do anything. You deserve it. We evaluated you as we did to all students. And you deserve it. This is so precious because people pity you uh, about your autism about your ADHD, and this is especially so in my country. But my dear supervisor treated me like she tries to everyone and she didn't show sympathy because I'm autistic. She said I was accepted because I deserved; this is so precious.

[00:21:00] Peter: I love that. I love that. What a wonderful story. Gokcen, Thank you so much for taking the time. My pleasure. Give us your, give us your Twitter account so people can follow you. 

[00:21:09] Gokcen: Uh, sure. Um, my, my, uh, name with, uh, letters, uh, G K C N S H N. This is my Twitter. Thank you so much. 

[00:21:21] Peter: This. Awesome. Thank, thank you so much for taking the time. We're definitely gonna have you back in several months to talk about, to give us an update on what's going on. 

[00:21:28] Gokcen: Thank you so much. You can. 

[00:21:30] Peter: All right guys, as always, thanks for listening to fast than normal. We will see you next week with a brand new episode. Hopefully I'll be back in my office and not in our hotel room and we will talk to you soon. Stay safe, stay well. 

 

Credits: You've been listening to the Faster Than Normal podcast. We're available on iTunes, Stitcher and Google play and of course at www.FasterThanNormal.com I'm your host, Peter Shankman and you can find me at shankman.com and @petershankman on all of the socials. If you like what you've heard, why not head over to your favorite podcast platform of choice and leave us a review, come more people who leave positive reviews, the more the podcast has shown, and the more people we can help understand that ADHD is a gift, not a curse. Opening and closing themes were composed and produced by Steven Byrom who also produces this podcast, and the opening introduction was recorded by Bernie Wagenblast. Thank you so much for listening. We'll see you next week!

Aug 17, 2022

Ashley Brown teaches Coastal Kayaking, Stand Up Paddleboarding, and Instructor Development at the College of Charleston. She has developed these paddlesports courses over the past decade to include Sustainability Literacy and a First Year Experience course with a Biology class. Learning about sustainability and sharing it with the students led Ashley to start a Masters of Art at Prescott College in Outdoor Education Leadership. She only has a few more classes before she finishes her degree. Ashley shares her passion for teaching kayaking at all levels and challenging people to test their limits while learning and having a ton of fun. She has been developing a curriculum in Kayaking, SUP, and Instructor Development at the College of Charleston, where Ashley serves as an Adjunct Professor.  Ashley is the recipient of the American Canoe Association 2019 Excellence in Instruction Award.  This award is presented annually to an ACA member for outstanding contributions to paddlesports education and instruction. She earned the prestigious Level 5 American Canoe Association Advanced Open Water Coastal Kayaking Instructor Certification and is also an ACA Level 4 Kayak Instructor Trainer, Canoe Instructor, and L2 Standup Paddleboard Instructor. Ashley serves as a member of the executive committee of the Safety, Education, and Instruction Committee for the American Canoe Association. She loves to travel and has gone from Canada to Mexico and beyond, sharing her talent and knowledge with clubs, groups, schools, outfitters, events, and symposiums. Residing in Charleston, SC, she enjoys welcoming guests from all over the world to paddle in Charleston’s beautiful waterways.  One of her favorite venues is the “Edge of America”, the Atlantic Ocean off Folly Beach.  She provides paddlers an opportunity to have an exciting experience and widen their perspectives. Today we’re talking about how and why she got diagnosed, how an ADHD/ADD brain can often serve as a prerequisite, and what being buoyant may do for the ADHD in you! Enjoy!

—— 

In this episode Peter and Ashley discuss:  

00:45 - Thank you so much for listening and for subscribing!

00:50 - Apologies for the near horrid audio- Peter is in a tourist-filled lobby today.

01:05 - Intro and welcome Ashley Brown!

01:53 - When were you first diagnosed and how did it happen?

03:00 - What was the first big change you felt after your diagnosis?

03:56 - What inspired you to seek out aquatic sports & activities; and to teach them?

05:33 - Do you experience sort of a rebirth every time you go kayaking; like I do when skydiving or running?

06:00 - On the good kind of exhaustion and a completely focused flow. 

07:18 - How does scanning a wave, being outdoors and on the water help your ADHD?

08:56 - I had never thought of ADHD/ADD as a requirement for something! For what else could ADHD possibly be a prerequisite?

09:40 - On the importance of physical movement!

11:30 - How can people find more about you? [Ashley isn’t a public figure but you can check into her courses via Web: www.wavepaddler.com and on their Facebook page here]

12:34 - Guys, as always thanks so much for subscribing! Do you have a cool friend with a great story? We’d love to hear. I'm www.petershankman.com and you can reach out anytime via email at peter@shankman.com or @petershankman on all of the socials. You can also find us at @FasterNormal on all of the socials. It really helps when you drop us a review on iTunes and of course, subscribe to the podcast if you haven’t already! As you know, the more reviews we get, the more people we can reach. Help us to show the world that ADHD is a gift, not a curse! 

19:08 - Faster Than Normal Podcast info & credits 

TRANSCRIPT via Descript and then corrected.. somewhat:

[00:00:38] Peter Shankman good morning. I am coming to you today from the lounge at a Hilton in Midtown Manhattan because, uh, my apartment was supposed to be finished two weeks ago for all my renovations and it's not, and I am living the Dylan McKay life here in New York Hilton in Midtown. For those not old enough to understand what the Dylan McKee lifestyle is? Well, look it up. Your parents knew. Anyway, welcome to another episode Faster Than Normal. Uh, I apologize in advance for all the background noise. Ashley Brown is joining us today. Ashley, get this we're going outdoors today, even though I'm sitting in a lounge in mid Manhattan, we're going outdoors. The great big ocean. to the coast. We're gonna talk to Ashley Brown who teaches coastal kayaking standup paddle boarding and instructed development of the college of Charleston. She's ADHD. She's developed these paddle sports courses over the past decade to include sustainability literacy and her first year experience course to the biology class. This is a very, very cool stuff. She got diagnosed when her kid did, as we hear so much about .Ashley, welcome to Faster Than Normal. Let's talk about some outdoors and how it relates to ADHD. 

[00:01:39] Ashley: Hi! Hi, thank you so much for having me. And, um, I am really excited to talk to you. I've enjoyed listening to your podcast and I have to admit I'm a bit nervous. I hope that I hope this goes well. 

[00:01:51] Peter: . You're gonna be, you're gonna be fine. Don't worry about it. So tell me when you tell me when you first got diagnosed and how did it happen? 

[00:01:56] Ashley: Um, my daughter was in around third grade and, um, she had hit like unbelievable benchmarks in, in, in intelligence as a, as a little kid, you know, when they do those, pull you out, testing things to put 'em in gifted and talented and stuff. And then suddenly she couldn't read, you know, she wasn't reading, uh, at her, at her pace had had had just stopped. So we discovered that she had dyslexia and, uh, ADHD, and, uh, as we are moving through all those, those categories, I'm going, yep. That's me. That's me. That's me. And of course, this is something that, um, I, I understand a lot of adults have had that experience. So, so I got diagnosed when she got diagnosed and, uh, same thing, dyslexia, ADHD, and, uh, it's, it's interesting to hit it at, you know, 40 versus eight, you know, so 

[00:02:55] Peter: I was gonna say, so you lived your life, not knowing anything about it, sort of similar to the way I did. I didn't get diagnosed in my late thirties and, um, what was the, what was sort of the first cha big changes that you saw in yourself once you, once you got that diagnosis? 

[00:03:06] Ashley: Um, changes in myself, I guess, I guess maybe just like forgiving myself for being me, I don't know. Um, like suddenly.

[00:03:20] Peter: That's actually a, that's a pretty huge answer. A pretty huge answer. Cause a lot of people don't realize that I, I went through the same thing.

[00:03:25] Ashley: Yeah, no, I, uh, I always just, you know, why can't you do your taxes on time? Why can't, why do you have to work at a de at a critical deadline? Like, why can't you do this ahead of time? Like, um, so many of. So many other things that ADHD, people struggle with. Like, um, and I, I guess I cut myself a little more slack, not enough, not, not enough, but a lot more slack than I used to. Like now I have a reason, you know?

[00:03:53] Peter: Well, we'll never cut ourselves enough slack that's for darn sure. But, okay. So tell me about how outdoors, how did you, first of all, how'd you get started in, in the classes of paddle boarding and kayak and all that, all that stuff outdoors. And what prompted you to say, Hey, there should be, there should be a school or classes.

[00:04:07] Ashley: Well, um, so it, the, all the school and the classes are there it's, um, I didn't create that, but I just brought it in a different venue. So, um, I, um, I was, I, my first career was an artist and an art teacher and I was, uh, teaching. and it, it just, it just, you know, it, it's a pretty punishing, um, field. Uh, and I, I, I never was super successful with it. And then teaching children and then having children, it was just so many children and so much mess in my life that I, uh, I had a neighbor who said, Hey, you should come kayaking. And I went kayaking with a bunch of adults who I didn't have to clean up after. And I was like, ah, I can do this. And I, um, I just made some, made some major changes and I really went. Uh, full force into kayaking and stand and, uh, and then loved it. And I live in a place I live in Charleston, South Carolina, and, um, there is nothing but water around here. So there's so many places to explore and so many, uh, dynamic environments to, uh, get to know. So, um, I shifted from teaching, uh, children to taking people on kayak tours and all this stuff. And then, um, I met an instructor with the College of Charleston and, and. Uh, opened up some doors to me and I, I ended up with a full-time job teaching, uh, paddle sports at, uh, college level. 

[00:05:31] Peter: I'm gonna go into a limb and say that paddle boarding or paddle sports or anything like that is similar for the brain as skydiving or running is for me. Would that be correct? Are you, is it a rebirth for you every time you do. 

[00:05:42] Ashley: Rebirth. Hmm. I don't know. I don't know, rebirth and it, and it, and it is exciting and fun. And particularly when you do surf, so I'm guessing that skydiving and, and actually hearing that crashing wave behind you kind of stuff is this is similar.

[00:05:57] Peter: Tell me how you feel when you're done. You come back to land. 

[00:05:59] Ashley: The good exhaustion. Just space, that's it? Yeah. That's yeah. Um, so, and, and when I, when I bring people into it, I love their, uh, reaction to it. And I love the layering cuz. And I think that this is one of the things that I was that I wrote to you and the reason I wanted to, to talk to you, and I think that the layering of, of understanding the environment and watching the student and understanding where the student is is, has it. It it's that flow, right? Where you, where your brain is working on all the levels in the environment you're in. This is, this is probably the only thing I've ever done, where I wasn't also having a conversation with, you know, somebody from a year ago and writing a grocery list, you know, at all three going on at the same time. So, so it is the only place where my entire, where all of my attention is, is layered into there. So, so I love that. And then that puts me in that good exhaustion.

[00:06:56] Peter: Well, there's a level of focus there, right? I mean, you absolutely, you have no choice. You have to look at what you're doing. You have to focus on what you're doing. You have to pay attention to what you're doing. You can't do a hundred of those things. It's the same thing with skydiving and, and for people with ADHD, we don't often realize that we realize that is the, the level at which we thrive! 

[00:07:11] Ashley: Right. Exactly. Exactly. It's um, it is definitely the level where you thrive.

[00:07:18] Peter: Tell me about, um, how it helps, how doing that helps your ADHD. Tell me about, uh, sort of how your brain reacts to that kinda stuff to, to being outdoors, to being on the water, to, to scanning the wave. 

[00:07:29] Ashley: Okay. Um, so, so I came in to ADHD later, I did not understand the dopamine thing. Um, Prior to it, but now I understand and I, and I seek the, and I identify the things that give me that pleasure, that dopamine rush. So sometimes you're bored out of your mind of course, but then when you, when you can find the things that are giving you pleasure, like the, like moving very quickly through the water or looking at a reflection of a surface and, and, um, and so seeking those things has, or, or, you know, seeking that experience through somebody else's experience. So I'm watching, I'm watching 20 year olds figure out how to make their body work in a new way and how to make a boat, move, move through waves and stuff in a, in a, um, in a, something that they're not familiar with. It is, it is exciting in, and then that really does feed the, um, that dopamine receptor, I suppose. And, um, gives me a pleasure that, that, uh, I don't know that I, that I, I guess I had is with an art with art, but I had gotten so done with it with art. But anyway, um.

[00:08:40] Peter: That's a good answer. I wanna read something that you wrote in, in your email to me, you said, I think that or ADHD is practically a requirement for outdoor educators. They problem solve on the go keep people safe while putting them in intentionally risky situations and manage their expectations to keep it engaging, but not scary. You know, I've never thought of it that way. ADHD is a requirement for something, right. We always look at it as a gift and, and, and something beneficial. I've never thought it as a requirement. I wonder what other things a ADD could be a requirement for? What do you think? 

[00:09:08] Ashley: Um, gosh, I don't know. Um, the, the it's back to that multi layering thing, it's, it's, it's seeing some body and their process and a situation that needs your undivided attention as well. So probably teaching someone to skydive or teaching someone to do other things that are risky. Um, Ropes courses. Those are, yeah, those, 

[00:09:32] Peter: I mean, I think, I think along the lines that, that, you know, one of the things about ADD & ADHD is we have that incredible power to hyper focus. Right. Right. When we want to focus on something, we are there 100%. And I don't think that a lot of, a lot of people, without ADHD, really understand how that works. And so I think in that regard, it's probably very beneficial for us. Um, 

[00:09:50] Ashley: you know, and also the busy bodiness like the, the physical, um, Busyness is, is, uh, is key. So I think a lot of people that, that engage in that, like that come to an outdoor education experience and enjoy it, but don't want to be in it constantly. They need to think while sitting still or being still. And I, and I, I don't know how you are, but I never stop moving so it's a, it's a perfect thing for me to, to keep moving, to keep thinking. I, 

[00:10:22] Peter: I think it's the same it's same reason. Yeah. It makes perfect sense. It's the same reason that, you know, my, my parents always told me as a kid, no listening to music while you're studying, but it turns out that listening to music is actually the best possible thing. Someone like us could do. No question about.

[00:10:33] Ashley: Absolutely. And like, um, um, teaching kids. Well, my own children. Teaching kids like the multiplication tables or reading stories out loud or whatever, when they were tiny. If they, it, my, my little one was jumping around the whole time and, and I, and I would go, you know, what did I just say? And she could repeat it, back like just like word for word. But if I, you know, she just couldn't sit still to do that. So. No question. And, and I related to that, so I didn't try to get her to sit still. I went to Catholic school and I was required to sit still. So , 

[00:11:09] Peter: I went to school in the seventies and I was, yeah, in the seventies, it was sort of the same way. And lemme tell you something that didn't work really well for me either. No. And that was a public school too. 

[00:11:17] Ashley: Not a big fan of the sitting still 

[00:11:20] Peter: Ashley, how could people find out more? How can they find you? Do you have an Instagram, you have things where people could find your great, you sent me some great photos of paddle boarding and all that stuff. The places people could find this stuff?

[00:11:28] Ashley: Um, so I have a website wave paddler.com and, um, I am, I, I actually am not I'm, I'm not a public personality in the, in this, in the way that you are. I don't have something that I'm trying to convey to people. [Ashley isn’t a public figure but you can check into her courses via Web: www.wavepaddler.com and on their Facebook page here] Um, I just loved your show and I wanted to talk with you. And, uh, and, um, I don't know. I really do appreciate my ADHD!

[00:11:51] Peter: Good enough. Yeah. As you should, we're trying to change the world. Not everyone has to be a celebrity and everyone has to be, uh, famous. We could be like, you know, regular normal people, just, just doing the best they can with the tools that they've been given. Ashley Brown. Thank you so much for sticking around and coming on the show and, uh, stay on the water and keep having fun!

[00:12:07] Ashley: Thank you. You too! Come and paddle with me sometime. 

[00:12:09] Peter: Most certainly will. Guys, as always, we've been listening the fast than normal. Sorry again about the background. Apparently every loud person, who's a tourist in New York happens to be in this lounge right at this very moment. But I'm hoping that the next time we talk, I'll be back in my apartment where it's much quieter. We will see you next week. If you like what you heard, leave us a review in any of the stations, any of the places you download your podcasts. My name is Peter Shankman  @PeterShankman all the socials. And thank you for listening. We'll see you next week. ADHD is a gift not a curse.

Credits: You've been listening to the Faster Than Normal podcast. We're available on iTunes, Stitcher and Google play and of course at www.FasterThanNormal.com I'm your host, Peter Shankman and you can find me at shankman.com and @petershankman on all of the socials. If you like what you've heard, why not head over to your favorite podcast platform of choice and leave us a review, come more people who leave positive reviews, the more the podcast has shown, and the more people we can help understand that ADHD is a gift, not a curse. Opening and closing themes were composed and produced by Steven Byrom who also produces this podcast, and the opening introduction was recorded by Bernie Wagenblast. Thank you so much for listening. We'll see you next week!

Aug 3, 2022

André Brisson, P. Eng., is the host of The Impulsive Thinker Podcast, the podcast for the high-achieving ADHD entrepreneur. Andre owns an entrepreneurial consulting engineering company and recently started Tactical Breakthroughs where he is developing the ADHDTransformation Journey program. Diagnosed late in life with severe ADHD and mild Asperger’s(ASD), the mechanisms and systems he created to overcome his undiagnosed ADHD havehelped him succeed. He credits his undiagnosed ADHD as key to his success and a factor in restricting success. Since discovering how to turn his ADHD into a strength, people havesought him out for help with using their ADHD as a strength to drive success. André Brisson has a special ability is devouring and learning complex information and simplifying for others to solve complex problems. Like most entrepreneurs, André has started multiple companies, the two of which failed for various reasons. Learning from those failures, André now operates three very successful companies, including a self-managing entrepreneurial engineering firm specializing in niche markets that require unique training, experience, and impulsive instinct to try new things. Enjoy!

In this episode Peter and Andre discuss:  

00:45 - Thank you so much for listening and for subscribing!

00:48 - Welcome Andre Brisson!

02:40 - What is your success key for imparting complex information to the neurotypical? Ref: Ringette

04:15 - Simplifying the complex

05:06 - On the differences between informing and teaching

05:30 - When did you get diagnosed and what brought all that about?

06:02 - On inventing a “character” for yourself to be perceived as “not abnormal”.

07:00 - On then importance of being unique 

07:45 - You said you were beginning to scare your kids- can you go into details on that? Ref: emotional dysregulation

09:55 - Have you ever bought anything strictly on impulse? Tell us in the comments! ;-)

11:00 - Parenting with ADHD/mild Asperger’s prior to a diagnosis

12:20 - So when you got diagnosed, what was the treatment plan? Ref: DBT, CBT Executive Function What is Time Blindness?

13:36 - On learning your strengths and maintaining, managing and delegating what’s not best for you. Aka Peter’s “life rules”

15:15 - A bit more on delegating and staying in the lane, on the road.

16:38 - How can people find more about you? Email:  andre@andreb.ca

André Brisson

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/andre.brisson.1447/

LinkedIN: https://www.linkedin.com/in/andrebrisson/

Twitter: @fatrol

Website: www.andreb.ca

Objective Engineering Inc.

Website: www.objectiveeng.ca

Tactical Breakthroughs

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/TacticalBTs

LinkedIN: https://www.linkedin.com/company/tactical-breakthroughs/

Twitter: @tacticalbts

Website: www.tacticalbts.com

The Impulsive Thinker Podcast

Facebook : https://www.facebook.com/impulsivethinkerpodcast

LinkedIN: https://www.linkedin.com/company/impulsive-thinker-podcast/

Twitter: @impulsivthinker

Website: www.theimpulsivethinker.com

16:51 - Andre, thank you so much!  Ref: Faster Than Normal the book!

17:75 - Thank you. Guys, as always thanks so much for subscribing! Do you have a cool friend with a great story? We’d love to hear. I'm www.petershankman.com and you can reach out anytime via email at peter@shankman.com or @petershankman on all of the socials. You can also find us at @FasterNormal on all of the socials. It really helps when you drop us a review on iTunes and of course, subscribe to the podcast if you haven’t already! As you know, the more reviews we get, the more people we can reach. Help us to show the world that ADHD is a gift, not a curse! 

19:08 - Faster Than Normal Podcast info & credits 

TRANSCRIPT via Descript and then corrected.. somewhat:

[00:00:38] Hey everyone, Peter. Shankman welcome to the episode of Faster Than Normal. I'm thrilled that you're here. It is great to have you again, we have a fun guest today. I'm gonna start with his tagline because his tagline pretty much says everything ;it's simplifying your complexities, which I think is just the best description I've ever heard of someone who works with people with A D D ADHD, people who are. ADHD. I love that. It's just so clear. Andre, Brisson and I, I screwed it up. I tried my was really hard to get. That was good. Was good's the host of the Impulsive Thinker podcast, very similar to FTN. Podcast for high achieving ADHD entrepreneurs. He owns an entrepreneur consulting engineering company, and recently started another company called Tactical Breakthroughs where he's developing an ADHD transformation journey program. He was diagnosed later in life with severe ADHD and mild Asperger's and the mechanisms and systems he created much like the stuff I did to overcome his undiagnosed ADHD have helped him succeed and he credits his undiagnosed as a key to his success and a factor in restricting success as well. So that's ING to discover, um, Since discovering how to turn his ADHD into a strength people have out for help using their ADHD as well.\ You talk in your bio about how you have special ability for taking complex information and simplifying for others and first thought, when I heard that was something that happened with me. And I think my mom, like five years ago when she got a new iPhone and she was having a problem doing like four things. And so I just went over there. The their, my parents' apartment. And I'm like, here, gimme the phone done. Dun dun dun. She's like, great, but I didn't learn how to do it. Right. Right. And I realized I'm terrible at taking complex information that I understand and teaching people how to understand it. I just want to do it and get it done. That's an ADHD thing. So let's, let's start there. What is, what is your sort of success key there where you actually have the ability and the, the patience or whatever it is to take that information and simplify it down so other people can learn it as opposed to just doing it for them. 

[00:02:55] Andre: Well, the, to me, that's the key difference is I don't do it for them. I've always helped people understand, break down something complex into simple steps or layman terms so that they can act on it. And then they can think about it differently to act on it at a future time. Um, like for example, and on in Canada here, we have Ringette. It's a, it's a, it's a sport on ice for women. So basically they got a rubber ring with a spear, their stick. And I, I referee then I was in an evaluator and, uh, an officially evaluator. So what I actually did was I always asked them what's. The rule, like usually you guys say this occurred, this occurred that I call it right or not. So I go by and says, what's the rule. The rule says this. And then we break down the steps of what occurred and apply the actual rule to those steps. So I step it out for people so that they can understand it. And if you don't understand the first way, I tackle it at a different angle until they get it. And what I'm trying to teach them is stepping out the thought process to come with their own conclusions, with the facts that they know they already had. And didn't realize it. Okay. 

[00:04:04] Peter: That makes sense. Yeah, it does. It does. It's interesting. Cause that, that takes patience and, and that's one of the few things that most people with ADHD simply don't have anywhere near half of.

[00:04:15] Andre: Mm-hmm yeah. The thing is a lot of times I can simplify that complex information. So someone understands it and so that they can act on it and I can make it real. So usually I, I I'm able to connect something that's in their life or someone else's life or mine. And that's what I do a lot on the podcast is this is a snare that happened. It kind of happened to me. And then people, once you make it real people seem to click with it better. 

[00:04:39] Peter: Yeah. Makes sense. And, and yeah, I mean, that's, that's a, a, you know, my keynote speaking trait, you tell stories that people have people who relate to and all of a sudden, it's not some guy on stage talking about something foreign, it's something. Oh yeah. I get that. 

[00:04:51] Andre: Yeah. I. I had a chat today with two different people. We, I kind of, I blurted this out and I thought it was pretty smart now to think about it now, but I think there's a difference between informing to understand versus educating, to teach. So if, and for me, I was talking about advocacy as you know, I, I stopped educating people. I just tried to inform people so they can understand adult ADHD and the differences. 

[00:05:17] Peter: That makes a lot of sense. I think that also the more informed they are, the more they feel like they can have a handle on it, as opposed to. I guess educating. Yeah. Yeah. They might not necessarily get, no. That makes sense. Tell us about, um, your background. You said you were late, you were late, uh, diagnosed how late? 

[00:05:36] Andre: Uh, about four years ago when I was 44. Oh, wow. Um, and then that was a, that was all because of a life Tempest. As I've been calling had three perfect storms collide at once. Um, got into a bad business partnership. I got bored with my first company once it got successful. So I S sabatoged that. Things weren't going well at home. And my Sy symptoms overtook me and controlled me for a couple of years to the point where my kids are just looking at me scared. And I said, I gotta get help. Huh. And got the diagnosis. I went actually to get the diagnosis to prove it wasn't ADHD. Cause I thought there was something worse, wrong with me. Because that diagnosis, like it was too simple of a solution to explain my last 44 years and develop a character that I became so I can fit in and not be looked as abnormal. And then, so I got really good at playing this character. Now I'm learning how to be me and to differentiate the two, because it almost became, you know, I almost, I brainwashed myself to believe that that was the person I was or shouldn't be.

[00:06:38] Peter: No, I get that. I mean, it's, it's, you know, fitting in and not being, uh, you know, and not sort of ever really fitting in with the crowd or with, with, uh, any group in, in school, you know, and that takes a toll. I don't think, I think we're just starting to realize what kind of toll that takes on people, um, and how much, uh, that that's re you know, those early forming, forming years are really responsible for sort of right. The kinda stuff you deal with. 

[00:07:03] Andre: And then I was overlooked because I was doing well in school. Like I'm also gifted. Um, and so since you're successful and you're doing well in school, you can't have it. You're just not doing what you're supposed to. You're not trying to hard enough for, you know, stop being unique. That was my favorite word. You're too unique to be part of this and I've always fought the right to be unique. And I always thought we should all, we're all different. I understood why we were always trained to say we're everyone's alike, but we're not. We're all unique.

[00:07:35] Peter: So what, when you get, I'm curious, you mentioned something, you said, um, you said you had symptoms that were starting to, uh, that were starting to scare your kids. Ex can you go into detail on that? 

[00:07:47] Andre: Oh, emotional dysregulation times 2 million. Um, it didn't take much to spark me off. And then all I would do was I'd just be screaming at them for something silly. And when I started being cognizant of a screaming at them, for being silly, my brain was actually saying, Hey buddy, you're overreacting here. You should stop. And then I got the other part of my brain going, eh, forget it. Let's keep going. I'm already into it. Um, so when I saw those look in their eyes, it gave me a. It scared me cuz I saw myself. Um, there when I was a child and that's when I said no, no more, no more. So I went and got help. So the emotional dysregulation definitely took over, um, and enforced, uh, and then my impulsivity and the no filter uh, aspect of my brain having no filter, just my impulsivity, my ver my words would just come out and I just started not caring anymore. And that's when I said that, that, that the symptoms took over, um, impulsive bias, impulsive business partnerships, knowing that it was not going to be good. Um, and for me, I realized with time, since my diagnosis, I have a fear of being idle and when I get bored, that's when I could become dangerous. And that's when, so my physical hyperactivity, even at, as an adult kicks in, if I'm bored and then what happened was with my other company, once the startup phase was done and we're successful in maintaining success and having good gradual growth, I was bored. The, the entertainment, the interest was gone. So I created chaos. Impulsively trying this, trying that in muscle dysregulation, continuing. Um, and, and then just going on with the inattention, not caring, I had a really great point and it just escaped me. It'll come back to that's yeah.

[00:09:46] Peter: I mean, that's that happens all the time. You, you go down the route, press rabbit, home, like, wait, my original point was like five feet away from that. Yeah. Um, I think that probably, I think every episode

[00:09:55] Andre: and the impulsivity of buying stuff. You know, spending sling money, losing cash flow, all that type of stuff. That was it. 

[00:10:03] Peter: It's interesting. I've never, I, I, I, I understand that. And I get that. I I'm fortunate. I don't think it ever, I never went down that rabbit hole too much, but I've certainly made impulse. I mean, you know, mm-hmm, virtually everything I've ever bought in my life has been impulse by, I, I do you wind up doing research on the product you bought after you bought it?

[00:10:22] Andre: um, No. I usually do all the research ahead of time. So I know what I'm buying is good is just deciding to do it. Like the one was, Hey, we got a bunch of cash in the bank account. Um, I've been looking at building a server. This is quite a few years ago getting a server for the office. We got a big team, so I'm just gonna blow 40 grand right now, rather on a finance plan. Um, cuz at the same time I didn't care. Um, which was part of it, which was the interest part. Um, but the other thing too Peter. I think that I think a lot of people are getting diagnosed later in life. And for me, I never realized this about two years ago was. It really started to take control. My symptoms. When I had kids, when they disrupted my, my rhythm at home, my routine at home, that was my calm down time. When I got home, I could rejuvenate and now having being stuck, cuz you're scheduled being disrupted all the time. Cuz kids just want to be with you. They just wanna last minute try different things and no, no, I like, I just sat down, I'm ready to do a bunch of stuff and now you're disrupting me. So that's when I think it started to steamroll the effects of these symptoms. 

[00:11:35] Peter: I totally totally get that. It's it's a, having a kid. I got diagnosed before I had my daughter, but it was Def it's definitely a, um, you know, you sort of, you get this vibe where it's like, okay, uh, dinner's over, you know, I have an hour till I have to put her to bed, I'm gonna, you know, I'm gonna sit down and breathe and just whatever. And then it's like, dad play with me. And of course I, I will, but it took a while to sort of, uh, be able to focus entirely. Right, right. And 

[00:12:01] Andre: not oh, huge. You know? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And then you feel shitty as a, as a parent, cuz you can't give your full attention or you're always thinking, how can I get outta this? I , how can go back to what I was doing exactly. Cause I need to get that done. I gotta get it done. What's going on? Right? 

[00:12:14] Peter: No question about it. So when, so when you got diagnosed, what, what was the, uh, what was the treatment plan? Was it medication? Was it, .

[00:12:22] Andre: We, uh, tried medication, uh, I think I'm part of that 20% that doesn't work well. Um, but I think the, some of the medication I was on at that time, I needed it just to settle and almost had stopped my brain for a while so I can just catch my breath and take everything in. And then, um, Slowly got off of it. Um, but for me, the big thing is I just hyper-focused for a good year and a half on learning everything I could about ADHD interesting and simplifying it. And that's why I tell people like educating yourself the effects and then is huge. And then I was part of therapy group therapy. Now I'm just finishing up my dialectal behavioral therapy. I've done cognitive behavioral therapy, ah, even the group therapy on how to have fun. But it was a neurotypical direction, but anyways, um, a lot of talking with similar people helped. And then for me to simplify ADHD down to, I think it's its core, it's an executive functioning dysfunction and time blindness. Those two affects the, the, the, the DSM symptoms of inattention hyperactivity, impulsivity, and inattention. Um, that made a lot of sense to me. And then at the same time, shortly before my ADHD diagnosis, I got diagnosed with type two diabetes. And that's when I realized I can't get rid of it. Like I diabetes, I can't get rid of it. Nothing I can do can cure it, but I can manage it and extend my life. And that's what I saw with ADHD. .Manage the symptoms so I can work well. And I had a mantra my whole time for a long time saying your strengths can become your weaknesses. And when I put that together with my ADHD symptoms, as long as I can manage my symptoms, That's how, why I succeed as an entrepreneur and those are my strengths, but if I let them go be overutilized or underutilized and then become my strengths. And that's when I say ADHD can become a disorder, is when they're impeding your day to day.

[00:14:23] Peter: I agree. I, I think it's another way of saying, you're saying the same thing that I say a different way, which is, you know, you have to have. These life rules that you can't deviate from because you know, you, your brain works a certain way. And so you put these right pro processes into place that allow you to utilize it to your best ability. Mm-hmm . And if you, if you deviate from that, you're gonna go off the road. 

[00:14:42] Andre: Right. And, and then the other thing I discovered too, so for, I don't know, I can't do math. I'm an engineer. I need a calculator here. Um, so about a good 20 years, all I did was read all the self-help books. I've taken almost every assessment out there to identify strengths, but my therapist actually said you were doing all that to find out what was wrong with you to concentrate on what's not good enough to build on. So with my diagnosis, I took there's three good tools that I use that really identifies my talents and strengths. And. Take those. And I help people with these assessments too, to understand what's your unique strength and talent. So if we could just stay in those abilities, Then it's easy to hyperfocus and you're having a lot of fun and you're not, and don't waste your time on things you're not good at and you don't like doing that. So as an entrepreneur, it's handy, you, you got staff, you can have people, you delegate a lot of those, but I help people understand what their unique talents and strengths are, where they should be spending their time, where they can get a lot of energy and enjoyment every day, be creative and then have a team around you that just take care of the stuff you don't like.

[00:15:50] Peter: That's a hundred percent given you, have you have someone or people to do the stuff that you're terrible at? I mean, that's, you know, for 14 years now, I've had, I've had my assistant, it's a game changer. 

[00:16:00] Andre: Yep. Like we got a minimal limited brain mental brain, uh, energy, right. Every day. And I think ADHD, we just have a really good ability to effectively use it to run all day, or we have a really great efficient way to inefficiently use our mental energy and at the end of the day, it, so if we're starting to do things we don't like to do all day, then we're really, really burnt out at the end of the day. But if we can stay in that lane, man, you can do that seven days straight and not get, get tired.

[00:16:29] Peter: It's a great way to put it. It's a great way to close too. I wanna keep us to our 20 minute mark. Uh, tell us how people could find you? 

[00:16:36] Andre: Uh, you can find me at, uh, Andre, Andre, b.ca I'll take anyone's email. Um, but you can find me on LinkedIn. Our tactical bts.com is another source. 

[00:16:47] Peter: We'll put all the, all the, all your links that you gave us. We'll put 'em in the, uh, in the podcast notes. Andre, thank you so much for taking the time. This was really, really informative. We're definitely gonna have you back, uh, at some point in the near future. 

[00:16:57] Andre: Well, I appreciate you having me, Peter. And, um, like I said, like, I don't think I said this, but, uh, yet till now, um, you're Faster Than Normal book. I actually bought it five years ago, thinking it was one how I can work faster. then I bought it again, uh, and read it. And then I found the other book, but I think I really liked your aspect too, that, you know, it's not a disorder. It's our, it's a, it's a very unique ability of doing things and to not thinking as a negative. And, and make it work. And I really, a lot of stuff in there I re not reflected it hit me. I can, I understand exactly what was in there. And it was also comforting to know what I created in the past. Unknowingly. I was on the right track. So I thought it was a really good book and I do recommend it to a lot of people.

[00:17:45] Peter: Thank you, man. That's a really, really kind of you. Guys as always, Faster Than Normal, We wanna hear what you're thinking. We wanna hear of any guests you might wanna hear from,  shoot us a, a email Peter@shankman.com. We're on all the socials. You know, our, our handles by now. Thank you for listening. We will see again next week with another guest, we appreciate you and know that ADHD and all forms of neurodiversity are gifts, not curses! We'll see you next week!

[00:19:08]Credits: You've been listening to the Faster Than Normal podcast. We're available on iTunes, Stitcher and Google play and of course at www.FasterThanNormal.com I'm your host, Peter Shankman and you can find me at shankman.com and @petershankman on all of the socials. If you like what you've heard, why not head over to your favorite podcast platform of choice and leave us a review, come more people who leave positive reviews, the more the podcast has shown, and the more people we can help understand that ADHD is a gift, not a curse. Opening and closing themes were composed and produced by Steven Byrom who also produces this podcast, and the opening introduction was recorded by Bernie Wagenblast. Thank you so much for listening. We'll see you next week!

Jul 27, 2022

Gili Malinsky is a lead work reporter at CNBC where she covers labor and employment law, U.S. work trends, and mental health. She has contributed to outlets including The New York Times, NBC News, MTV News, the Village Voice, and many others. She’s also a playwright, having written a parody of the D.A.R.E. program called “The Drugstoppers” and, most recently, written and performed a monologue called “This is My First ADHD Support Group” at the New York Theater Festival. The monologue is loosely based on her experience getting let go and fired many times before discovering she has ADHD. She’s planning to expand it into a full-length play also touching on anxiety and depression. Gili is an Aquarius, thank you for asking. This is another good and fun one, enjoy! 

In this episode Peter and Gili discuss:  

00:45 - Thank you so much for listening and for subscribing!

00:46 - Live again from the flop house…

01:21 - Welcome Gili Malinsky!

02:22 - Welcome fellow BU Alumn! When did you get diagnosed?

03:06 - Our stories are a little similar; what was it like for you growing up?

05:01 - What if we had known we had ADHD during college?

05:28 - Would Peter change anything about his life prior to his ADHD diagnosis?

06:16 - Would Gili change anything? How about her work experiences?

08:21 - Gili’s first ADHD epiphany about work, (via therapy)

09:20 - On finding her condition actually has a name; not alone in this!

09:45 - A note on self-forgiveness

10:38 - Peter’s “leftover pizza concept”

11:44 - Once diagnosed, what changed, what were you able to do, how do you keep on track?

13:30: Ref: Books!  Smart But Stuck -Thomas E. Brown and Driven To Distraction -Edward M. Hallowell [Dr. Hallowell was Peter’s first ever guest on FTN, you can hear his interview HERE!]

13:55  Ref: Peak Mind -Amishi Jha

14:36 -How do you handle deadlines?

15:49 - Talk about Imposter Syndrome?

16:55 - How can people find more about you? 

On the Web: https://www.cnbc.com/gili-malinsky-bio/

Socials: @Malinskid on Twitter & INSTA

17:42 - Thank you. Guys, as always thanks so much for subscribing! Do you have a cool friend with a great story? We’d love to hear. I'm www.petershankman.com and you can reach out anytime via email at peter@shankman.com or @petershankman on all of the socials. You can also find us at @FasterNormal on all of the socials. It really helps when you drop us a review on iTunes and of course, subscribe to the podcast if you haven’t already! As you know, the more reviews we get, the more people we can reach. Help us to show the world that ADHD is a gift, not a curse! 

19:08 - Faster Than Normal Podcast info & credits 

TRANSCRIPT via Descript and then corrected.. somewhat:

[00:00:36] Peter: Peter Shankman yo, yo, what's up everyone. Peter Shankman here from Faster Than Normal . Another episode. I am thrilled to have you with me. I am doing this again from the flop house. Reason I began started telling you about the flop house with my apartment. I had the massive water issue and, and it's finally being renovated. Uh, so I, in New York, you can't just move your stuff to another room. You actually have to move it out of your apartment. So a bunch of men came and they packed up everything I owned ever in my life, and they took it to some storage unit in Queens. I threw an air tag into a couple of boxes and I, I, I look at the air tag and remember, like, I used to have a Peloton and I used to have a bed and I used to have all this stuff. And now I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm on a couch in a one bedroom down in . Battery park city. And it's, it's a little odd. Either way life goes on as, as does Faster Than Normal!

Welcome to the stage today, Gili and I probably, I probably just pronounced that wrong, even though she told me 10 seconds ago ahead pronounce so welcome to a ADD, Malinsky who is a lead. Did I pronounce it wrong? Gili Malinsky is a lead work reporter at CNBC. All right, so we're talking about some business press today. She covers labor and employment law, US work trends and . Mental health. She contributes to outlets, including New York times, NBC news, MTV, the Village Voice, and many others. She's also a playwright. She's written the parody of the dare program, which I love because D.A.R.E did more to introduce me to drugs than ever keep me off of it. And that's called The Drugstoppers . And most recently she wrote and performed a monologue called This Is My First ADHD support group at the New York Theater Festival. I love that the monologue is based loose on her experience, getting, let, go and fired many times before discovering she had ADHD welcome to my world. She's planning to expand into a full length play. Also touching an anxiety and depression. Love that. And I love that she puts . She ends her bio with Gili's an Aquarius. Thank you for asking. welcome to FTN you're awesome. I love you already.

[00:02:19] Gili: Oh, thank you so much. Yaaaay!

[00:02:22] Peter: So I just also share with both Terriers, you went to Boston University, you graduated mm-hmm um, uh, 94 0 4, 14 years after me. Yeah. So, whatever . So you went to BU when did you get diagnosed? You get diagnosed at school or after school? After school?

[00:02:36] Gili: No, I got diagnosed when I was 33. So I got diagnosed three years ago in that 2019. Yeah. 

[00:02:41] Peter: That was about the same age as me. Um, yeah. Wow. But what was it like for you? Cause for me, everyone listened to this podcast knows I, I was. Had the social acuity of a turnip and, and, you know, barely passed by the skin of my teeth. I mean, I was at BU in the college and general studies with literally a D plus average until I got into, uh, college communications where it's like, oh, I Al I have to do is write? Okay. Here. And, you know, went to A's, but it was, it was brutal. I was on academic probation for like four years. How did you, what, what was your story like growing up? Tell us. 

[00:03:07] Gili: Sure. So I, uh, I'm the listed three grew up just that's out of Boston in a town called Newton. My brother was diagnosed with ADHD when he was pretty young. I think he was like, it must have been when he was in middle school. Um, so it was sort of always like in the background as just. Something that we knew was in the family, but I, I didn't really get too deep into it. I don't think that he and I even really talked about it until the last few years. And, um, I was always like a, you know, pretty good student was always genuinely interested in school, kind of a big nerd, really liked learning things and was always really engaged, um, by what we were doing. So. I think, and, and I learned fast, you know, even if I wasn't necessarily always paying attention, like it just, I had a good enough brain to soak up the information and I was super engaged, uh, that I just like did pretty well in school. At BU I think, I mean, definitely the stakes got higher. There was a lot more work to do. I, I don't think that, um, The concept of working harder, really computed for me. Whereas like I did pretty again, I did pretty well in high school and I think that like I did all my assignments and stuff. I mean, there were certainly things that I did very, very last minute, which, you know, our people know all about. Um, but, um, at school at when I got to BU I think like suddenly they were like really piling on the work and I, how to get myself to do like. More work to be more planned about doing the work to not leave everything to the last second, I think was really beyond me. And then I was so far, you know, so far away from my diagnosis, but it certainly wouldn't have occurred to me that something was, you know, quote unquote wrong at that point. So I think I, I was like to be honest again, because I was genuinely interested in everything and, um, you know, curious to learn, I, I. Probably like a A's, B's some C's it wasn't as good as in high school, but it was, I wasn't a terrible student. I, I could have done better though. Like had I known, had I known, um, I definitely could have done better, but, uh,

[00:04:55] Peter: I think that's the that's isn't isn't that though the, the catch phrase of anyone, with ADHD early lives I could done better. Had I known. 

[00:05:01] Gili: Yeah, totally. And I it's so interesting because like now having reported on ADHD and adults with it, like I've, I've heard of this, this thing of sort of, um, the depression that the diagnosis sets on, because there's this looking back and thinking like how much better you could have done, how much more you could have achieved off until this point? I will say I did not experience that personally, but yes. Thinking back, like I know I could have done better. 

[00:05:24] Peter: Um, you know, it's interesting. Go ahead. Go ahead. No, no, no, please. Yeah. What's interesting about that is I was, I was about to comment that neither have, I, I haven't either. Um, I am very much of the belief and look, maybe this is just something I've been telling myself to, to, to, to, you know, get through it. But I am of the belief that. All the crap that I had to put up with in high school, in college, almost failing out, having very few friends, being that awkward. I am a, I, I, everyone says, what would you go back and change? I wouldn't change a thing. Yeah. Cause I'm like the believe that everything that, that I got everything, I survived, everything. I learned how to do everything that brought me to this moment to is, is what got me to where I am right now. All that. I mean, it was a nightmare. I wouldn't wish some of those days coming home and just crying myself sleep from weeks on end. I wouldn't wish that on anyone, but yeah, I, I believed that I wouldn't be anywhere near whatever level of success I've reached in my life had it not been for ADHD. 

[00:06:16] Gili: Totally. Yeah. That resonates so much. Uh, yeah. And which I, and that actually like brings me to, um, the sort of work world, which is really where I started getting into trouble. Um, because I also yeah. Went through a lot of hardship when I came to that. So, so yeah, I think, um, went to school for journalism, kind of always knew that that the very least I wanted to start my career as a writer there. Um, you know, don't see an end insight right now, really love being a journalist, but, um, yes, I've definitely been dabbling with other things, but, um, I started, you know, I was like freelancing for a lot of these publications. Some of them you read in my bio and then, um, started getting staff, writing gigs at, you know, major media outlets. Um, and I kept fucking up, like, so, you know, I, uh, was just getting super overwhelmed. They were giving me these like very straightforward tasks and it was just like, my brain could not handle them. It could not organize them, you know, could not help me like do them in methodical ways. It would. So much information all at once. And like, all I could do was just sit in my computer and stare at my email or look at YouTube. Like it was just, it was so, too much, too much all at once. Um, you know, I would miss a lot of deadlines and, uh, you know, I would like prefer to do the easier tasks and the harder ones that were really like the crux of the job anyway. Um, and so, um, I ended up getting let go. You know, and it's, oh, there's, you know, you get, let go for lots of reasons, but, but certainly like looking back, I know that that played into it, um, because I can see the fuckups that I made along the way, you know, this happened time and time again. And like you said, like it, you know, It's really heartbreaking. I think like we live in this very individualistic society that tells us if something like that happens, it's only your fault. Um, you know, and if it keeps happening then, like, what is the, what is the conclusion that I can come to? Like other than that I'm a fuck up myself, you know, that something is deeply broken and wrong with me. Yeah. Um, and so, yeah, it was very miserable. I was broke, um, and I felt like an idiot and I, I, I hated myself. Um, and then I think after the, I don't remember what, how many times this happened before I finally, uh, was talking to my therapist and was telling her that I have this like motivation thing at work, or like four or five months into a job. Like I just lose all motivation and it's I want the job. I always want the job, but I'm just like sitting there. Like trying to force myself, trying to, will myself to do the work. And like, everything is slower. And I I'm like going home and reading productivity hack articles and like nothing works. Um, and she was like, you know, that could be ADHD. Like, have you been tested for that? Uh, and I said, no, uh, I haven't, my brother has it. Uh, but no, I that's. That's something that it, you know, I've gotten tested for. Um, and I did. And lo and behold, I have it. 

[00:09:03] Peter: nice to put a name to everything that you've experienced 

[00:09:05] Gili: Well, that's the thing, is that like, for me having a name, like even before I was officially diagnosed just that morning when she said that I might have it, like I cried the rest of the morning because it was. Oh like, yes, exactly. This has a name. If this is what it is, it has a name. Um, I'm not crazy. There is something about me because you know, you can see the people around you are functioning differently, that they're processing information differently from you and that you just can't get yourself to work in the same way. And suddenly it was like, oh, I'm not crazy. Like, there really is something in my brain that is making it difficult for me to, to perform in the, you know, in the same way that they are. And also like maybe I can actually forgive myself. Like that was the big thing for me. I think like it was less looking back and being really upset at everything you could have done and more like, oh, like maybe I don't have to have this growing anger inside of me, this growing self hatred. And I can kind of just start to let that go.

[00:10:02] Peter: It's funny. I, I, I, I, I try to, I make light of that. Sometimes I make light of the fact that what you said specifically about how you are, uh, you know, other people do things and don't seem to have the same problems that you do, and you're watching them do these things. And I think that I've always had that and it's always been frustra, even knowing what I have and knowing that the things I do. Work. Right. Like, you know, I get up at four in the morning to exercise before my day mm-hmm so I have the Dopamine I needed, but every once in, so while I'm like, God damn it, why do I have to do that? Why do people do, why can people sleep in until six or seven, then just go to work and be on. And, you know, but I always make a joke out of it. I talk about, you know, I call it the leftover pizza concept that, that, that. Other people, they work a full day. They come home. They, I don't wanna cook 'em so they order a pizza. They eat order pizza. They have two slices. They put the rest of in the fridge. That's leftover pizza. Yeah. Never had leftover pizza in my fucking life. that's that's that's not a thing. I order a pizza. I eat the pizza. Yeah. And you know, for me, it's the same thing with alcohol, right. So I'm very aware. I quit for several years. I'm very aware of how I drank. I mm-hmm, maybe, maybe a few times a year in very specific conditions with very specific people. Um, because it's not one. Right. And so every once in a while I get a little frustrated, you know, how come they get to do this in I and I don't. Mm. Um, but then I think about it, I'm like, well, they also don't have the faster brain goodness. Right. They, you know, they haven't started and sold three companies by 40. They haven't mm-hmm , you know, done things like that. So, so, so, so ya try to find the benefit, but yeah, every once in a while, it's, it's very, very frustrating, but let's talk for a second because. Once you got diagnosed, right? Mm-hmm I I'm sure that you've been putting things into play. Same way. I did. Same way. Almost everyone does. You've been putting things into play subconsciously to allow yourself to get through, to, to work, to get on deadline and things like that. Once you got diagnosed here, you are on a high pressure job with deadlines mm-hmm um, once you got diagnosed, what changed and what were you able to do? Cuz obviously you're you let's see CNBC, they haven't fired you today and said, you're, you know, you can't do this. So tell us about the kind of things I think this will interest the audience. Tell us about the kinda things you put into play. What are your tips and tricks to make sure you don't go down the wrong road. I mean, for Christ sake, you have to do, you know, half your job is research, right? Mm-hmm half your job is there's a, how do you not wind up eight hours later on Wikipedia looking up Roman sewage canals, having nothing to do with your original story. 

[00:12:10] Gili: Wow. That was that's like Tuesday. No, um, no, totally. um, no, no, no, totally. \Um, so yeah, it's a great question. I mean, for me, I think the biggest thing was I just started learning about it immediately and like equipping myself with knowledge. And so I started reading. I read, um, there's one called smart, but stuck. Um, which I read and then, uh, driven to distraction is another one I read recently. And one thing that these things did for that these books did for me is by, is like, I, I was reading stories of other people who have this neurological disorder as well, and seeing myself in them and feeling again, like less alone and more okay. Um, and so I think. Again, that, that anger and that self hatred that I think in and of itself was a distraction kind of started to dissipate and created space for me to be able to focus better. Um, but that was the first thing is I just kind of started learning about what this is. Um, I think I kind of messed around a little bit with Adderall. Like I was like trying, I tried a little bit, but, but I think, you know, I was. The psychiatrist I said, said I have mild ADHD, you know, whatever that means. So, so I don't know if it was because the Adderall doses that I tried, like didn't really work for me or whatever it was, but I decided that I was gonna just try to make do without them, without that, you know, without medication mm-hmm . Um, but, um, yeah, I mean, so have always worked out but have started, um, but started doing it first thing in the morning. Um, I, I was, yeah, I was like, have always kind of messed around with doing it sometimes throughout the day, but that has always been part of my routine. Um, and definitely find that that's an amazing release first thing in the morning. Um, I, as of the last six months, I've also been doing some mindfulness meditation for like 12 minutes when I first wake up, I read, um, this book called peak mind, um, by, um, a researcher and professor in Miami at university of Miami. I mean, Amishi Jha and she, the whole book is about the attention system in the brain. Um, you know, and she touches on ADHD and of course, like there's no real fix for this brain, but there are, there are methods to, um, sharpen, I guess, some components of it. What meditation for me has helped with has just been, um, to have a growing awareness of where my mind is. And so maybe I can't stop it from going, you know, in a trillion directions, basically every 30 seconds. But at the very least I have more of an awareness of where it is and I. I can reel it back to what it needs to be doing. Like that's just something that, you know, that's a skill that has really helped me. 

[00:14:35] Peter: No question. What do you, um, how are, how do you handle deadlines? 

[00:14:39] Gili: It's yeah, also such a great question. Cause I have them every day. Part of it is the, you know, the, so I actually got hired at CNBC about four months after I got diagnosed. Um, and so at that point I had already sort of started the process of like learning what this isn't. How do I work with the brain that I have, um, It just worked out that I was in a really supportive system. And so my, you know, shout out to Kelly Grant, Esther Bloom, um, Jenna Goudreau , these are my editors and now Hannah Howard, they're, they're very, um, supportive. They're very open. They're very welcoming, you know, and. You know, having that external motivation is extremely helpful in, and getting me to continue to be motivated to get my work done. But I think what happened by nature too, is like the longer you do something, the better at it, you get. Right? And so I have learned, you know, by being in this environment where I'm super supported. To do my job very quickly, you know, to be a better writer to say, this is good enough, you know? Good enough is, that's what I have. So yeah. Good enough is super helpful for deadlines. Um, cause it's easy to be a perfectionist, like what you want is to give them the best, but it doesn't matter. Good enough is like that will just have to suffice. Um, yeah. I don't know. Does that answer? I can think of other things. 

[00:15:49] Peter: Yeah. Perfectly last, last question. Yeah. Talk about imposter syndrome. 

[00:15:53] Gili: No. 

Imposter syndrome, you talk about, about syndrome, huh? imposter syndrome. Um, 

[00:15:59] Peter: Hmm. Do you have it, does it affect you? How do you do? Hmm, 

[00:16:03] Gili: I mean, sure. Of course. Like I see lots of people around me, you know, at a level of success that I would love that I would love to be at. Um, but. I, you know, I have been blessed with a very big ego

[00:16:16] Peter: Haaah! Spectacular! 

[00:16:20] Gili: No, I think, um, I think to be honest with you, like, um, yeah, I, I come from a very supportive environment. My parents are, are super loving and supportive. And so I think that I do have some level of like self confidence. Um, That has really helped, like push me through, even in the moments where I was really failing. Um, I mean, I, I get jealous of people. Of course I do, but, but I somehow I think my Ambi, my ambition, um, you know, and just my, like my hunger to, to, to create, um, has just, you know, pushed me through even whatever insecurities I might have had. 

[00:16:54] Peter: Awesome. I love it. I love it. Yeah. Wow. This has been amazing. Um, how could people find you tell, tell us where you are, uh, Gil, where, where you go, what your Instagrams are, uh, whatever, your favorite type of pizza, whatever.

[00:17:07] Gili: Oh, favorite type of pizza? Uh, well, I. I mean, I like French fries better than pizza. I will just say I'm a French fries person, even more than a pizza person. So you'll 

[00:17:13] Peter: and we're done here guys. Thanks for listening. It's been a pleasure. We'll talk. 

[00:17:18] Gili: sorry. I like pizza, but French fries would like too much ketchup. That's my go to junk food. I love it. I love it. People can find me on Twitter and Instagram, um, at Molin kids. So M a L I N S K I D. That's my handle. 

[00:17:33] Peter: Yeah, a L L I I'm. I'm just putting it in for the M a L I M

[00:17:37] Gili: M a L I N. S K I D so my last name is Malinski gotcha. And my, yeah, my handles in Alinski. Yeah. I, I post like all my articles and all my stuff on this, so 

[00:17:46] Peter: very cool. Guys what a pleasure. Thank you so much. I really appreciate you taking the time. This was a great interview. Um, thank you. It gives people hope. I mean, I, I remember, um, My, you know, again, being a diagnosed I remember in college, I had a photo photojournalism professor who told me that I'd never make it. I should probably go to something boring like accounting. Said I'd never make it as a journalist. And, uh, when, when I was the first ever, uh, digital journalist to cover the democratic Republican conventions in 1996, I photocopied my press pass, uh, and sent him, sent it to him and said, kind of doing terribly .Hope you're well. That was a nice, that was a nice feeling.

[00:18:21] Gili: Um, a nice little FU. 

[00:18:22] Peter: Indeed really. You probably know the journal, the professor too. Isn't comp. Really appreciate you being here. We will have you back. Most definitely. This was a pleasure. We'll definitely have you back. 

[00:18:32] Gili: Thank you so much. This was delightful. Thank you. I really appreciate it. Peter. 

[00:18:35] Peter: Awesome stuff. Most definitely

[00:19:08]Credits: You've been listening to the Faster Than Normal podcast. We're available on iTunes, Stitcher and Google play and of course at www.FasterThanNormal.com I'm your host, Peter Shankman and you can find me at shankman.com and @petershankman on all of the socials. If you like what you've heard, why not head over to your favorite podcast platform of choice and leave us a review, come more people who leave positive reviews, the more the podcast has shown, and the more people we can help understand that ADHD is a gift, not a curse. Opening and closing themes were composed and produced by Steven Byrom who also produces this podcast, and the opening introduction was recorded by Bernie Wagenblast. Thank you so much for listening. We'll see you next week!

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